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yellowjacket
25th February 2003, 19:46
An earlier thread on the General section has show that plenty of people spend their hard earned cash on private kit.
Hopefully it turns out to be useful.
To prevent people making the same mistakes, what are the purchases you made that turned out to be a complete waste of money?

I'll nominate HITEC Magnum Classic boots. £50 three years ago. Look fine, but trainers will keep your feet drier. Probably good for barracks, but definitely not on the ground.

Erwin
25th February 2003, 21:01
:( I don't mean to be a killjoy but i'd nominate a lot of the shite that some people have posted on lists.
E.G.-
Goretex socks - if you get wet feet you do one of two (1) Change your socks at
the next opportunity or (2) grin & bear it.Thats what soldiering's about!!

NBC suits & respirators - depending on the threat level & the level of warning they're next to useless & even in an NBC enviroment they would degrade at an alarming rate E.G - under combat conditions.Even after that they are only useful for a very limited time frame( 24 - 48Hrs).

GPS's - nine times out of ten the batteries go or they are not calibrated correctly or the operator can't use it!!Don't waste your well earned money on one as a compass,map & the knowledge to go with it are better!

Well thats a starter from me there is a lot more i just can't remember.But don't forget the maxim - Do you REALLY need it??
:D

Bravo20
26th February 2003, 10:38
Couldn't agree more Erwin, except maybe for the Gortex socks, warm and wet is always better than cold and wet.

Loque
26th February 2003, 10:42
Well I'll definately have to say that those big ass survival knifes are rubbish, the may look cool but that's about it. The most useful piece of kit I have is my trusty swiss army knife, well worth the money. A windproof lighter is also were useful for ligthing hexi-tablets, I go overkill though and use a gas-powered soldering iron somtimes (it beats the hell out of those lighthouse matches from the ratpack).
Another useless piece of kit would be those cammo compacts, the only useful thing in them is the mirror, the cammo is crap and runs off your face and there isn't enough of it. Also those mini-tinopeners you know the ones,a rectangular piece of steel with hinged barb on them... absolute rubbish.
GPS - Expensive and a waste of money, compass and map is all you should need, yeah and common sense come in useful aswell.
The more junk you have on the ground the more you have to carry. (Does anyone remember that scene in Platoon where charlie sheen collapses from carrying too much unnecessary gear ?)
Anyway I'm sure plenty of other people have examples of impulse-buy crap they thought would come in useful

yellowjacket
26th February 2003, 11:32
Re; the socks Erwin, any fool can be uncomfortable.

Privately purchased NBC gear is a bit of a joke allright, but it's more of a joke that it's not issued, does any other army in the western world not give it's reservists NBC kit?

For people who need to know where they're going a GPS can be a lifesaver. Compasses don't work all that well in poor visibility. Obviously knowing how to use them is handy, they shouldn't be totally relied on and are definitely not a replacement for compass & map, but they are a very useful adjunct.

T.I.M.
26th February 2003, 14:59
Pro's

keep your feet dry (in therory)

Con's

Once water get;s in it stays in,
gortex doesn't alow your feet to breath, so they sweat somthing fearce!
the smell out of them after a 24-48 out on the ground is "undesireable"
i plain dont find them comfortable! or have a size to fit me correctly.

*NOTE
in my experience.

yellowjacket
26th February 2003, 15:06
Originally posted by T.I.M.
Once water get;s in it stays in,
gortex doesn't alow your feet to breath, so they sweat somthing fearce!
the smell out of them after a 24-48 out on the ground is "undesireable"
i plain dont find them comfortable! or have a size to fit me correctly. [/B]

Eh, that's the whole point of Goretex, are you sure someone didn't sell you two condoms and tell you they were goretex socks?
:D :D

Loque
26th February 2003, 15:09
New goretex socks... ribbed for you pleasure!

LordFlash
26th February 2003, 15:22
Ha ha, everyone point at T.I.M and laugh!!!

... sorry T.I.M, me bad

Come-quickly
26th February 2003, 15:31
No laugh away

old rec
26th February 2003, 16:20
T.I.M. where did you buy those socks?



Must stay clear of that place, ha ha:D

yellowjacket
26th February 2003, 16:21
Have moved the GPS posts to a more relevant thread here (http://www.irishmilitaryonline.com/board/showthread.php?s=&threadid=371).

²°°³Soldier
26th February 2003, 16:23
I suppose it depends on why you want a GPS. Is it to simply have the gucci gear or you have a real reason to use it?

Any Arty person involved with either the Command Post or G Party would find a GPS a great piece of kit and useful... but as pointed out you need to know how to use it correctly and your knowledge of the manual methods of locating you position and navigation should be first rate - technology can let you down.

FMolloy
26th February 2003, 16:32
He didn't get them from me anyway!

T.I.M.
26th February 2003, 16:45
Muppets all!

Delta
26th February 2003, 16:58
I had the goretex socks for ages and they kept me very dry and I didnt have the problems that come with no air getting into the boots. They were well worth the money (around 15-20?).

Since then I got meindl boots, the tall ones, and they are brilliant. I go walking a bit in a messy mountainy place near home and I havent had any trouble with them doing that, or in the middle of a platoon in attack through a stream. Very expensive but nice :)

As for the lad who reckoned we should grin and bear the wet feet or else change the socks? Its people that do those things that I normally end up carrying back to the truck to be sent home injured.

If goretex socks can keep you dry (and they will) and you can afford them, they are a good investment.

Anyone who thinks its good to be grinning and bearing the wet has been watching too much Rambo.

Loque
26th February 2003, 17:16
I agree, an army marches on it's feet not it's stomach, if you don't look after your feet properly you may become a liability rather than an asset. When you're out on the ground bring spare pairs of dry socks and foot powder. Take off your boots if you get the chance to let air at the skin i.e. when at a basecamp. Try to avoid blisters and sores on the feet, a good friend of mine got sent off an SNCO's course we were on because he got a foot infection and severe blistering. A decent set of boots is essential meindl or ecco mountaineering boots are excellent, as long as they are black no one will object to you wearing them.

Erwin
26th February 2003, 20:41
:o Just to clarify a point i mentioned earlier.
In my own experience i don't see the need to go & buy gortex socks.The point i was trying to make was that its all well & good having the Gucci gear but do you really need it?The socks were an example.Up to the present time i've only used issue socks & my own boots at best.All through various courses,unit exercises,operations & overseas training which involves a lot of tabbing & outdoor work in all weathers, i've looked after my feet through changing socks as often as possible,looking after my footwear & generally using the head.What i didn't mean was that u just tab along without changing your socks or drying your feet & so ensuring the onset of foot trouble, but to remember you won't always have the gortex socks on or get to change your socks when you want & so you'd have to grin & bear it then.Its a fact of life when you're out on the ground you get cold wet & hungry & these are just the nature of the beast,so you just put up with it & get on with the task in hand!!
I'm not a sadist or a Johnny Rambo although i did enjoy first blood,but i am a realist & in the real world on the ground you don't always get to do what you intend or that lovely bit of Gucci kit you thought would be ideal turns out to be total SHITE!!Trust me i've seen lads go tits up over this kind of crap.
Hoping that it wasn't too long winded or anything!!:D

FMolloy
26th February 2003, 20:59
You know what they say: "any sod can be uncomfortable". The Goretex socks aren't exactly in the same category as GPS, they're a relatively inexpensive piece of kit that's currently on issue to British forces.

Erwin
26th February 2003, 21:01
Lets just put it down to personal preference & experience??Please??:confused:

FMolloy
26th February 2003, 21:01
If the DoD didn't see the advantage of waterproof & breathable footware they wouldn't have gotten the Matterhorns.

Erwin
26th February 2003, 21:05
I would agree on that they are fairly good alright,but not the dogs b***ocks!!

Bravo20
27th February 2003, 09:57
Enough allready! I think the socks issue has been done to death. What about camping gas stoves.... a bit heavy and there maybe a saftey issue?

Thorpe
27th February 2003, 10:23
Loque, I would slightly dissagree with one point. An army does march on its stomach. Without food for a day or two on the ground you became more of a liability that if your feet are in bad shape. Although it is important to have your feet in good nick for march long distances, you can walk through the pain barrier and keep goin once your in a rhythm, you can not march if you dont have the energy from food to do so.
I will admit I do have a pair of ex-british army combat boot that my cousin gave me and I sware by them.;)

Loque
27th February 2003, 10:33
Yeah you're right, I should have said that an army marches on it's feet as well as it's stomach. You're not going to get very far on an empty stomach. The best pair of boots are the ones you're most comforable with be they standard issue or otherwise but if you buy expensive brand-name boots you det the assurance of quality.

Khumbu
27th February 2003, 10:37
I think a camping stove is a good idea, although some people would argue that it may be bulky and dangerous.
I got a "coleman" dual stove just recently. Its the best camping item i have gotten in a long while. It doesnt use gas. it can burn petrol, methylated spirits, parafin and kerosene, personally i use "white" gas. The way the stove works is that you pour the fuel into the canister, then pump air into the canister to pressurise the liquid. open the valve and a very fine spray of fuel squirts out the top, then you light. ............
Its absolutely amazing, i can boil a pot of water in 3 minutes (large mess tin), a large cooking pot takes about 5 minutes.

i know it sounds like a complicated stove but its not. The stove looks exactly like any other gas stove, and is about the same size. The small finger pump is attached to it. it all comes in a small neat little package.
it is extremly safe. Another advantage is that they are allowed in your luggage in planes, the conventional gas stoves are confiscated when travelling as they are not allowed on planes, ie the pressurised stove could explode, but not my new "coleman". well anyway..... enough ranting and raving from me.....

LordFlash
27th February 2003, 11:06
That really does sound impressive.
How much did it set you back?
And where did you get it?

oh and how much does it weigh?

Loque
27th February 2003, 11:29
Khumbu, you're not trying to flog a few of these all singing all dancing coleman cookers are you ?

Khumbu
27th February 2003, 16:50
Got mine in a camping shop, although they are not very common. People seem to like to stick with the conventional propane/butane stoves with the removeable canisters, these are relatively cheap around 25 euro. The coleman stoves start at around 80 euro, depending on the model. Mine is a "sportster 2".
And NO im not trying to sell them... ha ha..... Love my new one, is a real nice treat to use. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with the conventional ones. ........

Loque
27th February 2003, 17:03
It's expensive at 80 euro but if it is durable it might be worth the investment, those hexi-cookers are pretty crap, better than nothing but still crap nontheless. What size are these cookers compared to the hexi's ?
I suppose the likes of the great outdoors or millets stock them, if these colmen stoves can fit in the webbing comfortably then they might warrant some spending.

The Fonz
27th February 2003, 19:25
Well i have gore-tex socks but i use on my dirt bike when i go out in the mountain thats all there good for i'd never use out on the ground theres no point your never out long enough, the worst bit of gucci kit i've seen people wearing is the Tactial-Vest used by Counter-Terrorist and SWAT teams, they hold about 12 Steyr mags, 6 pistol mags, slits for Smoke and Flashbang granedes, and shotgun shell. Now if some here ownes one please tell when you'll get that much ammo and where you would use it, i'll stand corrected if your in the ARW!!!

Erwin
27th February 2003, 22:38
Well i have to agree,i've seen a few gimps wearing these vests or chest rigs & they look loke cabbages.All it says is " LOOK AT ME,I'M A TIT!!" :D

Bravo20
28th February 2003, 10:31
Fonz, what is your avatar?

Loque
28th February 2003, 11:46
looks like a delta force flash nut I'm not certain

T.I.M.
28th February 2003, 15:11
the Fonz's avatar is the delta one.....but i think its from a game?!

as for the chest rig, i have one....
its irish pattern dpm and its the bees wax for doing F.I.B.U.A., as plce gets caught on objects. anybody who has done F.I.B.U.A. will know quite well that your webbing gats caught 8 times out of 10 upon entery of a target house!...unless you made your own entry hole ala 84mm HE round,

long story short... the chest rig is good, the Tactical vest on the other hand is crap!

FMolloy
28th February 2003, 15:19
Chest rigs are also very handy for the likes of security parties and guard, when you're not going to carry much more than ammo & a water bottle.

Loque
28th February 2003, 15:25
The avatar maybe from one of Novalogic's delta force series of games.
The chest-rig would make sense alright, it does make ammo very accessable, as for the tac-vest well, unless it doubles as a bodywarmer it's pretty pointless. I remember reading in Guns and Ammo once an advertisement for "Thunder Pants", what are they, well they are underware with integrated holsters and ammo pouches ! , probably sold like hotcakes in the states. Not suggesting that anyone in the RDF would be misguided to invest in a pair of these!

FMolloy
28th February 2003, 15:43
I'm sure tac-vests are great, but the only people who are going to get any use out of them are PDF heads. For them it may be a worthwhile investment, but no-one in the FCA has an excuse.

T.I.M.
28th February 2003, 16:44
I'm sure tac-vests are great, but the only people who are going to get any use out of them are PDF heads. For them it may be a worthwhile investment, but no-one in the FCA has an excuse.



And thats why i have a "CHEST RIG" and not a "TAC VEST"

Khumbu
3rd March 2003, 11:18
loque, totally agree with you about the hexi stoves, crap, but they do the job they are intended for... i.e using for a weekend only.... In my opinion, a stove is only worth bringing if you are gonna be on the ground for more than a couple of days. I got mine coz i have a use for it, i use it for camping. I once brought a small gas camp stove on tactics..... never again...... everybody was queing up to use it once i had finished with it, i didnt get a moments peace, i was constantly putting it in/out of my web gear.... Another thing, if you use a gas stove you will be finished cookin before anyone else, thats mean you get a shorter break than everyone else, coz while they are taking 1/2 an hour for "din dins" you have to go back out on sentry 10 minutes later.

FCA Trooper
8th March 2003, 00:11
eh....goin back a few posts,when did any RDF unit ever do FIBUA training? ive never heard of it..

T.I.M.
8th March 2003, 00:49
The 7th bn have been doing F.I.B.U.A. for about 2 years now.......