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  1. #1
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    *opens can of worms a bit further*

    Should there be a reserve, company-strength marine detachment also Morph?

    *Also backs away from keyboard*

  2. #2
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    Goes without saying really...

    Irish Marines battle cry

    "UpYaboyya!"

    Welcome to the suck
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  3. #3
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    Roll on the next war and we can try it out.

    As for the naval detachment of ground pounders..you may think you are entering the realms of fanatasy but no..it was given some consideration for a period during the 80's that the naval Service would develop its own style ranger wing to insert NGOs..do all the snaeky bits..specialised boardings..and ship hijackings..oil rigs etc..was put forward by a very vsionary commander at the time but was knocked at an early stage.

    So while to some it may seem like a little wet dream..it seems others were trying to get the wheels in motion...good or bad thing..feasible....workable..we'll never know but it was on the table briefly.
    Just visiting

  4. #4
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    Irish Navy Seals?
    Rón múirí na h'Eireann!???
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  5. #5
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    Cue barks and slapping of fins...
    seriously, though, it wouldn't be beyond the bounds of reality to put even a small amount of "Marines" onto the present ships, with an establishment of, say, a company, over eight vessels.they could do all the usual Marine tasks such as gunnery, fighting in Cobh, small boat handling, fighting in Killybegs, shore-parties, drunken parties,etc
    regards
    GttC

  6. #6
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    Hey,

    If and when the new Drogheda international port goes in in Balbriggan, Maybe the Navy will set up a base there too? Id love to join the Irish Marines then. You had me at mentions of such activities as drunk, party and fight. Sounds like the reserves already (tongue in cheek!)
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  7. #7
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    What does your local TD have to say about the port, Morph?
    "Gentlemen, you can’t fight in here...this is the War Room!"

  8. #8
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    It wasn't a marines thing..it was naval personel training to do things in a naval role as a priority that was only seconadry to the wing...Marines are naval infantry...well years gone by they were put on ships to protect officers from the crew.....

    The said commanders idea wasn't bad..but those in charge at the time lacked the foresight..also the navy lacked the bods and resources to sort it out...

    I still think it to be an option....if funding and interest can be found.
    Just visiting

  9. #9
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    But is the NS not stretched enough as it is personnel- wise?
    "Gentlemen, you can’t fight in here...this is the War Room!"

  10. #10
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    Ah not enough bods my ar$e.

    Just create an extra company of infantry in cork and get the stranger wing along with Naval boarding parties etc to train them as marine commandos.

    We probably dont need such a company all year round though, correct me if im wrong?

    Some local TD's arent too happy about it as they are building it in an area known as cromwells harbour. He apparently came to land in this spot and constructed sea breaks to provide a sheltered bay for future ships, then it was disused, there are no piers and at first sight it appears as a natural bay. All most people are concerned about (and i stress these arent locals as most blow ins dont even know we have a coastline) are whether this will line their pockets property price wise in the future.
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  11. #11
    Private 3* Sea Toby's Avatar
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    I think the naval service should concentrate on its naval duties, increasing its usefulness to the country. For example, being able to hunt and discard mines, oceanographic and hydrographic surveys. There is much more the navy can do better if the navy had better equipment and ships.

    While I hate to bring up the New Zealand navy, the Kiwis do have a replenishment ship, a hydrographic/oceanographic ship, and a diving tender Ireland don't. I think Ireland would be better off with a more balanced fleet than just a fishery protection fleet.

    Outside of a sealift multi-role ship, I don't see the need for a marine force or frigates, nor a replenishment ship either. But a diving tender would be useful.
    Last edited by Sea Toby; 15th February 2007 at 22:12.

  12. #12
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    'Ah not enough bods my ar$e.'

    whilst your are talking through it talk amoment out to listen. The concept was proposed in 1985...its not a current consideration..I only brought it up becuse it had been considered in the past...the role was taken seriously as the ARW were streched thin in other areas...

    it never got off the ground as there were to many other considerations..yes bodies were very thin on the ground back in the bad old days.....there was atwo year ban on recruiting and promotions at the time..and ships which had been out of service for tow and a half years were not replaced until late 1988.

    in the DF on the whole there was avery deep air of stagnation throughout the DF....money was tight..and every branch of the DF suffered..the NS was no different

    PRE PDFORRA days....easy for some to have an unrealitic view..and I'm sure some here could rememeber worse times..but to others...don't bother to crticize just because you think you know.
    Just visiting

  13. #13
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Toby View Post
    I think the naval service should concentrate on its naval duties, increasing its usefulness to the country. For example, being able to hunt and discard mines, oceanographic and hydrographic surveys. There is much more the navy can do better if the navy had better equipment and ships.
    The Hunting of mines is a task no longer carried out effectively by ship.If done by ship, it requires a very specialised expensive equipment fit, for something not done operationally since the last war.Unmanned vessels or a helicopter, towing a mine clearing sled on the surface are more often used for the minesweeping role. However frequently our navy are called to dispose of mines found in the nets of trawlers, and these are disposed of effectively. Hydrographic survey has been carried out quite efficiently by the Marine Institute using their Research ships, Celtic Explorer and Celtic voyager

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Toby View Post
    While I hate to bring up the New Zealand navy, the Kiwis do have a replenishment ship, a hydrographic/oceanographic ship, and a diving tender Ireland don't. I think Ireland would be better off with a more balanced fleet than just a fishery protection fleet.
    They have a replenishment ship because the Gas Turbines of the Meko frigates, and the Recently retired Leander were Gas Guzzlers. Our fleet has some of the most fuel efficient, longest range ships you could find. The Kiwi Diving tender is little more than a North Sea support ship painted Grey. We have the same skill level amongs all our naval divers, who are dispersed among each of the fleets eight ships, available wherever they are needed, in addition to a unit based ashore, capable of being deployed anywhere, including inland to inland waterways.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Toby View Post
    Outside of a sealift multi-role ship, I don't see the need for a marine force or frigates, nor a replenishment ship either. But a diving tender would be useful.
    The ILS ship Grainuaile operated quite effectively in the role of diving support in the recent recovery attempts, and it too is a state asset. The one role we are missing, which you missed too is that of an Emergency Towing vessel. But thats bringing the thread way off on a tangent. Again.

    Do we train an army unit to operate as part of a Naval infantry, or do we train a naval unit to operate as part of the Army?

  14. #14
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    Train an army unit to operate with the navy. maybe one company from each BATT spending a couple of months on attachment to the navy per year?
    Last edited by morpheus; 16th February 2007 at 11:40.
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  15. #15
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Bat?

  16. #16
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    Where in the name of jaysus could the NS accomadate a battalion.......platoon size is difficult enough to deal with....but then again when it comes to that size force it has already been exercised on a regular basis even with the Reserves.
    Just visiting

  17. #17
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    Do think the Irish Navy should have a marine corps?

    Do you think that the Irish Defence Force should have a specialy desighned unit to carry out combat at sea as well as being able to carry out amphibious landings and other ground roles like the US Marines or the Royal Marines?

  18. #18
    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    MOD: This person is new so careful with any language that may be interpreted as insulting

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  20. #19
    CQMS jack nastyface's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomh903 View Post
    Do you think that the Irish Defence Force should have a specialy desighned unit to carry out combat at sea as well as being able to carry out amphibious landings and other ground roles like the US Marines or the Royal Marines?
    No.

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  22. #20
    Lower than a snakes balls Duffman's Avatar
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    Welcome aboard Tom.

    Nope in its role as a Defence force. The DF would have no real reason to be doing any amphibious landings. The NS have boarding parties that are used on intership missions that are quite good at their jobs judging by the stats that came out recently.
    "Many a time a man's mouth broke his nose"

    "Don't waste money buying expensive binoculars. Simply stand next to the object you wish to view."

  23. #21
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    thank you

  24. #22
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    hello Tom and welcome to IMO.

    i totally support having DFI Marines in the NS.

    it offers a capability that can not only be used offensively - but for the greater good and the DFI could get involved in more operations and offer a helping hand in certain situations and perhaps some humanitarian operations.

    just my initial thoughts.
    RGJ

    ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

    The Rifles

  25. #23
    CQMS SpudGunner's Avatar
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    I like the idea. As the NS role expands I do think a dedicated " naval infantry " element could be considered. A similar kernel popped in what I laughingly refer to as my mind around the time of the Liberian recce.

    Blue Sky/Water thinking perhaps.

    I'm new to the forum also but the auld epidermis is made for survivability. Fire at will.

  26. #24
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    Here's my armchair general opinion.
    I would say yes. Marines of all countries are well know for their aggressiveness and shock troops status. The DF has your ordinary soldier/seaman and then at the other end Rangers but there is no medium. A company or even a battalion sized group of marines would be achievable.
    Have the standards set higher, better fitness, more "hardcore".

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  28. #25
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    But we have no need for an offensive role RGJ...I do agree with humanitarian ops though I don't think the benefits would be worth the cost (landing craft, adapted ships, adapted vehicles...)
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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