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  • The Piracy map is the tip of the iceberg.

    I was recently talking to my uncle, a deep-sea sailor, about this.

    They can exoect to be attacked 2-3 times on any voyage. In general the crew are robbed but occasionally the cargo is the target.

    The idea of the cannon on deck is very appealing but as illegal as the pirates. There is no protection for the sailors from any naval service or international law. However the pirates are protected by the governments that harbour their vessels.
    Without supplies no army is brave.

    —Frederick the Great,

    Instructions to his Generals, 1747

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    • I'm assuming that the rise in piracy is as a result of the cold war ending and Navies being downsized?
      Meh.

      Comment


      • Or it could be that a country having no tangible form of government for 17 years,

        with a complete lack of any natural resources other than easy and extensive proliferation of weapons,

        is strategically located at one of the largest economic choke points of the world

        and some of its inhabitants are seizing an opportunity.
        "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

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        • Excuse my ignorance on this matter but if ships are constantly being attacked then why can't they take appropriate steps to defend themselves?
          They may not need a cannon but certainly a .5 or a couple of GPMG's.
          What's the point of having a Master at Arms if you don't have any guns on board or has this rank been dropped?
          If they are in international waters are they governed by international maritime law and who enforces it?

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          • According to The United Nations "Convention of the Law of the Sea:

            "Incidents of piracy and armed robbery in the territorial sea or in a port areas are perceived as crimes against the state and thus subject to its national laws. The Convention permits a coastal State to exercise the right of hot pursuit of a foreign ship if its competent authorities have good reason to believe that the ship has violated the laws and regulations of the coastal State. Hot pursuit must be commenced when the foreign ship or one of its boats is within the internal waters, the archipelagic waters, the territorial sea or the contiguous zone of the pursuing State, and may only be continued outside the territorial sea or the contiguous zone if the pursuit has not been interrupted. Once it is broken off it cannot be resumed. The right of hot pursuit ceases as soon as the ship pursued enters the territorial sea of its own State or of a third State."

            Articles 100-107 of the United Nations "Convention of the Law of the Sea state that:

            "On the high seas, or in any other place outside the jurisdiction of any State, every State may seize a pirate ship or aircraft, or a ship or aircraft taken by piracy and under the control of pirates, and arrest the persons and seize the property on board. The courts of the State which carried out the seizure may decide upon the penalties to be imposed, and may also determine the action to be taken with regard to the ships, aircraft or property, subject to the rights of third parties acting in good faith."

            So

            1. Somalia needs an effective government to publish and sign into law, effective laws and penalties governing piracy in its waters, and an ability to enforce them effectively.

            2. Any pirates arrested in international waters by states are subjected to their own laws and penalties regarding piracy. They do not have to turn them over to their nation state.

            3. An internationally agreed maritime law needs to be created governing the installation and use of self defence mechanisms on board ships transiting known pirate waters, both lethal and non-lethal.
            "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

            Comment


            • So. A Tico-class and an Arleigh Burke class, two of the most powerful ships in the world can't solve this problem ?

              Where the hell are the SEAL teams ?
              "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

              "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

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              • I think t5he problem lies in the fact of registering ships in one country, having a crew from another and operating in an area nowhere near the first two.

                If the ship is registered in and has a crew from a country with a large navy then it is relatively safe. Problem is that this is not the case so the large navy owning countries don't care.
                Without supplies no army is brave.

                —Frederick the Great,

                Instructions to his Generals, 1747

                Comment


                • Where a ship is registered, where the crew is from and where it is owned from is irrelevent in international waters.

                  The arresting party arrests them under their laws.

                  In National waters they are arrested and subjected to the territorial waters they were arrested in.

                  All have an obligation to eliminate piracy no matter what country a ship is registered or what natianality crew. This is reinforced by the recent capture of this freighter with heavy weapons, explosives and other armamnets that can be in the future be used aainst the state that let them slip by.
                  "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

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                  • On another note. THis is a tricky problem.

                    Whats stopping a shady country putting naval assets in a pirate infested waters, then organising pirates to attack a specified and agreed target.

                    These pirates take the ship and crew.

                    The navy then moves in on it in international waters, arrests the pirates and rescues the crew. The pirates are then released because of their future of being tortured / killed if prosecuted in their country.

                    Crew of the merchant vessel are wisked away back to a safe location while the merchant vessel drifts freely on the open ocean.

                    A passing vessel ( organised by the dubious state) just happens to be in the area and takes tow of the vessel and claims salvage.

                    Far fetched I know but strabger things have happened
                    "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

                    Comment


                    • I saw a documentary on a OOCL vessel on Discovery once. The main defence that merchant vessels have against pirates is CCTV, closed hatches, "watches" & a high pressure hose!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by luchi View Post
                        The idea of the cannon on deck is very appealing but as illegal as the pirates.
                        Is it?

                        I've been looking into this, and apparently the rules are "Whatever is legal in the country your vessel is flagged in is legal on your boat/ship/sub." The official standpoint of the International Maritime Organisation is that guns are unwise as they may escalate the situation (This is a bad thing?) but not that they are illegal.

                        Most flag of convenience countries tend to have strict firearms laws, hence nice unarmed targets. You'll note that the Blackwater ship is registered in the US, hence it can have all those machineguns and whatnot. US law authorises private citizens to own functioning artillery pieces. so a deck gun is not out of the question.

                        The problem occurs when docking in other countries that aren't so keen on guns, at which point commerical vessels at least apparently have an option of seeking dispensation from the country whose waters they are planning on entering.

                        Even at that, this site shows the rules for non-commercial vessels docking in different countries, the mast majority of which allow firearms to stay on the boat or at least be returned upon departure.

                        FIREARMS and the CRUISER: © by Gord May Over they years I’ve participated in, and listened to, many interesting and spirited (often “heated”) debates on the advisability of carrying firearms aboard a


                        NTM
                        Last edited by California Tanker; 23 October 2008, 18:06.
                        Driver, tracks, troops.... Drive and adjust!!

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                        • Russian Frigate Neustrashimy leaves the Suez Canal on its way to tackle piracy off Somali.



                          You will never have a quiet world until you knock the patriotism out of the human race

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                          • Cdn frigate heading out of African waters

                            HALIFAX, N.S. - A Canadian navy ship headed out of waters off Somalia Thursday after wrapping up an international food relief mission that saw it keep pirates at bay while gun battles raged on shore.

                            HMCS Ville de Quebec had been off the Somali coast since early August when it began helping World Food Program vessels deliver food to the port of Mogadishu.

                            Cmdr. Chris Dickinson said the frigate escorted the food shipments into the war-torn port to protect them against pirates who routinely board boats and take hostages.

                            "We appear to have been a pretty effective deterrent, quite frankly," Dickinson said in an interview from his ship as it left the area for another mission in the Caribbean.

                            "I had a team of sailors on board who were armed and that kept the pirates away from even coming and checking out the ships we were with."

                            In total, Dickinson said they did 10 escorts of ships loaded with enough food to feed 400,000 people for six months.

                            The country has been beset by violent clashes between rival militias for almost 20 years, leaving millions impoverished and cut off from food supplies.

                            Dickinson said flying over the capital in the ship's Sea King showed the extent of the devastation with long lines of burned out buildings and mortar fire blazing in the night sky.

                            He said one UN vessel was attacked by pirates, but the Quebec dispatched its helicopter to scare them off before they were able to go on board the supply vessel.

                            As they left the area, Dickinson said they passed the MV Faina, an arms-laden Ukrainian vessel seized by pirates off the Somali coast Sept. 25.

                            The U.S. Navy today said the pirates, who are demanding US$8 million in ransom, lined up their 20 captives and that they appeared to be healthy.

                            Also, the French navy said Thursday that it had captured nine pirates near the Gulf of Aden.

                            Officials say the pirates, travelling in two small boats, were stopped about 185 kilometres from the nearest coast.

                            Anti-tank missiles and other weapons along with ship boarding gear were found on the vessels.

                            Last edited by Dogwatch; 24 October 2008, 00:33.

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                            • Puntland coastal guard!

                              Puntland coastal guards stand on the deck during a sea-patrol near the northern port town of Bosasso October 17, 2008. Somali security forces freed a Panamanian ship from pirates two days after they killed one of the hijackers in a gun battle.



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                              • The example of the Canadian frigate escorting the UN food ships shows that escorts work. The next step could be to organise convoys through the danger areas, with naval escorts.

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