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  • is it a waste to send a ship without helo capacity would the LPV not be suitable for such a job

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    • I think it helped by being a container ship.There is only a few avenues accessible when loaded up like that.

      Coupled to the locked down position of the crew and suppression from both the Heli and the ship - it sure was a good operation.
      "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

      Comment


      • If we could concentrate all our resources (Aer Corps Helicopter and NS) then we could do something like that. The chances of the NS getting the Heli to train for it are what would prevent it from being pulled off.

        Why do people say we need troops onboard? The best boarding parties are sailors, naturally. Give them the job, they won't be idle for the rest of the time when they aren't boarding.

        Great video.

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        • Originally posted by zone 1 View Post
          is it a waste to send a ship without helo capacity would the LPV not be suitable for such a job
          You can board from a RHIB (actually that is the most common method) but fastroping from a helo is much quicker, and a lot more fun.

          I would also argue that fastroping impressed the pirates and scared the crap out of them, probably why they surrendered after a very brief firefight. Finding yourself 5m in front of a Special Operator's weapon has got to be very uncomfortable.
          "On the plains of hesitation, bleach the bones of countless millions, who on the very dawn of victory, laid down to rest, and in resting died.

          Never give up!!"

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Slug1 View Post
            If we could concentrate all our resources (Aer Corps Helicopter and NS) then we could do something like that. The chances of the NS getting the Heli to train for it are what would prevent it from being pulled off.

            Why do people say we need troops onboard? The best boarding parties are sailors, naturally. Give them the job, they won't be idle for the rest of the time when they aren't boarding.

            Great video.
            The reason why I'm saying troops is the assault team was more than likely a MARSOF detachment on board the Tromp. As far as I know, this type of operation would be carried out by ARW rather than regular Naval personnel here.
            "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

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            • NL MARSOF video in Aruba (ohh the hardship! )

              "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

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              • Fast roping from Helis looks great but there was a similar incident many years ago and Somalis were involved,.... we got a blackhawk down... Isaid it before before, flatten Eyl , Hobiyo, take hostages from Garowe and interdict some of the current leaders in Puntland, then Piracy will slow down,
                Spend some of the money spent on this naval ops on creating jobs and Piracy will decrease .

                Comment


                • BBC, News, BBC News, news online, world, uk, international, foreign, british, online, service


                  Somali pirates move captive ships as Islamists advance

                  Three ships held captive by Somali pirates have been moved after Islamist insurgents seized one of their bases.

                  The ships, reportedly with some 60 crew on board, have been sailed 110km (70 miles) up the coast from Haradhere to Hobyo, a pirate told the BBC.

                  The fate of some 300 other hostages, including a British couple, is unclear.

                  BBC East Africa correspondent Will Ross says complex ransom negotiations risk being undermined by a possible turf war after multi-million dollar payments.

                  Residents said several hundred insurgents from the Hizbul-Islam group took control of Haradhere over the weekend.

                  The pirates are afraid of the Islamists and you cannot see them in town today
                  Abdikafar Mohamed, fisherman

                  Hizbul-Islam wants to establish Sharia law in Somalia and put an end to the pirate trade in the town, the leader of the insurgents told the BBC.

                  But our correspondent says there are reports that this same militant group had earlier tried to strike a deal with the pirates to try to get a share of the profits.

                  Our correspondent says the shipping industry will watch the group's next moves very closely to get an idea of whether the vital shipping lanes look set to become safer or more dangerous.

                  Pirates have seized dozens of ships in the Indian Ocean in recent years, leading several nations to send warships to the area to protect commercial shipping.

                  Somalia has not had an effective government for nearly 20 years.

                  Our correspondent says the fate of more than 350 hostages currently being held by the pirates is precarious to say the least.

                  The pirates, divided into numerous different groups, are also holding about 20 ships in their various bases, such as Haradhere.

                  Pirate Ali Omar told the BBC's Mohammed Olad Hassan in Mogadishu by telephone that the ships had been moved to Hobyo.

                  The AFP news agency reports that these ships have a total of 60 crew, from countries including Myanmar and Kenya.

                  "There were three ships near the coast of Harardhere but this morning we cannot see them, they moved towards Hobyo," local fisherman Abdikafar Mohamed told AFP.

                  "I think the pirates are afraid of the Islamists and you cannot see them in town today, they fled, you cannot reach them on their cell phones as most of them headed towards Hobyo."

                  Hundreds of pirates could be seen leaving Haradhere in luxury cars hours before the insurgents moved in, local resident Suleyman Gadid told the BBC.

                  Hizbul-Islam and the hard-line Islamist group al-Shabab have a common agenda in fighting the UN-backed interim government and have previously shared control of the southern Somali port of Kismayo.

                  Somali analyst with the International Crisis Group Rashid Abdi told the BBC that he didn't think the Islamist groups would get involved with piracy, as they are trying to portray themselves as positive forces working for the national interests.

                  The two groups fell out in 2009 and al-Shabab, which has links to al-Qaeda, ousted Hizbul-Islam from the lucrative harbour-town.

                  Since losing Kismayo, the group has been keen to gain a foothold in Haradhere before al-Shabab moved in, says the BBC's Mohammed Olad Hassan in Mogadishu.
                  'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
                  'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
                  Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
                  He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
                  http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by BANDIT View Post
                    ... there was a similar incident many years ago and Somalis were involved,.... we got a blackhawk down...

                    Spend some of the money spent on this naval ops on creating jobs and Piracy will decrease .
                    Dude, nobody said it is without risk... and we don't make policy, we take the necessary action according to the situation.

                    While we are waiting for the miracle remedy that you propose, what do you suggest we do with the pirates ? Let them keep the ships and hostages until we can find a solution to their domestic problems ??
                    I don't think flattening towns in Somalia is acceptable to the international community.
                    "On the plains of hesitation, bleach the bones of countless millions, who on the very dawn of victory, laid down to rest, and in resting died.

                    Never give up!!"

                    Comment


                    • I don't think it would change the pirates tactics much either. The place is already pretty much demolished.

                      Air Strikes achieve little unless you are willing to back it up with troops on the ground.


                      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by BANDIT View Post
                        Fast roping from Helis looks great but there was a similar incident many years ago and Somalis were involved,.... we got a blackhawk down... Isaid it before before, flatten Eyl , Hobiyo, take hostages from Garowe and interdict some of the current leaders in Puntland, then Piracy will slow down,
                        Spend some of the money spent on this naval ops on creating jobs and Piracy will decrease .
                        Come on. Your trying to compare a raid of over 100 US Special forces in a hostile city to 1 helicopter landing a team of MARSOF to engage isolated and fixed pirates, with a warship in support.
                        "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

                        Comment


                        • One thing about that fast roping video was that the heli's machine-gun was blocked by the fast-ropers and unable to be used, so the aircraft and fast-ropers are vulnerable for the length of time it takes to get the entire squad on the deck. Is there any way that the squad could exit by one door and have a gunner cover off from the other? Seems kind of pointless without covering fire.
                          regards
                          GttC

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
                            One thing about that fast roping video was that the heli's machine-gun was blocked by the fast-ropers and unable to be used, so the aircraft and fast-ropers are vulnerable for the length of time it takes to get the entire squad on the deck. Is there any way that the squad could exit by one door and have a gunner cover off from the other? Seems kind of pointless without covering fire.
                            regards
                            GttC
                            My thoughts exactly. This is one of the few advantages the AW139 has, the door gunner is not in the way.


                            Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                            Comment


                            • Does the lynx not have two doors?
                              "The Question is not: how far you will take this? The Question is do you possess the constitution to go as far as is needed?"

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                              • It does but it may not have the ability to fit the fast rope on both sides?!

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