Packing list Battle vest and Backpack

[kaiser]

I would,nt say its great as on any tough course its getting damaged.
Pouches tearing off, buckles breaking, zips giving up,
Your right about Heli ops and perhaps Apc drills but when you D-bus out of them you are into most likely light inf again.
everyone should of kept there old cefo or chest rigs.
I,m glad my unit did we don't use the BV at all unless we are the other side of the camp

[SwiftandSure]

Keep the large NBC pouch as the new one is too small and if kept in the pouch the respirator will get damaged (or hang it up)

Are we being issued Ressies and Noddy suits too??

[Truck Driver]

Talking to guys that are involved in very arduous DF courses the battlevest is great for APC/helo ops but not light infantry work.

Crawling means the mags get dirty and pouches (especially mag pouches) get damaged and the buckles break too easily.

The weight all being on the front means more lower back and quad injuries.

Advise was:
Keep some of the PLCE buckles were you can
Keep the large NBC pouch as the new one is too small and if kept in the pouch the respirator will get damaged (or hang it up)

Yup... Battle Vests are most suitable for vehicle ops, as ye all know, as it removes all the stuff from the rear, making for a more comfy trip
TBH, don't know how the lads cope with the Inf stuff when crawling while wearing them, as now, all the stuff is to the front...

[apod]

The drinking drill with the camelbak(CBRN or normal) is very simple and has been sent to the DF CBRN working group for approval.We still teach the emergency drinking drill but as not all units are still issued waterbottles it is hit and miss as to what is being taught in the units.On the Instructor course I taught both to the students so they can teach both at unit level.
The BV's are a great bit of kit let down by two things.Lack of modularity and durability.With the old PLCE if you damaged a pouch you removed it and replaced just the pouch.If you damage a BV you replace the whole vest.Biggest problem areas are the thinness of the pouch lids(easily ripped).Compare against the lined pouch lids of PLCE.No comparison.Also the main front zips break too easily.
Why we got BV's with zips is a mind boggler.Three fastex buckles can be easily replaced if damaged but a zip can't.

[Truck Driver]

The drinking drill with the camelbak(CBRN or normal) is very simple and has been sent to the DF CBRN working group for approval.We still teach the emergency drinking drill but as not all units are still issued waterbottles it is hit and miss as to what is being taught in the units.On the Instructor course I taught both to the students so they can teach both at unit level.
The BV's are a great bit of kit let down by two things.Lack of modularity and durability.With the old PLCE if you damaged a pouch you removed it and replaced just the pouch.If you damage a BV you replace the whole vest.Biggest problem areas are the thinness of the pouch lids(easily ripped).Compare against the lined pouch lids of PLCE.No comparison.Also the main front zips break too easily.
Why we got BV's with zips is a mind boggler.Three fastex buckles can be easily replaced if damaged but a zip can't.

Who the hell signed off on a design like that ??? Thought the pouches on the issue BV were Molle ?
i.e; detachable from the vest ?

[DeV]

Who the hell signed off on a design like that ??? Thought the pouches on the issue BV were Molle ?
i.e; detachable from the vest ?

The M203 and I think admin pouch etc are detachable. The 4 x ammo and 2 x utility pouches are fixed

[northie]

Are we being issued Ressies and Noddy suits too??

no idea on the first and you wont on the second.

[Truck Driver]

The M203 and I think admin pouch etc are detachable. The 4 x ammo and 2 x utility pouches are fixed

As I said, daft design...

[The real Jack]

Quelle suprise PLCE is back after it was supposidly collected and got rid of, no sign of IPLCS.

[DeV]

IPLCE packing list from lets say a good source that sets standards for the DF.

Smock
Bottom left pocket - leather gloves (not fingerless), bush hat, wooly hat
Left arm pocket - steri gel
Bottom right pocket - penknife (secured to pocket), insulating tape, high carb food
Chest right pocket - space blanket
Right arm pocket - FFD

Battle Vest
Left Ammo - magazines, 7.62 belt/smoke
Left Utility - Model kit, mozzie net, insect spray, rifle cleaning kit, para cord
Left chest zip - maps, compass, air photos
M203 pouch (upper left) - M203 rounds (pouch only fitted if ammo issued)
HE pouch (middle left) - grenades (pouch only fitted if ammo issued)
Right Ammo - magazines
Right Utility - hexi, metal mug, spoon, small cloth, lighter, rations
Admin pouch - camo stick, whistle, torch/head light
Right chest zip - Tacaid, notebook, chinagraph pencils, w/p markets
Back - Platypus, 2 sandbags
Respirator pouch (right leg) - respirator, CBRN drinking attachment
Dump pouch (left leg) - empty mags & belts
Optional - pace counter

Patrol Pack
Top flap - Individual first aid kit, hearing protection, white & red ribbons (to mark pack as being ammo / section med kit), spare ammunition
Main compartment (2 separate dry bags) - items of ordnance, wet gear, fleece (or similar), spare socks, platypus (if not in battle vest), 24 hrs rations

Main Pack
Outside on top - entrenching tool
Top flap - 2 x sandbag, 6 x bungees, 6 x tent pegs
Side pouches (in separate dry bags) - dry flow top & bottoms, norge shirt, DPM trousers, socks, hand towel, wash gear (soap, razor, toothbrush & paste, vaseline, goretex socks, foot powder
Main compartment (in dry bag) - sleeping bag (in bivi bag), spare rations, water, laundry bag/waterproof bag, knee & elbow pads (if required/not worn)
Outside at bottom - basha (rolled in ground mat to protect it), secured by 2 x bungees

Helmet (with elastic strap)
Goggles (in protective cover) secured to helmet

[apod]

Most of that list is as per the ARW selection course packing list with a smattering of NCOTW thrown in.Most of it is sound bar one or two things.
Metal mug and emergency rations should be kept in the daysack.You wont be brewing up during an assault.Keep the BV as light as you can.Also over time the rim of the metal mug will wear through the material of the utility pouch as it was never designed or sized to fir one properly.Trust me I have seen many new lads fresh out of the BTC's who swear by that packing list with worn through utility pouches on the BV due to this practice.
The only thing you should have in the main compartment of the Bergen is the patrol pack.Fold the large liner down and store it underneath in case you need it for a river crossing.The divider between the lower compartment of the Bergen and top should be closed and your sleeping system(complete) goes in the bottom compartment.Now you can access your sleeping system at night without having to take everything out of the Bergen first!Having the patrol pack inside the Bergen is good admin as you can access it fast in case of a shoot and scoot scenario.Also it is more stable and secure when tabbing then putting it under the lid.
Droplegs are really only used in CBRN scenarios if we go to Cat1 and above or during FIBUA.The dump pouch as issued with the leg strap is a nause during greenfield Ops.The leg strap catches on everything when crawling etc.Remove it and tighten the height adjuster straps up all the way so the dump pouch is just below the level of the belt but flaps loose.
Oh and they are Camelbaks or "Hydration systems".Platypus's are for Civi's

[DeV]

I can never think of what to call them

[trellheim]

For those still on PLCE ( i.e. us, and many others ) there are several excellent lists earlier up the thread. Search Apod's and other's posts.

[SwiftandSure]

FFD aside, the DF recommend that you wouldn't keep an IFAK on your person or in your vest? It's just left in the daysack?

[apod]

Not a IFAK as it should be IE Trauma kit.We are not issued those.Yet.
More personal boo boo kit.

[SwiftandSure]

Does that mean to say that there's no expectation to carry a Trauma IFAK as it's not issued? Or would most guys buy and carry their own?

[trellheim]

FFD aside, the DF recommend that you wouldn't keep an IFAK on your person or in your vest? It's just left in the daysack?

Do you know I had the exact same thought

[apod]

Does that mean to say that there's no expectation to carry a Trauma IFAK as it's not issued? Or would most guys buy and carry their own?

Precisely.Outside of the wing I don't know of many who take it seriously.Hopefully starting to change with the new MFR and TCCC course but until the DF starts issuing them most lads don't care.Same with the CIED training.We have all the drills and the gucci kit,but yet don't issue ballistic glasses(yes I know we have goggles.Try wearing them for hours on end dismounted patrolling)or have it as SOP that they are worn in IED threat areas.DoD penny pinching as usual.

[SwiftandSure]

It's funny you mention that, last year I wore Sawfly ballistic glasses on exercise and a PDF lad was slagging me about my "Gucci Glasses". My rationale for wearing them wasn't exactly CIED orientated, but being self employed and knowing that the DF would drop me like a hot sack of sh1t if I was injured, I decided that my health is my wealth, and an eye injury on ex would have stopped me working/earning. I wear them whenever I'm shooting now.

[hedgehog]

I always think this is one of the best threads on IMO- Its what IMO should be about. Well done lads.

What should go into a personal combat first aid kit- ?

[apod]

It's funny you mention that, last year I wore Sawfly ballistic glasses on exercise and a PDF lad was slagging me about my "Gucci Glasses". My rationale for wearing them wasn't exactly CIED orientated, but being self employed and knowing that the DF would drop me like a hot sack of sh1t if I was injured, I decided that my health is my wealth, and an eye injury on ex would have stopped me working/earning. I wear them whenever I'm shooting now.

I dont have any problem with anybody wearing EYEPRO when it is relevant and possibly necessary.Going through a forest a night.Check.Doing FIBUA.Check.Firing pistols.Check.
Firing a rifle or GPMG 200 metres away from the target with slim to no chance of splashback??I dunno.
Overseas where there is ANY threat of IED's??It should be mandatory.

[SwiftandSure]

I dont have any problem with anybody wearing EYEPRO when it is relevant and possibly necessary.Going through a forest a night.Check.Doing FIBUA.Check.Firing pistols.Check.
Firing a rifle or GPMG 200 metres away from the target with slim to no chance of splashback??I dunno.
Overseas where there is ANY threat of IED's??It should be mandatory.

I just see it as PPE when carrying a rifle, same as ear defence. Even at 200m away, I still can't account for my oppos muzzle discipline, or spent cartridges, or any other variables that might damage my eyes, which is why I'd prefer to leave them on if I'm on the ground. I wear them on the range to simulate the conditions I'll be firing on the ground with.

Anyway, the RDF Fighting season will soon be upon us, so time to dust off the battle box....

[morpheus]

where did you manage to locate the helmet ... What type is it? mich ach?

[SwiftandSure]

where did you manage to locate the helmet ... What type is it? mich ach?

Got it off ebay from the States, it's a proper Rabintex 303 AU which I think is similar or the same as the PDF issue lid.

[Goldie fish]

With a cover, few will notice the difference.