Are we talking PLCE, belt, yoke, 2x ammo, 1x water, 1x utility, and ressie pouch? I'd imagine my rig would be a bit heavier empty, but not by a huge margin.
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Confessions of a Gucci-Kit Monster
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Nice kit S&S-
Well done.Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
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Originally posted by SwiftandSure View PostAre we talking PLCE, belt, yoke, 2x ammo, 1x water, 1x utility, and ressie pouch? I'd imagine my rig would be a bit heavier empty, but not by a huge margin.Everyone who's ever loved you was wrong.
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Originally posted by The real Jack View PostYeah I'm just curious really, I assume with all the Molle loops etc your rig should be a bit heavier, I'll weigh my issue cefo bungied up when i get a chance.
If I get a chance, I'll weigh it loaded and empty.
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Originally posted by SwiftandSure View PostThen I'm told I'm carrying too much when they feel the weight of my bergan!
Lightweight civvy sleeping bag in DPM bivi bag, compressed in large canoe bag.
Basher kit - UK Basher, 2x Bivi poles, 4x IPK Pegs, 4x bungees, stuff sack.
Folding shovel (Optional)
Paracord and garden twine - for track plans, model kits, comms cord etc (the latter I'm happy to chop up and throw away).
Wash kit - disposable razor, king of shaves oil, bag of foot powder, cut down toothbrush and travel tube of toothpaste, Man-wipes, facecloth. Waterproofed.
Small roll of rubble sacks - for gash, empty cases, improvised sandbags, and other shite.
JetBoil + spare canister
Rations - 24hrs, in small canoe bag.
Spare clothes - 1x Trousers, 2x t-shirts, 2x socks, 1x sealskinz. In a canoe bag.
58Ptn waterbottle (not in picture)
All of which fills about 2/3rds of my bergan.
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Originally posted by Hello Alaska View PostHow long is that setup supposed to sustain you for?
What's in your daysack?
- Wetgear
- Warm top / hat
- Spare baselayer
- Spare pair of socks
- That day's Rations
- Comprehensive First Aid Kit
- 3L water bladder
- Space/fixings for mission essential kit - ammo, pyro, tools, NVE etc
It's not an exhaustive list, and I'll be getting a new daysack soon enough, as my wee pack isn't doing the business at the minute. Hopefully, I'll be the proud owner of a Tecmac 50 in the coming weeks.
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I spent ages last night compiling a response to all of Swifty's points above only for the feckin board to time out on me and when I logged in again I lost the bloody post.Grrrr
In short the gist of my response was:
1/ You need a better daysack Swifty
2/ Alaska hit the nail on the head when he said you were duplicating admin items.
3/ You are carrying too many baselayers both in your daysack and bergen.You only need two one on you and one in Bergen.
4/ You don't need two canisters of gas unless going out for a long period.which the RDF doesn't.Unless you are afraid you are about to run out.
5/ While I accept your point about self aid and i am not advocating ditching your personal IFAK,i still believe you are carrying too much and kit that wont be used if the shit really does hit the fan.One IFAK(boo boo kit) in your CEFO is plenty.Any serious injuries call the Pln Sgt and get the medic doing his job.Let them carry the full size medical kit.you have enough shit to carry.
6/ I praise your drive to upskill the lads when you get your stripes.But make sure they are qualified in the DF's eyes otherwise you will be leaving yourselves hole open to litigation.
7/ 3 ltsr of water is not really needed in CEFO.Two is plenty.NCOTW SOP for STD Cse is four litres.Two in bergen and two on you.
8/ Rations in CEFO: brewkit and snackpack/powerbars. Daysack: next meal. IE 1x Boilie. Bergen:Everything else.
9/ Warm top can go in bergen during winter months for use in basecamp.No need for Softies etc during summer months.Lightweight issue or BA type norgie is sufficient.
10/ All of the above points are from my own experience and i am passing them on to help Swifty out."Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.
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Originally posted by Hello Alaska View PostYou've done well in packing no more than you need too. Fair play.
Originally posted by apod View PostI spent ages last night compiling a response to all of Swifty's points above only for the feckin board to time out on me and when I logged in again I lost the bloody post.Grrrr
Failing that, periodically highlight your whole post as you write it, and press CTRL + C to retain the text on your clipboard. Then just CTRL-V to paste it back if/when you need it.
In short the gist of my response was:
1/ You need a better daysack Swifty
2/ Alaska hit the nail on the head when he said you were duplicating admin items.
3/ You are carrying too many baselayers both in your daysack and bergen.You only need two one on you and one in Bergen.
4/ You don't need two canisters of gas unless going out for a long period.which the RDF doesn't.Unless you are afraid you are about to run out.
5/ While I accept your point about self aid and i am not advocating ditching your personal IFAK,i still believe you are carrying too much and kit that wont be used if the shit really does hit the fan.One IFAK(boo boo kit) in your CEFO is plenty.Any serious injuries call the Pln Sgt and get the medic doing his job.Let them carry the full size medical kit.you have enough shit to carry.
6/ I praise your drive to upskill the lads when you get your stripes.But make sure they are qualified in the DF's eyes otherwise you will be leaving yourselves hole open to litigation.
7/ 3 ltsr of water is not really needed in CEFO.Two is plenty.NCOTW SOP for STD Cse is four litres.Two in bergen and two on you.
8/ Rations in CEFO: brewkit and snackpack/powerbars. Daysack: next meal. IE 1x Boilie. Bergen:Everything else.
9/ Warm top can go in bergen during winter months for use in basecamp.No need for Softies etc during summer months.Lightweight issue or BA type norgie is sufficient.
10/ All of the above points are from my own experience and i am passing them on to help Swifty out.
1/ Noted, and will square that away soonest.
2/ Definitely going to address that too. The main stuff I use is the laminated map/sat image and quick ref Rpt+Rtn cards. The orders battle book will go in the daysack, and if I'm humping a SINCGAR, I'll leave the aid memoir for it, with it in the pack.
3/ Would you not keep a base layer in your daysack? Personally, I've changed base layer a few times away from my bergan, particularly if it's cold/wet/windy and I've just been running around sweating like a blind lesbian in a fish shop.
4/ The cannister on the yoke must nearly be empty, as I haven't changed it in 2 years, so the spare is there ready when that one goes.
5/ The FAK on my daysack is optional really, I keep it together mainly as a car kit, as my daysack holds my breakdown kit when I'm not using it for the RDF. That said, I'll probably remove a few small things like pain killers, blister kits, and that sort of thing to keep as a small booboo kit.
6/ I'll be clear now in saying that I wouldn't teach first aid if I'm not qualified to do so, it's too much of a legal minefield. But I would expect my guys to know how to treat themselves if injured and understand the fundamentals of first response to traumatic injury. Where they acquire that knowledge if the RDF isn't providing the course, is none of my business.
7/ Fair one on the water, I presently have 2x 3L bladders, not that I'd carry 6L on me. I'd usually carry the 3L bladder and a 58Ptn water bottle in the bergan as a bombproof backup.
8/ Noted, will rearrange accordingly.
9/ Yeah I just use the issue norgie. I have a snugpak pile shirt, but it's a bit heavy, so I tend to only use it on range days and suchlike.
10/ Thanks a million.
When I get a chance to make some amendments, I'll post them up for further scrutiny and advice.
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Originally posted by SwiftandSure View Post3/ Would you not keep a base layer in your daysack? Personally, I've changed base layer a few times away from my bergan, particularly if it's cold/wet/windy and I've just been running around sweating like a blind lesbian in a fish shop.
9/ Yeah I just use the issue norgie. I have a snugpak pile shirt, but it's a bit heavy, so I tend to only use it on range days and suchlike.
I have a sleeka in my daysack - lighter, smaller (when packed) and warmer that the issue norgie.
Have to get my kit ready soon for FTT - may take a few pics and put them up here as well.
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Just on DM's last post.if you are carrying a warm top in your daysack and your baselayer gets soaked through you can strip off the baselayer,put on your warm top next to your skin and then wring out the baselayer.If you have overhead cover hang up the baselayer to let the air get at it.If it is still raining outside wetsuit jkt on over warm layer,or if you want to try and dry out your smock pu the smock over the wetsuit jkt.Time to move off;dry kit back off and damp,cold baselayer back on.Sucks but it will dry out if the rain stops.I never carry a spare baselayer in my daysack AND a warm top.It's one or the other.
My dry baselayer is in my bergen with the rest of my spare kit for when it's honking time."Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.
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Originally posted by swiftandsure View Post...personally, i've changed base layer a few times away from my bergan, particularly if it's cold/wet/windy and i've just been [i]running around sweating like a blind lesbian in a fish shop...[/i/]"Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"
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WARNING: Gucciness Overload
Well having recently rediscovered Ebay, my Gucci kit inventory has expanded, and I'm having to sell off my old gear to subsidise it.
I now have a new Bergan. It's basically a PLCE short back bergan with the front pouch removed and a full panel of MOLLE across the front. It also has a modified floating lid.
I've everything I need in the main pack and pouches, the side pouches are empty for extra kit, dependant on the mission.
I'm looking forward to living out with this set-up as it'll be a lot easier managing everything from the front of the bergan.
That said, I've decided to compromise on my tactical vs practical weight distribution, and put my sleeping system (civvy sleeping bag / bivvy bag / inflatible mat all in one large canoe bag) on top of my daysack in the main compartment. Otherwise my daysack which has a higher weight density rides too high in the pack and makes it less stable on my back, see below.
I also have a new daysack to compliment my CEFO. It's the BA issued MTP Predator Patrol daysack. I'm fooking delighted with it!
Other things I've acquired via the medium of Ebay:
- BA DPM Gore-tex Jacket
- Extra 58 Ptn water bottle with 2x NBC compatible spare lids (£0.99 and thrown in with the Jacket, you can't go wrong)
- BA issue thermal inflatable sleeping mat
I pretty much got all the above for what would have been the cost of one brand new Karrimor SF TECMAC 50. So I'm happy with my new Gucci gear!
I've had a rethink of what I pack where after considering advice from others. I might post that separately if I get a chance.
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