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A foreign friend of mine was a volunteer in his home province's mountain rescue and worked frequently with his country's airforce in Pumas (helicopters were neccesary in a larger proportion of scenarios due to distance involved. )
They worked safely in this environment because they trained regularly and got to know the crews.
Nice to see it happening here.
"It is a general popular error to imagine that loudest complainers for the public to be the most anxious for it's welfare" Edmund Burke
Why is the AC less than wonderful? refusal to learn, refusal to listen, refusal to change. I remember pilots going on exchange programmes to the RAF. Wonderful stuff and all that. They came back, told their peers what went on and the gen was diffused to the pilot body. Problem was, it didn't filter down to the NCOs and men, who make up the majority of a unit so a select few got the knowledge so the amount contributed to the corporate memory was small to start with and immediately began to dwindle as pilots left or shifted units. Other ranks didn't get to do exchange posts so it was a lost cause from the start.
Working with the MR and Civ Def and the rest is good because it spreads the knowledge base, irons out problems in a benign environment and improves public perception of the Don.
Your enthusiasm to bad mouth the AIR CORPS Would seen to me that you have a personal gripe with them. ?
Calm down sofa, no need to shout. I dont have a gripe with the Air Corps.I do however have freinds who serve in the Air Corps, and who I dont want to see being put at risk,because of an inability to learn lessons from past experience.
So basically you are saying that all the helicopters be grounded and that the Air Corps essentially be turned into Ground Corps. Also that mountain rescue do not get training experience with the Air Corps who are basically the guys they use to air lift people of the mountain, thereby increasing the chances of something going wrong when the Air Corps are used in real life. Or is your solution that mountain rescue use red bull to air lift people off the mountain (Red Bull gives you wiiings)
I would welcome the training of any rescue organisation in the use of rotor aircraft, its for the benefit of all, it enhances the safety for those ppl working on the ground, the crew of the aircraft in question, and the casualty(s) been transported. If your job brings you in contact with a piece of equipment that you can call upon then you should have basic knowledge of how it works and the Dos and donts....
This is why these training days take place not just here for Air corps & ICG, it happens all over the world... ppl are talking as if this is a new thing.
DITH
Hopefully the mayan's got it right and were all on a one way ticket outta here!!
I could be wrong but I think the point being made is that until the Air Corps can show equivalence in safety to civil operators perhaps the Air Corps shouldn't be carrying civil personnel. That in no way restricts the Air Corps from any of its military taskings for the Army and Navy.
So I suppose the twos ways to look at this are:
1. The Air Corps can operate as safely as any civil operator, in which case there is no issue
2. The Air Corps have an increased risk profile and therefore should they be carrying non military personnel
As for getting people up and down the hills there is a CG helicopter there and within 12-18 months that CG helicopter will have a greater lift capability then a couple of runs in a 139 so it will be a mute point.
I do agree whole heatedly that the MRTs need training with and exposure to the aircraft and operators they are likely to encounter, the question is, who should they be operating with.
Interestingly in this particular case I doubt if the NW MRTs will wait 1hr 30 plus a further 45 mins transit time when there is a CG base up the road. Therefore this conversation is really only relevant in the Dublin area during standard Air Corps ops hours, outside that the CG will be available at much shorter notice.
Hi B20. No im not saying that they should all be grounded, or that the Air Corps should become a ground corps.I would just suggest that given their safety record (one of the posters on the PC9 thread broke it down,and I found it quiet shocking,given the size of the Corps) that they take a step back,slow down, and recognise that there may be changes that could be made to the organisations (not individuals) apparent attitude to safety culture and training. By all means train, but do it in the safest way possible. And Im sure I'll be corrected if Im wrong, but aren't the Coastguard basically the guys they use to air lift people of the mountains?
This site should be renamed as the a forum for disgruntled CHC and CG personnel Bitch about the Air Corps. Serious lads grow up. Thought this was supposed to be a Forum where people like me that are interested in our national service man and women in that Air Corps and what they do. Not a sad bitching forum. This is a AC page not a CG/CHC/CR, get your own.
No they are not, it is generally the Air Corps, hence the need to have cross training with Mountain Rescue.
Actually, I think you will find that the Air Corps MRT operations are generally limited to the Wicklow mountains and arent the first port of call for SAR operations. AC really only get involved during protracted ops where lots of people need moving such as Lug a few years ago.
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