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Thread: Malaria Claims

  1. #1
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    Malaria Claims

    http://www.independent.ie/national-n...g-3126454.html

    Anyone seen this? The comments below are a disgrace.
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

  2. #2
    C/S Tango_Charlie's Avatar
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    This will attract a lot of flak from an ill-informed public but **** em, the public in general rarely have a good word to say about the army anyway. Fair play to the lads involved for taking a stand. If there is compensation to be awarded they deserve every penny they get. I know first hand the horrible side-effects of this notorious drug and I have close personal friends whose lives have literally been irreversibly ruined by it. Marriages have broken down and families have been torn apart because of Lariam. And I would not be a bit surprised to find out the side-effects of Lariam have been a major factor in some suicides over the last few years.

    The minister answered a question in the dail from the Sinn Fein spokesperson for defence saying that every soldier is screened prior to deployment to ascertain their suitability for taking Lariam. What a joke!!! The only screening I ever got was 'If you dont take it, you're not going'. The army once again tried to cut corners and save money and now its going to come back and bite them in the arse big time.

    The guys involved in this and future actions against the state in relation to Lariam should have the full support of every member of the Defence Forces.

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    Private 3* Jungle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tango_Charlie View Post
    I know first hand the horrible side-effects of this notorious drug and I have close personal friends whose lives have literally been irreversibly ruined by it. Marriages have broken down and families have been torn apart because of Lariam. And I would not be a bit surprised to find out the side-effects of Lariam have been a major factor in some suicides over the last few years.
    Wow... we have been using Lariam in the prescribed areas for a long time; While there was a lot of speculation of problems at first (20 years ago), it is now used without much controversy but the occasional person with side effects.

    I'm not saying this is the case all the time, but we have seen cases where guys were blaming Lariam for problems that were caused by other (personal) things.
    "On the plains of hesitation, bleach the bones of countless millions, who on the very dawn of victory, laid down to rest, and in resting died.

    Never give up!!"

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    C/S Tango_Charlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle View Post

    I'm not saying this is the case all the time, but we have seen cases where guys were blaming Lariam for problems that were caused by other (personal) things.
    Unfortunately Jungle, we are going to see this element emerging over the next few months/years as well. Guys blaming lariam for underlying problems and guys who are just plain chancing their arm and looking for a few quid. These cowboys will demean and belittle the suffering of the genuine cases of which there are many. Certainy more than the ten stated in the independent article today.

    I am not a doctor but i genuinely believe I have developed some side-effects myself as a result of taking lariam (over and aggregate period of about 15 months, give or take). During my second trip to Chad I can definitely say i suffered adverse effects from the drug and the MO agreed with me and took me off it. With the exception of being left with a very poor memory none of these effects seem to have been permanent thank god. I would not however jump on the compo bandwagon with this as I think the guys who are going for it now deserve the best shot they can get at being fairly and adequately compensated for the states neglect of them.

    I'm the first guy to tell a fella to 'man-up' when he needs a kick in the arse, but to see a once happy-go-lucky, tackle all comers mate shrink into a shell of a man is deeply saddening when you think that it could have been avoided if the state hadn't farmed out our welfare to the lowest bidder.
    Last edited by Tango_Charlie; 3rd June 2012 at 22:00.

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  8. #5
    Brigadier General
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    Unfortunately the public remember the number of chancers that claimed Deafness compo, Lads openly

    boasted about blasting there ears out of it with there walkmans on the way to the likes of the Blackrock

    clinic for there hearing tests. So as far as the public are concerned it a case of "Hear we go again".

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    Best of luck to the people taking the case. It's a pity that they have been forced to go down this route, but the DOD & MA have only themselves to blame for failing to respond adequately to the victims plights.
    Cry "havoc!", and let slip the dogs of war!

  10. #7
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    we used Lariam when we were in Africa too.

    yeah there were side effects - like the weekly 'Lariam Lob-On' - 'getting wood' the day after some lads took it basically.

    there was other stuff - some liver problems too.

    but that's life - that's what happens in soldiering.

    i don't know of any of our guys suing the government over it though.
    Last edited by RoyalGreenJacket; 3rd June 2012 at 23:20.
    RGJ

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    That may be what happens in soldiering, dosen't make it acceptable. Proper screening should've been taking place given the known advers affects associated with this drug. If the DOD failed to do this, they have to be held accountable, and unfortunately this looks like the only option left for these people.
    Cry "havoc!", and let slip the dogs of war!

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    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    loads of armies and other agencies used Lariam.

    no drug is perfect.

    i'm sure it prevented and protected far more than it ever harmed.

    we've had tens of thousands of men and women take it - have the ex-DFI personnel suffered some more extreme side effects than others using the drug?

    just wondering.
    RGJ

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    The Rifles

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    Probably not RGJ, but what was the MOD's response to its use in the UK? I do believe the US DOD has restricted its use on its own service men and woman.
    Cry "havoc!", and let slip the dogs of war!

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    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Worth Noting that the long time enemy of the Oglaigh na hEireann, SF/IRA has been formost in the support for this campaign to seek compensation for those who suffered side effects from Lariam use. One wonders if there is an agenda here.
    RGJ, are you sre lariam is what your people use? Normally it is only given to those operating in equatorial regions.

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    private REX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post

    we've had tens of thousands of men and women take it - have the ex-DFI personnel suffered some more extreme side effects than others using the drug?

    just wondering.
    That depends, would you consider suicide an extreme side effect?
    CRIME SCENE INSTIGATOR

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  21. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldie fish View Post
    Worth Noting that the long time enemy of the Oglaigh na hEireann, SF/IRA has been formost in the support for this campaign to seek compensation for those who suffered side effects from Lariam use. One wonders if there is an agenda here.
    RGJ, are you sre lariam is what your people use? Normally it is only given to those operating in equatorial regions.

    When the shinners first started asking questions about Army taking Lariam, My first thoughts were they are out to discredit the Army in a round about

    way, or they are on a commission from a certain firm of bottom feeders

  22. #14
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    The thing to remember about every drug is that they ALL have side effects and risks, and these have to be weighed up against the benefits.

    I'm no expert in tropical medicine, but the thing that would have needed to be taken into account before prescribing an antimalarial prophylaxis on a large scale is whether the risk of catching malaria (and resulting long-term side-effects) was greater than the known side-effects of the drug. The risk assessment should have been done and would prove interesting reading.

    (And I'm sure that whatever the facts of the case, the Shinners are just interested in sh1t-stirring)
    Last edited by Flamingo; 4th June 2012 at 00:54.
    'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
    'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
    Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
    He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
    http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

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    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/...socialcomments

    An article regarding Lariam's use and it's side effects.

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    I know a lad from my Unit, who went to Chad there about 2 or so years ago. An IMO member was on the same trip with him.

    While on Lariam, he was absolutely tormented by night terrors. It was passed off as "Ah well that's Lariam for ya" and so on, until one night lads in his tent woke up to find him, while going through yet another night terror, trying to open the lock on his Soldier's Box in his sleep.

    Sorry but while I'm all for cracking on with job and accepting that the life of a soldier will usually mean you'll take risks, put up with the shite end of the stick etc. when it gets to the stage where it's putting other people in danger, something needs to be done.

    There's a reason the Yanks pulled Lariam from being issued to their SOF lads, heli pilots etc. and it ain't because it's not that bad.

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  28. #17
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldie fish View Post
    Worth Noting that the long time enemy of the Oglaigh na hEireann, SF/IRA has been formost in the support for this campaign to seek compensation for those who suffered side effects from Lariam use. One wonders if there is an agenda here.
    RGJ, are you sre lariam is what your people use? Normally it is only given to those operating in equatorial regions.
    Goldie - it's what we had in Kenya - literally on the Equator as you know.

    i didn't bother with it in Iraq, and as for Afghan you'd have to ask Keef or Irishkid from our lot.
    RGJ

    ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

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    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    Well my first trip to a Malaria region was 12 years ago and I was proscribed Lariam, the doctor informed me of some potential side affects and stressed that I should watch out for mood swings and the at I was to under no circumstances use it for more than 3 months. I found it had a major impact on mood swings.

    The last time I was in Malaria region was 3 years ago and I was proscribed a different drug (taken daily), I asked about larium and was told "Oh no we don't proscribe that any more".

    I have met a number of Irish soldiers who are suffering big time from what they were proscribed, and this was long before any one considered that there might be a compensation pot to draw from. Given my experience I don't think they are lying. And RGJ no that is not an acceptable risk to soldiering.

    The biggest problem in the Irish DF is that there is no proper compensation scheme for wrongs committed, so each individual will have to sue.

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  31. #19
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    I have lived in malaria areas for the best part of 25+ years and have had it several times as have my kids and wife. The thing is malaria is so different from place to place. On the Kenyan/ Tanzania coast there is a really bad strain . I know of two european women who died because of it. My own kids both had malaria when they were less than one , it can be very serious. However if u are living there all of the time its too dangerous to take constant prophalxis, In the early days it was Paulidrine, ( effects sight) then Chloraquine ( now most Malaria is Chloroquibe resistent) Halfan ( caused some sort of heart probs), Arthemisian Spell? ( varying quality ) now arthemesian and a dsoe of Doxyxycline. ( seems to work) . Lariam would not touch it as it can make u bonkers.It being well known for ages.
    Best prophalaxis is to take a fold up newspaper and check the room at night, wallop everything that moves except geckos, sleep under mozzie nets, dont allow garbage , stagnant water ,craetes of empty beer bottles to build up and spray in the daytime. Watch alcohol levels as hangovers also coincide with Malaria attacks , wonder why???
    Aas regards the claims, its a reflection of a society that is compo mad, ( by the way I did not put in a deafness claim) although a friend of mine who was a major in the Prince of Wales got 80,000Sterling about 15 yrs ago>
    So an approach somewhere between the attitude expressed by RGJ ( Baldrick I am a soldier etc WW1 approach) to LOOKING AFTER THE MEN.

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    Old Africa saying: Larium drives you crazy but Malaria kills!

    We used to use Maloprim generally in the Rhodesian forces and so did the British contingent who came out for the ceasefire. However, resistance builds up to certain drugs and Maloprim is rarely used now in Zimbabwe. The area around Binga in the Zambezi Valley seemed to have the highest concentration of mosquitos in the world and Maloprim always seemed to work- along with the normal precautions regarding clothing, nets etc.

    On deployments to the Inyanga mountains in the Eastern Highlands which were well over 8,000ft. we were issued with a different drug which I think may have been a variation of Larium. It certainly did me no harm and I remain exceptionally well-balanced.


    But interesting article here
    http://www.upi.com/Top_News/2002/08/...6011028309441/

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  34. #21
    C/S Tango_Charlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hello Alaska View Post
    While on Lariam, he was absolutely tormented by night terrors.
    I think most people got the incredibly vivid and incredibly frightening dreams. But we had 2 lads in the same tent (2 down from mine) who got the night terrors. Not generally something to joke about on its own but was actually quite funny to hear them when they got them at the same time!

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    Its total bollocks, no one in the right mind would take Larium when Malerone is far better. Its all about saving money as usual and now the DF/DOD is gonna get its commupance for not being willing to pay the £3 per tablet per day for the Malerone

  36. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by timhorgan View Post
    it certainly did me no harm and i remain exceptionally well-balanced.

    buhahahahahahahajha!!

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  38. #24
    C/S Tango_Charlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mabel View Post
    Its total bollocks, no one in the right mind would take Larium when Malerone is far better. Its all about saving money as usual and now the DF/DOD is gonna get its commupance for not being willing to pay the £3 per tablet per day for the Malerone
    Malarone! Thats the stuff I got when I was taken off the Lariam. Thanks Mabel. Couldn't for the life of me remember the name of it. Ah well thats the Lariam for you. :-)

  39. #25
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    Now. how big a say did the civil serpents have in picking the cheaper Lariam. ?

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