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  • #16
    EUTM webpage.
    Irish and Brits working together.Start of something good I hope.
    "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

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    • #17
      Thank God the French reporting is accurate!. Normally their geography of this part of the world (these islands) is abysmal, they think we are still part of the UK even after 91 years. Their confusion seems to have lifted now. I had feared the worst and that this new Irish/British initiative would have been beyond their grasp, in fact beyond their comprehension.

      Don't get me wrong, I have great time for the French and respect for their military and have soldiered with them but many if them needed a heads up in this regard as indeed did quite a few Americans.

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      • #18
        Its about perspective. I was struck when I spent some time there how their version of history is not quite the same as ours. For example, as far as we were taught, ww1 startd in 1914 and ended in 1918. To them it started in 1871 and ended in 1919.
        To them there was no "French Resistance", instead there was the Maquis.
        Their world view is inward, and more concerned with its former territories, than the history and politics of its northern neighbours.


        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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        • #19
          Spot on Goldie Fish. Francophone land only is of interest. Some think you need to cross the channel in order to get to Ireland.

          Mind you the more I think of it the more I realsie that they are not alone in this thinking. You would wonder about what External and then Foreign Affairs have been doing to
          project our image since '22. I remember a few years ago seeing a picture of Connemara splashed across the cover of a magazine called 'British Heriatge'. Needless to say I received no reply when I cribbed!

          You might also be surprised (maybe not) how many in the UK are similarly clueless thinking that Dublin is in the UK. Do not even go to innaccuracies such as so called 'Southern' Ireland. That really explains the political geography of Malin Head. This info they could not cope with.

          As for the 'British Isles' term!! This may raise some objections but it is Government and UN policy since 1955 that this term does not refer to Ireland and is legally as archaic as referring to the USA as the 'Colonies'.

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          • #20
            ECOWAS force in Mali is 'incapable': US official
            (AFP) – 14 hours ago
            WASHINGTON — Troops from the Economic Community of West African States deployed in Mali are "completely incapable" and are not "up to the task" of fighting Islamist militants, a senior Pentagon official said Tuesday.
            Michael Sheehan, assistant secretary of defense for special operations, offered his harsh criticism of the West African forces at a congressional hearing in which he praised French troops for rolling back insurgents in Mali.
            "Right now, the ECOWAS force isn't capable at all. What you saw there, it is a completely incapable force. That has to change," Sheehan told a Senate Armed Services subcommittee on emerging threats.
            Read more


            It could be a long deployment for the EU training mission.

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            • #21
              The Government is to give serious consideration to members of the Irish Defence Forces serving in any UN peacekeeping force that may be created to assist Mali.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by B Inman View Post
                ...WASHINGTON — Troops from the Economic Community of West African States deployed in Mali are "completely incapable" and are not "up to the task" of fighting Islamist militants, a senior Pentagon official said Tuesday...
                and in other news, rain makes shit wet...

                you're absolutely right about it being a long (indefinate?) training mission - and if anyone thinks that the French - and the rest of the EU countries that think this is important - have done the last of the 'vanguard' fighting, let alone support, they've got an other thing coming...

                a mate from 29 who has been in Mali on the Artillery training mission - a parallel job to the UK/RoI Inf Trg mission - when asked how it was going, replied 'its like watching a retard trying to **** a doorknob'. he was not sanguine about the chances of success - and obviously he's seen 'Dodgeball'.

                i hope you lot have got that desert/arid DPM kit sorted out...

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                • #23
                  From RTE.ie this morning;

                  Govt to consider Mali peacekeeping force
                  The Government is to give serious consideration to members of the Irish Defence Forces serving in any UN peacekeeping force which may be created to assist Mali.

                  Minister for Defence Alan Shatter told a meeting of his EU colleagues in Luxembourg that it was important for to have a coherent plan in which member states had a greater level of participation in such missions.

                  http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0423/385...keeping-force/

                  Do you know what would be really great? Some dust filters for helicopters.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Aidan View Post
                    Do you know what would be really great? Some dust filters for helicopters.
                    In case anyone is watching... Barrier filtration kits for AW139

                    http://www.aero-access.com/products/...tion-Kits.html
                    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
                    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

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                    • #25
                      Belgium deploys 2 A 109 to mali in the medevac role.

                      Given that there are only six helicopters, I would have thought that a contribution ala chad would be more likely.

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                      • #26
                        Depends on where troops are located in country (if they go), but you can probably safely assume that any unit sent would very closely resemble the Chad deployment. Might be more of a logs tail though.

                        There really aren't enough helis to go, but probably even more importantly, the AC would need to have been training for deployment for a very long time before considering a mission like this (and I'm sure there would be infrastructural issues too around kit). Goes back to what the Minister said recently - its all about capacity building. The DF needs to be out there training with our allies in Europe, for serious deployments with all the gear.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Aidan View Post
                          Depends on where troops are located in country (if they go), but you can probably safely assume that any unit sent would very closely resemble the Chad deployment. Might be more of a logs tail though.

                          There really aren't enough helis to go, but probably even more importantly, the AC would need to have been training for deployment for a very long time before considering a mission like this (and I'm sure there would be infrastructural issues too around kit). Goes back to what the Minister said recently - its all about capacity building. The DF needs to be out there training with our allies in Europe, for serious deployments with all the gear.
                          and the JW thread rears its head again...

                          French SOF just did a 2,000km patrol over 10 days or so into northern Mali, supported by a pair of Puma's and a Tiger - i saw the piccies on Arrse - apparently they didn't meet anyone, but they found a, err... 'bucket' load of weapons.

                          if you guys do end up going on a 'peacekeeping' job in Mali, i hope - as Aidan says - that you take all the gear, because i rather doubt you want to get into a fight on an AO that big without your own Artillery.

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                          • #28

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by ropebag View Post

                              French SOF just did a 2,000km patrol over 10 days or so into northern Mali, supported by a pair of Puma's and a Tiger - i saw the piccies on Arrse - apparently they didn't meet anyone, but they found a, err... 'bucket' load of weapons.
                              Photo slideshow with OTT music; http://youtu.be/nUZifj1Fq6c . It's better than the DFs usual third world resolution videos with the same poxy music!
                              Everyone who's ever loved you was wrong.

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                              • #30
                                Methinks this will be an ARW job - send maybe 40-50, working beside French/Brits/whoever is able to provide the air support, a bit like the East Timor op.

                                Can't see the Government ponying up for a larger deployment.

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