Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Defence forces Deployment to UNDOF

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by hedgehog View Post
    Whoooooah- before we start filming every single engagement we get into. Just stop and think about it. Do you really want the families at home to have that extra worry.

    Leave the Hollywood stuff to Ross Kemp, we know what we did and what we do on a daily basis, we don't need to frighten the shites with worry out of kids, wives and Mammies.
    This post reminds me of a story I heard years ago. Lad I served with had a brother out with UNIFIL around the time of Gulf War 1. Sent a letter home to the mam. Goon writes "not too bad here but doing a lot of NBC drills lately". Cue the mammy having a shit fit when she was told what NBC meant !
    "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

    Comment


    • Originally posted by hedgehog View Post
      Whoooooah- before we start filming every single engagement we get into. Just stop and think about it. Do you really want the families at home to have that extra worry.

      Leave the Hollywood stuff to Ross Kemp, we know what we did and what we do on a daily basis, we don't need to frighten the shites with worry out of kids, wives and Mammies.
      Plus, you never know what may be taken out of context to bite you on the arrse later...
      'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
      'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
      Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
      He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
      http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

      Comment


      • Exactly lads. The folks at home have enough to worry about. Let's not add to it.
        Last edited by hedgehog; 15 July 2014, 22:30.
        Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
        Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
        The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
        The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
        The best lack all conviction, while the worst
        Are full of passionate intensity.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by hedgehog View Post
          Exactly lads. The folks at home have enough to worry about. Let's not add to it.
          isn't the problem that the people have more to worry about than they understand, and that because Defence is so low down the political agenda - and so distorted in its public perception, that being worried is actually the last of their concerns?

          from here, it looks to me like the lack of mobility (helicopters) and protection (organic firepower) is at some stage going to get lots of Irish soldiers killed. families being a bit worried because they've seen some sporty footage on the news pales into insignificance when a dozen flag-draped coffins come down the ramp at Baldonell.

          Irish soldiers, whether previously in Chad, or now in Syria, or in the future in Mali, or CAR, or Somalia, are being placed at significantly greater risk than is neccessary because of equipment/force capability gaps - those capability gaps are caused by an ill-informed public (political?) debate/understanding because of ignorance and a belief (that the DF willingly conive with) that Irish soldiers go to peaceful places and spend 4 months chatting up aid workers, building schools and being gratuitously over-equipped to do so.

          that is not, not the case. Irish soldiers go to very dangerous places where people shoot at them all the time, they are horribly under equipped, and at some point their luck will run out, and that public ignorance and political (military?) complacency will result in dead Irish soldiers.

          this will be bad enough in a 'war of choice', some wherethe****isthat place in Africa or the ME where the Irish government decides that a deployment is appropriate for altruistic, diplomatic or training reasons - what will be incomparably worse is Ireland, because of the lack of mobility and protection, losing a vastly more important conflict of national survival/critical interest. not only will many more Irish soldiers die because of this public ignorance/complacency, but the people of Ireland will suffer the consequences of losing that conflict.

          pretending that everything is ok, and that nothing happens is not protecting people at home, its leading them up a dead end where a very much worse shock awaits them than seeing some 'two way range' footage on the news.

          Comment


          • Telling the public, who care little for the detail of equipment, and protection that our troops overseas are ill equipped would do nothing but bring comparisons back to the days of bulls wool and the Congo etc.
            You don't need tabloid headlines telling half truths about what if situations. The families don't need to know the real danger their sons and daughters face while overseas because they can do nothing about it but worry until the tour ends and the chalks return.
            Its like I don't tell the mother or the missus about the guy in the Van who tried to drive over me and my bike on my morning commute because (a) Nothing happened me and (b) what would it gain by making them worry more?
            It isn't luck that has seen so few Irish soldiers killed in UN service in the last 20 years, compared to the 20 before that. It is a combination of Good Intel, Good SOPs and the willingness to decide to pull the plug when things are getting silly. Pragmatism.
            For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

            Comment


            • You raise good points Ropebag- but it comes down to gambling between worrying the shite out of your loved ones as against maybe just maybe getting the Govt to spend some of the extremely scarce money on the Defence Forces.

              Me- I would love if what you proposed comes through, it would mean that are comrades are that much more protected- however in reality I dont think it will and thats their shame not yours. The family at home serves a hard time as well, do we really want to make it harder by showing them what its like out there. I say keep broadcasting the lovey dovey stuff and the fact that our troops are making a difference, but dont broadcast the groundhogs, the garryownes the ballyfermots or the other shit hitting the fan type incidents.
              Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
              Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
              The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
              The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
              The best lack all conviction, while the worst
              Are full of passionate intensity.

              Comment


              • They should publish it to some extend I think, possibly at the end of a tour (thinking of a UNIFIL Bn in the 90s they had the number of SHOOTREPs, SHELLREPs, FIRING CLOSE etc in it). Maybe something like that ?

                But what about the family of those on the next chalk ?

                It's a double edged sword

                It would get families worried
                Educate those who think the DF don't do anything overseas
                Give ammo to those who oppose troops overseas

                Comment


                • I say publish the action footage if you have it. Not because I have a predisposition towards war-porn, but because love or hate the DF, one thing it sorely lacks is being respected by the public at large; and there's nothing like watching the home side play an away game to rally support.

                  Most civvies I talk to about the DF think we're just a pack of dossers, and are often shocked when I say that I think the Irish DF is one of the best trained armed forces in Europe with a particularly high calibre of soldier. It's greatest hindrance is the short lead it's always been on.

                  It's said that Peacekeeping isn't a soldier's job, but only soldiers can do it. Demonstrate why that is. Show why we send in the troops rather than a load of NGOs or Gardai on attachments into these war torn places.

                  Will it scare the families? Probably, but the danger, adventure, and potential combat experience is what these people have signed up for. It wasn't for travel or a 9-5 job, because you can do that outside the DF. What do they think is going to happen in civil war torn Syria, while their neighbour Israel is knocking 7 shades out of anyone holding a Quran?

                  Stop mollycoddling the Irish public and show them the level of professionalism that the DF are capable of in the most adverse circumstances; give us something to be proud of!

                  Otherwise, (and touch wood it never happens) the first "action" video to come out of that AO will be from some Rebel group propaganda and no one wants that to be the first impression of the DF outside of the wire.

                  ETA: In the age of information, ignorance is a choice.
                  Last edited by SwiftandSure; 16 July 2014, 15:00.

                  Comment


                  • Have to say Swift and Sure hits the nail on the head with post # 352. I agree, I'd even go one further the DF should have a slow burn organised campaign to change the publics opinion of the DF. Sick and tired of hearing "The Irish Army is a joke" "couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag" etc etc

                    Comment


                    • I'm hearing some dodgy stories about some soldiers actions out there. If its true its shocking. Anybody else heard anything along these lines or was I being wound up?
                      To close with and kill the enemy in all weather conditions, night and day and over any terrain

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by HavocIRL View Post
                        I'm hearing some dodgy stories about some soldiers actions out there. If its true its shocking. Anybody else heard anything along these lines or was I being wound up?
                        Yup
                        Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                        Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                        The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                        The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                        The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                        Are full of passionate intensity.

                        Comment


                        • i've heard stuff that makes me think of the first day of the Somme, and we're not even there...

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by HavocIRL View Post
                            I'm hearing some dodgy stories about some soldiers actions out there. If its true its shocking. Anybody else heard anything along these lines or was I being wound up?
                            Does it involve a cowardly officer?

                            Comment


                            • It is probably a bit of an Irish trait to play things down but RTE aren't even reporting it

                              Where's Mick?
                              Or was it Lebanon he went to?

                              Comment


                              • You'd be forgiven for thinking there was something similar to a DA-notice in place.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X