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  1. #1
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    Defence Forces ambulances

    HSE used military ambulances over 800 times ‘to meet additional demand’

    Defence Forces ambulances from the Curragh Camp in County Kildare have been called on 274 times so far this year.

    CONCERNS HAVE BEEN raised over the repeated use of Defence Forces ambulances by the HSE.

    A parliamentary question by Sinn Féin TD Seán Crowe to Minister for Justice Alan Shatter revealed that on 804 occasions Defence Forces ambulances from the Curragh Camp, County Kildare, were used by the National Ambulance Service to “meet additional demands on its services in the locality”.

    He added that this occurs through “local arrangements between the HSE and the Military authorities”.

    Local councillor Thomas Redmond called on the HSE to clarify it uses of the ambulances.

    “My question is why are the managers not investing and forcing the defence forces to do HSE employees work” he said.

    "I find it staggering the army ambulances are being used when there is currently an embargo on HSE workers and when staffing issues in the HSE are dangerously low. I am also at odds to know the exact deal that was done the types of calls and the future plans for using the ambulance service."

    “I must state that I do not question the qualifications of anyone in the Defence forces” he added, “but as a tax payer I question when these decisions were made and the types of calls the Army answer”.

    The parliamentary question asked how many times “the ambulance service in the Curragh Camp was called to work outside the camp in the past three years”, and revealed that on 323 occasions Defence Forces ambulances were used by the HSE in 2011, 207 in 2012, and 274 this year to date.

    Ambulances were also used on a total of 224 occasions outside of the camp by the Defence Forces to transport their own military personal to and from hospital and to attend training exercises.

    Cutbacks forced the closure for certain time periods of ambulance stations in Maynooth two months ago, something which local TD Catherine Murphy called “extremely alarming”.

    This also affected areas of Tallaght and Swords in Dublin, with Tallaght closing between 7am and 7pm on Mondays.

    The HSE said these stations would be serviced by by crews from adjacent locations when closed.
    http://www.thejournal.ie/defence-for...94331-Nov2013/

  2. #2
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    Usual nonsense in the Journal comments section I see
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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  4. #3
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Surprised its so few!

    The CMU medics get more experience and the local public gets an ambulance, win-win

  5. #4
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    But DeV, "da armee do nathin bt sit on der holes al day"
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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  7. #5
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buck View Post
    But DeV, "da armee do nathin bt sit on der holes al day"
    But they would be if they weren't doing this (only joking)

    Bricins also do it BTW

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  9. #6
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    Drivel,a trained up crew/equipped ambo is an ambo whether it is hse,df,cd the Johns or the Knights etc.The undertone that a non hse ambo is low grade is unwarranted and is ignoring the fact that a timely response is being executed to the casualty concerned.In a warped fashion the df is getting stick for hse problems.

  10. #7
    BQMS Meatbomb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    Drivel,a trained up crew/equipped ambo is an ambo whether it is hse,df,cd the Johns or the Knights etc.The undertone that a non hse ambo is low grade is unwarranted and is ignoring the fact that a timely response is being executed to the casualty concerned.In a warped fashion the df is getting stick for hse problems.
    Same is happening with the HSE's NACC except it's not always the closest helicopter they send.
    It's great that the DF Ambo crews get to assist their local areas, as said its exposure for them and there's no use in a person being forced to wait for a resource when there is a perfectly good one nearer that's available.

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  12. #8
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    Much better to use those resources and get hands on experience. I never really pay too much attention to the comments section on the journal. Nothing avoids getting voted down by the users there.

  13. #9
    CQMS Tyler Durden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buck View Post
    Usual nonsense in the Journal comments section I see
    What do you expect from those jennets in fairness?
    If at first you don't succeed, then call in an airstrike.

  14. #10
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyler Durden View Post
    What do you expect from those jennets in fairness?
    You got me there! The place is overrun with Shinners and wankers (not always mutually exclusive)
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

  15. #11
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    Ambulance in Kilkenny have had a serving soldier attached to them at the moment, a corporal, he is not supernumeray and is operates as part of the teams.

    Will go back to the army as well skilled as an regular paramedic.
    Time for another break I think......

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  17. #12
    Captain Truck Driver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hptmurphy View Post
    Ambulance in Kilkenny have had a serving soldier attached to them at the moment, a corporal, he is not supernumeray and is operates as part of the teams.

    Will go back to the army as well skilled as an regular paramedic.
    ... and would in all probability gain more paramedic experience in that regard, than he would if exclusively with the DF
    Win win - HSE has a pair of hands, the DF gets a more rounded medic
    "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

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  19. #13
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    Would be no harm if a lot more of DF paramedics rotated through the HSE/NAS system.

    Without naming the guy in question, just as good as those he is teamed up with and a hell of a nice guy.
    Time for another break I think......

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  21. #14
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hptmurphy View Post
    Would be no harm if a lot more of DF paramedics rotated through the HSE/NAS system.

    Without naming the guy in question, just as good as those he is teamed up with and a hell of a nice guy.
    Absolutely but they need to ensure sufficient personnel are still available for sick parades, medicals and shoots/ex's.

  22. #15
    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    What annoys me is that how come those overpaid ministerial advisors didn't think of turning this into a good news story by saying that " it is part of upskilling/maintaining the paramedic skills within the DF by encouraging cross training with the HSE. An example of providing an extended service while not incurring additional costs etc. etc.". I sometimes think these so called spin doctors wouldn't recognise an opportunity to spin if it bit them in the arse.

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  24. #16
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    Do the DF ambo ATCA ops get a mention in the Df annual reports.

  25. #17
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    No

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  27. #18
    Non Temetis Messor The real Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    Do the DF ambo ATCA ops get a mention in the Df annual reports.
    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    No
    It'll be mentioned in a HSE report about conning the DF into paying for an Ambo crew to do a job the HSE should be paying for.
    Everyone who's ever loved you was wrong.

  28. #19
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    It'll be mentioned in a HSE report about conning the DF into paying for an Ambo crew to do a job the HSE should be paying for.
    Doubt it.
    Time for another break I think......

  29. #20
    Captain Truck Driver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    Do the DF ambo ATCA ops get a mention in the Df annual reports.
    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    No
    Wow... One of the more high profile ATCA ops and NO mention at all ???
    "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

  30. #21
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    Have to wonder if the Df are ashamed/embarrassed by this ATCA,the Cg certainly dont hide their airambo ops under a bushel by contrast.Also must conclude the moaning is originating in Hse quarters where certain punters are down Ot etc due to the Df picking up the slack.

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  32. #22
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    See like everything in Ireland there's a big catch... Yes the HSE will ask the DF ambo's to do a call , but as fair as they concerned the have now contracted the DF to provide care, treatment and transport for the casualty . All of which must be done in a CEN Compliant Ambo with minimum Paramedic level on board.

    Now that's great for our lads.....UNTIL and there is always an UNTIL... Some knacker see's the opportunity and says he wasn't treated right by a 'soldier'.

    Im not saying its a bad idea, Im saying it leaves the DF wide open!

  33. #23
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Depends on the treatment provided for the skill level an EMT can be on an ambulance.

    Only road ambulances (ramps and all) are used.

  34. #24
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    Im not saying its a bad idea, Im saying it leaves the DF wide open
    Given as I mentioned earlier that the DF are being trained in line within accepted Paramedic Standards and this goes back even further than I related as the NS had guys training the NAS I don't see it as a problem.

    the Dublin Fire Service deploy ambulances to a very high proportion of shouts in the Dublin area, obviously they must hold paramedic qualification to do so, why not the DF.

    It should be remembered that a high proportion of the NAS guys came from the DF in the first place. Ok they had to requalify and weren't always medic, I've seen a Mowag commander instructor as a paramedic, if I had a choice I'd ask for no finer guy to look after me should I need it!
    Time for another break I think......

  35. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    Have to wonder if the Df are ashamed/embarrassed by this ATCA,the Cg certainly dont hide their airambo ops under a bushel by contrast.Also must conclude the moaning is originating in Hse quarters where certain punters are down Ot etc due to the Df picking up the slack.
    Train weekly with a number of Dublin Firefighters. and an a number of occasions have heard them slagging off HSE Ambo crews.

    Nobody likes being replaced
    Last edited by sofa; 12th December 2013 at 22:55.

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