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  • SINKEX and f*ck the begrudgers
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

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    • Originally posted by DeV View Post
      Requirements of NSDS Diving Tender (or at least a hired one)


      Dynamic positioning / stern anchor
      Crane (lifting up to 8t on and off vessel)
      Carry up to 15 divers for up to 10 days
      Carry 3/4 TEUs (the LARS unit is bigger than a TEU (3 of the 4 they make fit in a TEU, the dims provided could be when in operation) with the appropriate power.

      Obviously this doesn't include any special counter-mine/counter-IED equipment (although 1 of the containers holds a ROV and SSS)

      But it gives an identication of what would be required from the CPV for the new role (probably a different ROV and maybe less divers etc)
      There’s pics up on the NS’s Facebook page today of the LARS being used on Eithne .... requires a lot of space

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      • Originally posted by DeV View Post
        There’s pics up on the NS’s Facebook page today of the LARS being used on Eithne .... requires a lot of space
        Safety demands everything in it's place, and more crucially a space for everything. The p31 format is suitable, once the flight deck freeboard or height above water is not too restrictive. The CPV as laid out would not suit, so a new type vessel with clear decks aft and DP included , with necessary accommodations for divers/trainee divers, is needed. Perhaps this could all be part of an MRV with large daughter craft for working in shallower water.

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        • Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post
          Safety demands everything in it's place, and more crucially a space for everything. The p31 format is suitable, once the flight deck freeboard or height above water is not too restrictive. The CPV as laid out would not suit, so a new type vessel with clear decks aft and DP included , with necessary accommodations for divers/trainee divers, is needed. Perhaps this could all be part of an MRV with large daughter craft for working in shallower water.
          But if we go down the road of providing CPV replacements that have a C-IED capability it will mean space aft is going to be required. That space could be for ROVs and/or diving equipment (including LARS)

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          • 30 years yesterday.
            For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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            • 30th anniversary of commissioning today

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              • For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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                • I’d say the MRV will be looked at before the CPV replacements

                  But you never know brexit could change that

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                  • Originally posted by DeV View Post
                    I’d say the MRV will be looked at before the CPV replacements

                    But you never know brexit could change that
                    Be an interesting reversal if needs be, but would show how Brexit is screwing things up.

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                    • Naval Group has won the Belgium/Dutch minesweeper competition. Now we will have to see if France joins the project to replace their similar vessels.

                      https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news...l-competition/

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                      • Originally posted by EUFighter View Post
                        Naval Group has won the Belgium/Dutch minesweeper competition. Now we will have to see if France joins the project to replace their similar vessels.

                        https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news...l-competition/
                        The consortium includes engineering groups that promote Robotics and some of whom out-think human logic and thought processes. I dislike anything that isn't controlled or input by the operator without choice or knowledge. Typical problems occur such as spurious engine shut downs or over complication of systems that causes loss of equipment function and controllability by the operator. Any ship must be designed by the user agency based on routines and tasks for offence and defence and other typical maritime roles.

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                        • Belgian/Dutch MCMV Competition Winner

                          Given the sheer size of the winning MCM 'Mothership' it would appear that expeditionary capacity is a priority.



                          https://www.belgium-naval-and-robotics.be/

                          In the region of 3,000 tonnes, this is not a contender for our upcoming CPV/Corvette/MCMV programme, as defined by the most recent Defence White Paper.



                          http://www.kership.com/en/vessels/lspv-90

                          However a vessel derived from this, and associated designs, could produce a very capable OPV/ETV/Expeditionary MCMV.



                          http://www.kership.com/en/vessels/multi-purpose-vessels

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                          • [

                            However a vessel derived from this, and associated designs, could produce a very capable OPV/ETV/Expeditionary MCMV.



                            http://www.kership.com/en/vessels/multi-purpose-vessels[/QUOTE]

                            The vessel type is interesting but needs more length with a beam nearing a 6:1 ratio, at 16.7 beam I would prefer a length of 100 meters. If we are talking about moving troops and equipment, and provided some in fleet logistics, we need to manage a decent payload, a 3000 tonner might not have enough payload. I think the proposed vessel will be pitched at 125 meters overall length.

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                            • I'm going to suprise myself here am and argue, in this case, for the possability of a smaller vessel.



                              Saab/Kokums MCMV 52 & 80

                              The corvettes need replacing, and in short order, on the heels of Eithne.

                              It's been argued that Orla & Ciara's modest draught are of great advantage when carrying out their fisheries protection duties. I don't doubt it.

                              I do though, find it difficult to gauge the value of that last marginal metre's clearance between say, the Peacocks and a Róisín class vessel. Because in terms of utility, endurance, and crew accomadation the consequence of that metre is a world of difference.

                              The Saab/Kokums MCMV 52 has a published draught of 2.4m, less than the Peacocks, and I can only assume that this increases progressively as the vessel's final design displacement grows. There appears to be potential for this vessel to evolve into quite a spiky little corvette, as evidenced in the following presentation, highlights at timestamp 1:05 - 5:10.

                              Saab MCMV 80 Presentation UDT 2017

                              The principal operational question I'd have regarding this type of vessel is it's suitability for fisheries protection duties. I'm well aware that the prospect of stern-ramp RHIB operation does not meet universal acclaim in the Naval Service. In short, for the fisheries protection and general enforcement duties currently carried out by the Peacocks, which would be most suitable?



                              Saab/Kokums MCMV
                              Róisín class OPV
                              (Róisín minus) CPV
                              Last edited by The Usual Suspect; 2 May 2019, 02:53.

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