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  1. #176
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    It can be done. If there is a Defence budget commensurate with Ireland's wealth and a Defence department commensurate with a sovereign state and not the Rhode Island National Guard.

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  3. #177
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    Found on Twitter..

    Short story: A Russian bomber drops a nuclear bomb in Mayo, causing problems..

    https://twitter.com/jasonomahony/sta...58645766090752
    Semper et ubique Fidelis

  4. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by expat01 View Post
    It can be done. If there is a Defence budget commensurate with Ireland's wealth and a Defence department commensurate with a sovereign state and not the Rhode Island National Guard.
    have you done an actual comparison? I am not sure of the outcome ...

  5. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graylion View Post
    have you done an actual comparison? I am not sure of the outcome ...
    Well I have now, albeit on my phone!
    Rhode Island 2017 budget included $24.68 million for the National Guard including capital expenditure, direct salaires, retirement and health benefits. But the US National Guard comes under the DoD.
    So I found federal defence spending in each state, which includes federal purchases of equipment manufactured in a state and on federal forces stationed there so not much help. However there was also a breakdown of salary into National Guard and federal. In 2017 43% of that salary figure in RI was for the Guard, totalling $319.49 million
    That sounds like between state and federal, $344.17 million was spent on the Rhode Island National Guard salaries which includes an Air National Guard: the 143rd Airlift Wing operating Hercules C130J, the 102d Information Warfare Squadron who seem to be computer techies and the 282d Combat Communications Squadron who make the telephones work. Equipment seems to fall under a general National Guard budget vote as part of the federal budget.

    California Tanker would know this stuff...
    Last edited by expat01; 11th October 2017 at 14:19.

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  7. #180
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    Air Defence and Surveillance on an Atlantic Island requires - Air Survellance and Tracking, MPA capability on call 24/7, 12 Low cost Jets eg Scorpion, mainly training and jet skills,and ground support if adaptable, and six/twelve mach 1, interceptors, leased and supported if necessary. All decent Irish airports with hard runways should have an Air Corps niche with fuelling and portable facilities. Some opinion stated that in Europe there is an average of 8 military jets per 1m population which means we should have about 40 jet equivalent value, to cover jets and other service aircraft.
    Last edited by ancientmariner; 9th December 2017 at 09:58.

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  9. #181
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    But did the Taoiseach say "we won't be buying Aircraft carriers and Fighter jets...."
    https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/201.../925760-pesco/
    German 1: Private Schnutz, I have bad news for you.
    German 2: Private? I am a general!
    German 1: That is the bad news.

  10. #182
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    We have just joined PESCO. Plan to Expand. Defence Chiefs must push for requirements and Not accept photo opportunity PR type Defence. Air Combat capability is an aspiration in the WP. By the way the whole WP on Defence is just an aspirational overview of police, ATCP, and dealing with ad hoc emergencies.

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  12. #183
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    WP is policy

  13. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    WP is policy
    Heavily accented towards the esoteric, with little " we will " but more continuation of the same and acceptance that Defence has a large social element in employment , Fishery and maritime commercial protection, ATCP, MATS and Maritime patrol, close barracks, centres of concentration, sharing of assets.
    Agreed we provide and " best dress " overseas deployments but at home we are ( - ). We are subject to unprofessional, cost saving, undersight , trying to cope with contingencies as they arise.

    For Info; Budget 2016 904m, Minus Army Pensions 224m, Minus Pay and Civil Servants 498m, Net Spend 182m of which 66m was Capital. The remaining 112m runs the Armed Services, plus RDF, Plus CD, Plus grants to Irish Red Cross. Less than 1/8th Budget gets to the coal face and WP doesn't help.
    Last edited by ancientmariner; 10th December 2017 at 10:51.

  14. #185
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    And they waffled about an Increase in capital expenditure , how it was an assurance that the gov was concerned about defence and serious about improving the capability of the DF....
    how much you ask?
    17 million.... no you didnt read that incorrectly.

    s e v e n t e e n __ m i l l i o n__e u r o

    focking joke.
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

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  16. #186
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    [QUOTE=morpheus;456330]And they waffled about an Increase in capital expenditure , how it was an assurance that the gov was concerned about defence and serious about improving the capability of the DF....
    how much you ask?
    17 million.... no you didnt read that incorrectly.

    s e v e n t e e n __ m i l l i o n__e u r o

    Another Airforce with Gold and Blue National flag flew a Christmas Tree Formation with 12 front line fighters over as many of their cities as possible at 500 kts and at low altitude to let people see their Airforce and to enhance large formation flying for Pilots and Engineers. The Rescue 115 + are on facebook everyday with their operations developing high PR. Perhaps our services should SHOW THE FLAG more to promote a climate of justified expenditure.

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  18. #187
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    [QUOTE=ancientmariner;456422]
    Quote Originally Posted by morpheus View Post
    And they waffled about an Increase in capital expenditure , how it was an assurance that the gov was concerned about defence and serious about improving the capability of the DF....
    how much you ask?
    17 million.... no you didnt read that incorrectly.

    s e v e n t e e n __ m i l l i o n__e u r o

    Another Airforce with Gold and Blue National flag flew a Christmas Tree Formation with 12 front line fighters over as many of their cities as possible at 500 kts and at low altitude to let people see their Airforce and to enhance large formation flying for Pilots and Engineers. The Rescue 115 + are on facebook everyday with their operations developing high PR. Perhaps our services should SHOW THE FLAG more to promote a climate of justified expenditure.
    I am very proud of our Defence Forces and the work they do, most as stated go unseen by the general public which is sad , we have a new facebook page dedicated to all the great work carried out by the Coastguard and Air Corps Helicopters going into University Hospital Galway, check out the facebook page, all landings are put in with pictures when possible, spread the word as the Aircorps 112 is in very regular. the link is below let me know what ye think also please like the page and share it.

    https://www.facebook.com/helimoves/
    Last edited by Brian McGrath; 15th December 2017 at 20:23.

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  20. #188
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    The fat bankrupt bookie, Ivan Yeats on Newstalk this evening banging on about the waste of money the Garda and Army Bands are.

  21. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by sofa View Post
    The fat bankrupt bookie, Ivan Yeats on Newstalk this evening banging on about the waste of money the Garda and Army Bands are.
    His TDs pension.. now thats a waste of money.
    German 1: Private Schnutz, I have bad news for you.
    German 2: Private? I am a general!
    German 1: That is the bad news.

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  23. #190
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    I heard that broadcast and he wasn't against them as such, but he did query the cost. I think it's a valid question and it is hard to justify multiple bands for the DF and Gardaí as well as the RTE orchestras. Quite why the State broadcaster needs to be the postholder, if you will, for a National Orchestra (or two) escapes me, given that they spend most of their time anywhere but in RTE.

  24. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    I heard that broadcast and he wasn't against them as such, but he did query the cost. I think it's a valid question and it is hard to justify multiple bands for the DF and Gardaí as well as the RTE orchestras. Quite why the State broadcaster needs to be the postholder, if you will, for a National Orchestra (or two) escapes me, given that they spend most of their time anywhere but in RTE.
    There was once a reason for military bands in the days of bright coloured uniforms and marching armies, but today what military role do they play?

    And while on the subject what role does the Equitation School play? The official mission is to promote one of the biggest and richest industries in the land. I hardly think we need to be spending what little we have on this.

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  26. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by EUFighter View Post
    There was once a reason for military bands in the days of bright coloured uniforms and marching armies, but today what military role do they play?

    And while on the subject what role does the Equitation School play? The official mission is to promote one of the biggest and richest industries in the land. I hardly think we need to be spending what little we have on this.
    And surely the National Stud is already doing all of the promotion of the industry required , no need to be duplicating it in the Army .
    Don't spit in my Bouillabaisse .

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  28. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by EUFighter View Post
    There was once a reason for military bands in the days of bright coloured uniforms and marching armies, but today what military role do they play?

    And while on the subject what role does the Equitation School play? The official mission is to promote one of the biggest and richest industries in the land. I hardly think we need to be spending what little we have on this.
    They are, properly used, the leading ceremonial, identity of military forces. They aid us to walk in step, they salute us , they honour us and our Flag . They march us to war, and they accompany us to our last moment above ground. Philip Souza would be upset after all his work with US Cadets.
    We could get rid of the horses and start a missile and drone unit in the Artillery

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  30. #194
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    I was taught how to march in step by shouty NCOs, no sign of the bands or the Pony Club anywhere....I do recall how moany the bandsmen were when it came to pay and Ts and Cs. It was all, "this is shit, that's shit...." until someone suggested that they go back to the regular Infantry line if they didn't want to stay in the Band. Got very quiet, it did...

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  32. #195
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    Worth remembering that the guy with the triangle in the band is getting tech pay.
    The band are great for morale, but unfortunately their appearance is so short that their effect is negligible.
    As for the pony club.... No military function whatsoever. May as well hire the irish soccer team, give them a beret each and call them the irish army soccer team. Same difference.
    German 1: Private Schnutz, I have bad news for you.
    German 2: Private? I am a general!
    German 1: That is the bad news.

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  34. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by na grohmití View Post
    Worth remembering that the guy with the triangle in the band is getting tech pay.
    The band are great for morale, but unfortunately their appearance is so short that their effect is negligible.
    As for the pony club.... No military function whatsoever. May as well hire the irish soccer team, give them a beret each and call them the irish army soccer team. Same difference.
    Not unknown to have full time sports people in European militaries

  35. #197
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    With bigger or smaller budgets?
    German 1: Private Schnutz, I have bad news for you.
    German 2: Private? I am a general!
    German 1: That is the bad news.

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  37. #198
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    Having one or two world famous sportsmen in an army does no harm but having multiples of bands in one small army is a bit of a waste.

  38. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    Having one or two world famous sportsmen in an army does no harm but having multiples of bands in one small army is a bit of a waste.
    I'd say the reverse. The Bands give good value for money, and are far more popular with the public than the pony club, whose following is a niche in irish society who care little for the rest of the work the DF does.
    German 1: Private Schnutz, I have bad news for you.
    German 2: Private? I am a general!
    German 1: That is the bad news.

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  40. #200
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    And who haven’t had amazing results over the last few years

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