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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by zone 1 View Post
    talk is cheap
    True, but silence is cheaper and can't be held to ransom at a later date.

    I find it interesting that the government, any Irish government, talked about capability gaps and then talked about filling them.

    That is somewhat unusual behaviour - while it may, of course, not happen, I find it incredulous that a government put its head above the parapet on this issue with the intention of not doing anything about it - its easier and cheaper to say ' no problem here, neutral blah blah ' and have the political problem go away....

  2. #102
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    Yeah, but this was the last government. Also 1 radar? And presumably stationed in Dublin? That strikes me as not sensible.

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  4. #103
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    This is quite interesting. As far as I can tell the radar did not make it into the whitepaper?

    http://flyinginireland.com/2015/06/f...rce-equipment/

  5. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graylion View Post
    This is quite interesting. As far as I can tell the radar did not make it into the whitepaper?

    http://flyinginireland.com/2015/06/f...rce-equipment/
    Thought it was there under the "if we get money, we'll look at it"?

  6. #105
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    "Should additional funding become available, beyond that required to meet existing capabilities become available, the development of a radar surveillance capability is a priority for the Air Corps"

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  8. #106
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    Would the soon to be replaced Patriot batteries be a runner here?

    http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...eshow/57519071

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  10. #107
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    The majority of peacetime intercepts involve flying alongside and visually identifying errant aircraft or simply providing a wake up call to flight crew in a lost comms event. Even in the unlikely event of an actual military incursion inside the 12 mile limit, it is unlikely a shoot down would be the first course of action.

    A Patriot is of little use in the middle ground that has to exist between a deterrent and a full blown shoot down.

    It is also a highly complex and expensive system to own, maintain and operate. Plus the Scud threat is low in this neck of the woods.

    (Dead link by the way)
    Last edited by Jetjock; 25th April 2017 at 23:38.

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  12. #108
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    Missile batteries dont need pilots, runways and ATC and are in the business of shooting down rather than talking down hostile intruders.

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  14. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    Missile batteries dont need pilots, runways and ATC and are in the business of shooting down rather than talking down hostile intruders.
    Yes, but that means that we have to be committed to destroying a hostile intruder, (or a random airliner with equipment failure that doesn't answer (ask Vlad how well that played out)). And most likely the minute we did shot down a Foreign Military plane (short of WW3) then the "toys" would be removed.

    Missile Batteries aren't the answer to Air Policing and Patrolling.

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  16. #110
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    I agree but they they do their own thing awfully well as part of the AD envelope.

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  18. #111
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    Missiles are as complex as aircraft, have finite lives and use lots of those kind of people that are leaving the DF in droves...

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  20. #112
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    Just for some context on the matter, Bulgaria just signed for 8 Gripens at a cost of €850 million.

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  22. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparky42 View Post
    Just for some context on the matter, Bulgaria just signed for 8 Gripens at a cost of €850 million.
    Nothing signed yet, Saab have been announced as the preferred bidder.

    Saab to Janes (April 26th):"We have seen the information in the media, and it is encouraging to be on top of the evaluations group's list. With that said, this is one step in an extensive process that will continue going forward."

    Flightglobal are quoting a figure of €511m.
    Last edited by Jetjock; 1st May 2017 at 15:29.

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  24. #114
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    Still, a bargain either way, given the capability offerred.
    Presubably a replacement for the radarless Mig 29UBs.

    Is it worth mentioning the Bulgarians also operate the Pilatus PC9?
    Well, there's good news and bad news. The bad news is that Neil will be taking over both branches, and some of you will lose your jobs. Those of you who are kept on will have to relocate to Swindon, if you wanna stay. I know, gutting. On a more positive note, the good news is, I've been promoted, so... every cloud. You're still thinking about the bad news aren't you?

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  26. #115
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    It's quickly becoming the aircraft of choice for smaller nations. Highly capable with low operating and acquisition costs.

    Austria's lesson with the Eurofighter seems to be been wisely heeded.

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  28. #116
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    I'd go so far as to say it's the obvious choice for any country that isn't in the first or second tier of defence spending.*
    Or doesn't have defence spending because it's still living off the old imperial power and has a population which thinks the holy word "neutral" explains everything from this to why the Gardai don't have guns.

    * Neither of which include the United States, which can be considered a separate planet for such discussions.
    Last edited by expat01; 2nd May 2017 at 17:20.

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  30. #117
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    Given the noise aroused by the Eu300m to be spent on a very disputed hospital, I think if we, the people, spent Eu 850m on a small bunch of fighters, there'd be flaming torches in the streets.

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  32. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    Given the noise aroused by the Eu300m to be spent on a very disputed hospital, I think if we, the people, spent Eu 850m on a small bunch of fighters, there'd be flaming torches in the streets.
    But we wouldn't give them to the nuns!

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  34. #119
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    true, but if nuns are savvy enough to beat the Govt at every turn, then running a few fighters would be easy for them.

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  36. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    true, but if nuns are savvy enough to beat the Govt at every turn, then running a few fighters would be easy for them.
    Ahem.. *clears throat*

    Clearly 8 Gripens are the minimum needed to appropriately escort Mr. Pope on his future visit.

  37. #121
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    well, lets ask the Italian air force to escort him. The pilots and mechs who would have to travel would love a fully paid jolly to Ireland and they have fighters and pointy missiles to do the business, if it gets nasty.

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  39. #122
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    The Order of Malta used to fly a few fighter for the Italian Airforce. Most apropriate, wouldn't you think? http://zspm.malopolska.pl/powervet/w...r_of_Malta.pdf - page 15

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  41. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graylion View Post
    The Order of Malta used to fly a few fighter for the Italian Airforce. Most apropriate, wouldn't you think? http://zspm.malopolska.pl/powervet/w...r_of_Malta.pdf - page 15
    They were actually bombers, converted post WW2 to carry stretchers. I have a photo of my father being loaded onto one in Dublin as a stretcher case for a pilgrimage to Lourdes in the 50's (the joys of TB).

    I believe the OOM actually provide the medical services for the Italian forces, which given that the OOM is technically a Sovereign Nation, is an unusual arrangement.

    Anyway, I digress...
    Last edited by Flamingo; 8th May 2017 at 11:56.
    'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
    'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
    Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
    He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
    http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

  42. #124
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    On the Gov contracts site lately a purchase from Bofors-Saab was disclosed, I wonder if it referred to;

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyTTEuHwb5g

  43. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    On the Gov contracts site lately a purchase from Bofors-Saab was disclosed, I wonder if it referred to;
    Could be anything from RBS-70 to SRAAW or Carl Gustav. What was the value?

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