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  1. #1
    Lord Chief Bottlewasher trellheim's Avatar
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    Regular Representative Associations and Pay Deals

    ( Keeping RDFRA for its own )

    Are PDFORRA going to go in with GRA or have PDFORRA said anything

    ( what about AGSI/RACO ? )
    "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

    "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

  2. #2
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Merging?

    Or do you mean their approach?

    It was announced the other day that the GRA had come to an agreement with Dept of Justice and now it's in the news that they are voting for industrial action?????

  3. #3
    Lord Chief Bottlewasher trellheim's Avatar
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    Approach. GRA and PDFORRA were in the Lobby when LRA was hammered out ( they are not a union so not allowed to negotiate ) . RDFRA could best be put as the drunk outside the door panhandling for change

    Just wondering as it seems fairly logical to do GRA and PDFORRA at the same time
    "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

    "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

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  5. #4
    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    The GRA won a European Court Case granting them union type status and the right to strike. The DF operates under a different set of laws where strikes are considered mutiny.

  6. #5
    Lord Chief Bottlewasher trellheim's Avatar
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    The GRA won a European Court Case granting them union type status and the right to strike
    Really ? Never knew that. Was it ever tested
    "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

    "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

  7. #6
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trellheim View Post
    Really ? Never knew that. Was it ever tested
    We'll find out on 4 November

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0928/819743-garda-pay/

  8. #7
    Sergeant Major
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    Public care if the Gardai strike, not so much the DF

  9. #8
    King Monkey FMolloy's Avatar
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    There was no deal reached, it was all government spin. The GRA still do not have union status; certain parts of the 2005 Act were found to be contrary to European law, but they haven't been repealed yet.
    Last edited by FMolloy; 28th September 2016 at 22:40.
    "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

  10. #9
    King Monkey FMolloy's Avatar
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    AGSI are flip-flopping like 90; they were all great guns to fight, then reached a deal, and now are talking about throwing in with the GRA.
    "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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  12. #10
    Lord Chief Bottlewasher trellheim's Avatar
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    Public care if the Gardai strike, not so much the DF
    that was kind of why I was surprised that PDFORRA did not row in.
    "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

    "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

  13. #11
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo20 View Post
    The GRA won a European Court Case granting them union type status and the right to strike. The DF operates under a different set of laws where strikes are considered mutiny.

    In the news today
    https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0212/940141-pdforra/

  14. #12
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    What about RDFRA?
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

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  16. #13
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by morpheus View Post
    What about RDFRA?
    Also being left out of the review of C&A Scheme AFAIK (although they aren’t a member of it)

  17. #14
    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    The department does not consider reservists as employees therefore will not allow the representative association be part of the C&A scheme.

  18. #15
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    RDFRA should fight for recognition of reservists as employees
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  19. #16
    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by morpheus View Post
    RDFRA should fight for recognition of reservists as employees
    They did. They got a positive ruling with a rights commissioner but the department got it overturned at the next stage.

  20. #17
    Sergeant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo20 View Post
    They did. They got a positive ruling with a rights commissioner but the department got it overturned at the next stage.
    I'd appreciate a link, if you have one. What is the European situation? Seems like the appropriate venue these days to bypass this kind of nonsense.

  21. #18
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    The case was brought by an individual (with RDFRA support) under the Payment of Wages Acts. The Rights Commissioner found that the relationship between DoD and a RDF member is not one of a contract of employment and therefore she had no jurisdiction to hear the case. That was in 2013.
    Last edited by DeV; 13th February 2018 at 18:51.

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  23. #19
    Sergeant
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    The case was brought by an individual (with RDFRA support) under the Payment of Wages Acts. The Rights Commissioner found that the relationship between DoD and a RDF member is not one of a contract of employment and therefore she had no jurisdiction to hear the case. That was in 2013.
    IANAL, but how on earth can that position be argued given that the exact opposite was used as the basis for the recruitment and promotions ban? (Not to mention the Croke Park etc. cutbacks in pay)

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  25. #20
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaithiDub View Post
    IANAL, but how on earth can that position be argued given that the exact opposite was used as the basis for the recruitment and promotions ban? (Not to mention the Croke Park etc. cutbacks in pay)
    And we receive payslips and p60s etc etc

    We are volunteers and pick what we attend in the same way as I volunteered to apply for my job and go to work this morning

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  27. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    And we receive payslips and p60s etc etc

    We are volunteers and pick what we attend in the same way as I volunteered to apply for my job and go to work this morning
    RDFRA should look for back money for those wrongfully denied promotion under austerity, see what shakes out.

  28. #22
    Lt General Bravo20's Avatar
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    There is no difference in pay between a 2/Lt and Lt and the difference between Lt and Capt is 21 euro a week (in the RDF that is). So looking for back pay won't amount to much

  29. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo20 View Post
    There is no difference in pay between a 2/Lt and Lt and the difference between Lt and Capt is 21 euro a week (in the RDF that is). So looking for back pay won't amount to much
    Oh, it wouldn't be about the money. What we want to do is pressurise the DoD to choose between their two mutually-incompatible positions. Otherwise there's no guarantee that this won't just keep happening.

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  31. #24
    Lord Chief Bottlewasher trellheim's Avatar
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    Folks this is off topic. RDFRA has its own thread, please keep Reserve discussions out of it.
    "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

    "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

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