New Copper Chopper

[Big Al]

The Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform, on behalf of An Garda Síochána, propose to go to tender in the very near future for the supply and delivery of a new Eurocopter EC135 Helicopter with McAlpine (MHL) Police Role Equipment fit. This is not a call for tenders. Further information will be published in the Official Journal in the form of a tender notice in the very near future. NOTE: Further information relating to this notice is available on the eTenders Web Site at http://www.etenders.gov.ie/Search/Se....aspx?ID=11158

[Stinger]

Why the EC135 and not the squirel? is it something to do with fleet commonality, namely with the new EC's being purchased by the Aer Corps

[DeV]

The GASU got a second helicopter in 2001 - a Eurocopter EC135 T1 (serial 256). To be best of my knowledge aircrew are provided by a civilian contractor with Garda observers.

http://www.garda.ie/angarda/airsupportunit.html
http://www.garda.ie/angarda/gasu/eurocopter.html
http://www.irishairpics.com/helicopters/index.html

Is this a third helicopter?

[FMolloy]

I thought legislation prevented government aircraft from being flown by civillians, therefore the AC had to fly them?

It says a new EC135, so it's either a third heli or a replacement for one of the others (squirrel maybe?)

[mavman]

Both the squirrell and 135 are flown by air corps pilots, air corps maintain the squirrell and mc alpine, who have a service engineer based at baldonnnel, maintain the 135.

[Goldie fish]

I bet he's popular..

Interesting the way a decision can be made without a tender....How is this possible,and can it be done for other things?

The plan (in 1997) was to eventually have enough aircraft to cover each of the garda Regions,ie South,West,North,DMA. At the moment an aircraft is spending much of the time In Limerick.

[yooklid]

Well I know with a lot of gov agencies (and some commercial ones too) that my company deals with, once we pass an initial tender, if they want to buy more of the same crap, they can just send us a PO without us having to jump through eval hoops

[Aidan]

How is this possible,and can it be done for other things?

We've been through this before Goldie, the state doesn't have to tender for security and military items if it doesn't want to. The EU public procurement specificly allow for this, DOD chose to play by the rules a lot of the time because it gives them a legal template to conduct procurement processes and decisions.

Article 296 of the Treaty sets this out, as do the rules on public procurement, does not require competition in procuring supplies, works and services intended for specifically military purposes and crucial to national security

from

http://europa.eu.int/comm/internal_m...n35/p29_en.htm

and this is the resulting green paper ...

http://europa.eu.int/comm/internal_m...ent/dpp_en.htm

[Goldie fish]

Thanks aidan. One wonders why they bother at all. I'm thinking of the whole S92 fiasco.

[Goldie fish]

Looking through the notice,there is no mention of the Dept of Defence or air corps anywhere.

Remember in the past they were seeking civilian pilots to operate the aircraft? Could they have got around the legal difficulties since then?

[Bosco]

The plan (in 1997) was to eventually have enough aircraft to cover each of the garda Regions,ie South,West,North,DMA. At the moment an aircraft is spending much of the time In Limerick.

Goldie are you surprised???

[Goldie fish]

No...dissapointed they didnt have it there in my day..

[Bosco]

ah

[FMolloy]

According to Don Lavery in today's Sunday Independent, the new heli will replace the Squirrel. He also says Eurocopter wil supply the two LUH's by the end of the year.

[Steamy Window]

The squirrel only arrived in '97...is it worn out already, or just too expensive to upgrade, or...?

[FMolloy]

If Lavery's got it right & they're replacing the Squirrel it's probably for the sake of standardisation.

[Turkey]

I have heard that it is because of standardisation, the squirrel is far from worn out.
Slightly off topic, but the pilots and instructors for the IAC EC-135's have already been picked.



edited for negative spelling ability

[FMolloy]

So, sell off or trade in the Squirrel to off-set some of the new heli's costs?

[Eddie Dillon]

Why not keep the squirrel and have a chopper stationed almost permanently around Dublin, Cork and Limerick?

[FMolloy]

Standardisation, it doesn't make sense to have such variety in a small fleet.

[yooklid]

Standardisation, it doesn't make sense to have such variety in a small fleet.

Eddie, check out our discussions on this issue here:

http://www.irishmilitaryonline.com/b...ead.php?t=6031

This says they are doing something right (finally).

-Y

[Goldie fish]

Standardisation, it doesn't make sense to have such variety in a small fleet.

You are still Looking at 4 otherwise identical aircraft with 2 different engine types. Garda Types using the Turbomeca,while the new Air Corps types will use P&W

[FMolloy]

It's still standardised with the other copper chopper. And considering the GS want to get civvies to do all the work....

[Goldie fish]

Civvies? If they had their way they would have garda pilots(some observers are actually qualified pilots)

[gaff85]

I dont see a problem with serving members of the Gardai actually operating there own Aircraft. There would be no need for new legislation as they are still members of the security forces.