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  • #91
    question the navy?
    Cannon to right of them,
    Cannon to left of them,
    Cannon in front of them
    Volley'd and thunder'd;
    Storm'd at with shot and shell,
    Boldly they rode and well,
    Into the jaws of Death,
    Into the mouth of Hell
    Rode the six hundred.

    Comment


    • #92
      bosco are you drunk?
      Cannon to right of them,
      Cannon to left of them,
      Cannon in front of them
      Volley'd and thunder'd;
      Storm'd at with shot and shell,
      Boldly they rode and well,
      Into the jaws of Death,
      Into the mouth of Hell
      Rode the six hundred.

      Comment


      • #93
        Well latest story I heard is that this large ship may reduce the fleet to 7 in the short term, to make up the difference in crewing size. (one large vessel, and another OPV are being considered to replace Emer,Aoife and Aisling,however the Latter may remain in service longer, with longer times tied up at the quayside))There is about 1400 in the NS at present, and as mentioned earlier, most of the ships are achieving 200 days at sea per year. The Marine engineers job is to ensure that any repairs or maintenance that cannot be done at sea can be done quickly while the ship is tied up at the quayside, minimising the vessels downtime. The majority of work is being done either in the Naval base or in Cork Dockyard.
        Ships are not as maintenance intensive as aircraft, however things are done on a larger scale.


        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by Goldie fish
          Well latest story I heard is that this large ship may reduce the fleet to 7 in the short term, to make up the difference in crewing size. (one large vessel, and another OPV are being considered to replace Emer,Aoife and Aisling,however the Latter may remain in service longer, with longer times tied up at the quayside)).

          Has nobody voiced any opinions about making more use of the reserve personnel to support manning levels to keep the Aisling at sea in this scenario. The navy has come a long way from the dark days when they only had the ability to support just one Flower class at sea using cannibalised parts from the other two Flowers which were no longer sea worthy. It seems odd that anyone in the service would support any backward steps that would effectively cut the current fleet strength.

          Tell me it ain't so Goldie.

          I remember a Granada TV programme from the 1970's which did a pretty good story on the INS. I'll never forget the interview with a group of cadets standing in front of an old rowboat that looked like it served in the Napoleonic wars. The poor guys were asked if they had ever been to sea with the INS and they all shook their heads. I don't know but I think that this may have been the kick in the pants that made an embarrassed Irish Government go out and quickly obtain 3 ex RN minesweepers.

          "When you arise in the morning, think of what a precious privilege it is to be alive - to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love."


          Marcus Aurelius Roman Emperor (161 to 180 A.D.)

          Comment


          • #95
            The NSR are already being used on a regular basis to crew Naval vessels. However it is a small force, and most of them have full time jobs, and are unable to give the 4 weeks that is now required for Patrols.

            I think you misunderstand me somewhat. I am not suggesting that either Aoife or Aisling would be mothballed,on the contrary, both ships would remain at full readiness. However getting the crews is the difficulty. The Navy, like the rest of the DF has its establishment set at a certain figure, and they are prevented from recruiting above this figure. The Kiwis are suffering a similar problem, but they are finding "if you build it, they will come". As more of the public see the great progress that the Navy makes in new ships and capabilities, you will attract a greater cross section of potential recruit. But until that is done, the NS have to make do with the people it has, who are admittedly under pressure to juggle home life and the Governments expectations of vessel availability.
            If each ship is spending 200+ days a rear on patrol, and when its not at sea its crew are getting caught for duties up to 1 in 4, then you will see greater wastage in the long term.

            The solution as it was explained to me was to scale back the operations of P22 and 23 following the retirement of P21, to increase their usable Life beyond their proposed retirement date. This will allow for a longer workup for the New vessels. The Crew that would normally be on the vessel tied up would be reassigned to the Newer Larger crewed vessel.
            P51,52 and 53 will be available for Longer patrols.
            P61 will be available for longer patrols when not engaged in her secondary tasks,
            P31 will be available for longer patrols.
            P22 and P23 will alternate their active service towards the eventual end of their careers, maximising their availability until P61 is capable of fulfilling her longer Patrol routine, and will hopefully be capable of carrying out the patrol tasks previously carried out by the smaller P20s. The P20s will then be gracefully retired.
            So in place of 2 CPV,1 HPV 3 OPV and 2 LPV, you have 2 CPV, 1 HPV,3 LPV and 1 Blue/green. You have one vessel less, but you are theoretically able to fulfil more patrol days.

            WHat happens when the CPVs have to be replaced is a discussion for another thread, and another day.

            You still have a fleet of Larger ships than ever before in service. This is not just an irish solution. The RN are doing the exact same thing at the moment, reducing their Fleet numbers for more capable vessels.

            The Key, according to my source, is not actually the ships themselves, but the manning of them. The Irish NS has always been keen to keep the same crew with a vessel for as long as is practical. Some Senior ratings have spent their entire careers on one vessel. However the current model worldwide is to have a crew in excess of that required aboard the vessel.
            If the vessel requires a crew of 45, then it has a crew of 70. This allows people to leave the ship for Leave, courses etc, without impacting on the vessels availability. However it does require the cooperation of those in the base who do not want to go to sea, as well as those responsible for recruiting.
            My one regret during last years open day was meeting the otherwise enthusaistic O/Sig, who looked forward to going to sea on one of the smaller vessels, because "their patrols are shorter".
            There is no place in a modern naval force for sailors who do not want to go to sea.


            Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

            Comment


            • #96
              Bandit the vessel that is displayed at beginging of the thread is a very capable design part of its design which is clearly displayed that it is capable of Embarkation And Operation of Landing craft similiar to the Landing Craft Utility (LCU) type which have been previouly been utilised by Overseas Army elements in Liberia operationing from the Dutch Rotterdam Class support vessel they did not need any port facilitys to operate from they just landed personnel and equipment (Mowags,CSS Trucks and Nissians) on the beach which had been "recce-ed" and made acceptable for landings by utilising a kind of lay-down mat that covers the mat on the sand to stop vechicles being slowed down by.

              This operation could easily be preformed by Irish Army and Naval Service personnel operating overseas such operation could be preformed the exact same with little difference at all (Obiviously apart from comparing ship sizes or preformance could easily be done) and this is how such irish Forces could be deployed to hot spots overseas like Sudan etc.. were port facilities are un availible or are in enemy occupation.
              British officer: You're seven minutes late, Mr. Collins.
              Michael Collins: You've kept us waiting 700 years. You can have your seven minutes.

              [As the British flag comes down]

              Michael Collins: So that's what all the bother was about.

              Comment


              • #97
                Max, if you are going to agree with me, can you use the occasional full stop or comma?


                Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by Goldie fish
                  Well latest story I heard is that this large ship may reduce the fleet to 7 in the short term, to make up the difference in crewing size. (one large vessel, and another OPV are being considered to replace Emer,Aoife and Aisling,however the Latter may remain in service longer, with longer times tied up at the quayside))There is about 1400 in the NS at present, and as mentioned earlier, most of the ships are achieving 200 days at sea per year. The Marine engineers job is to ensure that any repairs or maintenance that cannot be done at sea can be done quickly while the ship is tied up at the quayside, minimising the vessels downtime. The majority of work is being done either in the Naval base or in Cork Dockyard.
                  Ships are not as maintenance intensive as aircraft, however things are done on a larger scale.
                  Cheers Goldie that was what I wanted to know.
                  Lifes a bitch, so be her pimp!

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Any idea when the replacement will be confirmed?!?
                    What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

                    Comment


                    • How long is this?



                      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Goldie fish
                        How long is this?

                        3-4 metres?















                        Dr. Venture: Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, we get waylaid by jackassery?

                        Dr. Venture: Dean, you smell like a whore

                        Comment


                        • i'd say 6....but thats off topic!!!But we must be talking at least a year and a half to two years
                          What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

                          Comment


                          • Emer retires in 2007.


                            Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                            Comment


                            • well the brass would want to get their fingers out and sort something wouldnt they
                              What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

                              Comment


                              • The brass are not the problem. It is them who are pushing this program to the relevant gov departments.


                                Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                                Comment

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