Thanks Thanks:  360
Likes Likes:  471
Dislikes Dislikes:  13
Page 4 of 97 FirstFirst ... 234561454 ... LastLast
Results 76 to 100 of 2411

Thread: OPV Replacement

  1. #76
    Seaman mikeym's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Maverick Town
    Posts
    60
    Post Thanks / Like
    Would this "grey and green" ship be involved in fishery protection?

  2. #77
    4 Star General andy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    1,363
    Post Thanks / Like
    on a slightly off thread note, what are irelands plans for naval vessels if we get the major extension to our sea boundaries ? Are there any more plans for naval vessels or is it just this single green/blue ship that is on the cards.

  3. #78
    Intelligence Officer The Blue Max's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Finner Air Station
    Posts
    516
    Post Thanks / Like
    Yes & Yes the prosposed MRV replacement will be used for a number of important task such as Fishery Protection (Patrolling EEZ) "which be there Blue Tasks" also with be capable of being used for such tasks as Amphibious Support Vessel for Army Deployments to overseas locations such as Liberia or Kosovo or possible future missions such Sudan or similiar.. It will also be capable of bringing supplies to Humanitarian Crisis Situations like in West Africa Or South East Asia it would possible of transporting supplies,NGOs and other associated agencys i.e Army Engineers,Medical Corps etc.. "which will be some of there Green Tasks" These are just some of the duties that the New Naval MRV Vessel will be undertaken if it is purchased.

    On the other question of whether the Naval Service are only to recieve a Single MRV there are plans in foot for the NS to recieve Two other vessels to replace to replace the further Two P20 Class have been mentioned personnally I would love to see a further Two P50 Class Purchased to replace them..
    British officer: You're seven minutes late, Mr. Collins.
    Michael Collins: You've kept us waiting 700 years. You can have your seven minutes.

    [As the British flag comes down]

    Michael Collins: So that's what all the bother was about.

  4. #79
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    I imagine each request will be considered on a case by case basis. Perhaps a second vessel of this type would replace Eithne when she is finally due to retire, but I think it would be difficult to justify replacing all The P20 class with a large vessel of this type(But it would be nice).The current mixture of Large(p50) medium(p20) and small(p40) patrol vessels is probably the best mix, given the different roles that the Naval Service carry out.

    Its "Blue/Green" Mikey, relating to the roles undertaken(not the ships colour). Fishery Protection is considered a "Blue" role, while carrying equipment or troops to missions overseas is traditionally a "Green" role.

  5. #80
    Recruit
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    7
    Post Thanks / Like
    You would think the PDF are landing troops on a weekly basis. This type of ship would be used three or four times a year for re-supply missions, in the mean time P21 will be gone soon gone and the other seven ships are trying to take up the slack of fishery protection. The patrol days are gone up again this year and there is a higher number of boardings to be carried out. The NS cant do this with one less ship. Where would she be birthed? We bearly have the numbers at the moment to put the eight ships to sea with the support needed never mind one with a crew of 150. The tax man wouldan't get value foe money out of this ship. What the NS need is anothed version of P51 or P52 that would be more suited to the Rapid Reaction Force (RRF)
    Last edited by Ta Dawn; 12th January 2006 at 07:41.
    The British were met with their own weapons,
    They had gone down into the mire to destroy us and our nation,
    And down after them we had to go.

  6. #81
    Commandant
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    1,937
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Ta Dawn
    You would think the PDF are landing troops on a weekly basis. This type of ship would be used three or four times a year for re-supply missions, in the mean time P21 will be gone soon gone and the other seven ships are trying to take up the slack of fishery protection. The patrol days are gone up again this year and there is a higher number of boardings to be carried out. The NS cant do this with one less ship. Where would she be birthed? We bearly have the numbers at the moment to put the eight ships to sea with the support needed never mind one with a crew of 150. The tax man wouldan't get value foe money out of this ship. What the NS need is anothed version of P51 or P52 that would be more suited to the Rapid Reaction Force (RRF)

    Did you read any of the above posts at all? I think the naval service know what's best for themselves. Also, it's been stated on this site, a few times now, that there has been space made available for this new, larger vessel in the naval base.
    Last edited by pym; 12th January 2006 at 09:20.

  7. #82
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    Any relation to the Previously banned Waterford based sluggie, "the dawn"?

  8. #83
    Recruit
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    7
    Post Thanks / Like
    Sluggie?????????? I have the balls to go and do the regular PDF, not like yourself, someone who sits around reading and talking about it. Yes there is room being made in the baisin, but when a ship of this dimensions is alongside the west wall and there is ships alongside the east wall it dosnt leave much room for the likes of P31 P51 or P52 much room to move around. Think about reality and not about what your dreaming of.
    The British were met with their own weapons,
    They had gone down into the mire to destroy us and our nation,
    And down after them we had to go.

  9. #84
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    There is no need to go all RDF v PDF here. I have a proper well paying job in civvy street, the reserve is something I do in my spare time. Now Grow up, Make your point(if any) and back it up.
    I do not "dream" these posts. Most of the information i post here is given to me from Officers and senior rates of the NS.

    Its odd that you have the same surname as a former waterford based sluggie who we banned for insulting Female members of the Waterford NSR, and myself.Same sig as him too. Heard he got spanked by the NSR after we banned him...

  10. #85
    Banned User
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    933
    Post Thanks / Like
    I tend to agrre with Ta Dawn . We appear to need more ships and more people to crew them and as he implies should the navy invest in a ship that will give them increased capability for something that they may seldom if ever have to use. Yes I know someone will come back and say why not build ships without main gun as it will seldom be used but there is a probablity that it will be used.
    Perhaps also the value of installing very expensive complex sensors and fire control systems also need to be reevaluated. Perhaps less sophisticated gear , would be better value for money and allow more ships more naval presence etc.

  11. #86
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    What expensive complex sensors and fire control systems are you talking about exactly? Have you even read the thread?
    I am pretty sure Cdr Mellet knows a bit more about naval ops than failed naval reservist Ta Dawn. I'll take Mellets word, if you don't mind.

  12. #87
    Banned User
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    933
    Post Thanks / Like
    Yes I am sure Mellet knows a lot more about Naval matters than Ta Dawn and I am sure me as well and I am sure Mellet is a very dedicated professional officer however Brass in all services in all armies enjoy empire building, a liitle subjective judgement at time etc. Just look at the history of military procurement and dare I say doctrine over the years to recall some momunmental cock ups from the brass or those who should know not only with our little band but with all armies, navies airforces etc. . The Dauphins for an example.. Who remembers the 203 sets
    As for Ta Dawn being a failed sluggie well he is entirled to his opinion. I even spent a while when I was a scoolboy in the sluggies myself 303s and a trip on the Banba ...now I am showing my age and then went on to bigger bangs ..Anyway the point is he is entitled to his opinion..

  13. #88
    Banned User
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    933
    Post Thanks / Like
    Oh by the Blue Max way how in gods name are they going to deploy the ship to Sth and East Sudan--where the hassle is the only decent port is in port Sudan. a long way away and in Enemy terr. so as `to speak.

  14. #89
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by BANDIT
    ..Anyway the point is he is entitled to his opinion..
    Oddly enough, no he isn't. He was initially banned from this website for being abusive to other members of the naval reserve and IMO members,and he gave up his right to give his opinion here. He has since been moderated and will be banned again should he decide to have any further abusive outbursts.

    The Officers of the naval service did not select the Dauphin.

  15. #90
    2/Lt Bosco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Tipperary
    Posts
    1,649
    Post Thanks / Like
    Question the navy have roughly 1000 personel can the handle a ship this big? Bear in mind im coming from an aero background where I here that a plane only need 20 man hours per flying hour I think is good. IS there such a thing with ships i.e. amount of time in dock before it can go out to sea.
    Lifes a bitch, so be her pimp!

  16. #91
    Soldier of Misfortune eelmonster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    312
    Post Thanks / Like
    question the navy?
    Cannon to right of them,
    Cannon to left of them,
    Cannon in front of them
    Volley'd and thunder'd;
    Storm'd at with shot and shell,
    Boldly they rode and well,
    Into the jaws of Death,
    Into the mouth of Hell
    Rode the six hundred.

  17. #92
    Soldier of Misfortune eelmonster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    312
    Post Thanks / Like
    bosco are you drunk?
    Cannon to right of them,
    Cannon to left of them,
    Cannon in front of them
    Volley'd and thunder'd;
    Storm'd at with shot and shell,
    Boldly they rode and well,
    Into the jaws of Death,
    Into the mouth of Hell
    Rode the six hundred.

  18. #93
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    Well latest story I heard is that this large ship may reduce the fleet to 7 in the short term, to make up the difference in crewing size. (one large vessel, and another OPV are being considered to replace Emer,Aoife and Aisling,however the Latter may remain in service longer, with longer times tied up at the quayside))There is about 1400 in the NS at present, and as mentioned earlier, most of the ships are achieving 200 days at sea per year. The Marine engineers job is to ensure that any repairs or maintenance that cannot be done at sea can be done quickly while the ship is tied up at the quayside, minimising the vessels downtime. The majority of work is being done either in the Naval base or in Cork Dockyard.
    Ships are not as maintenance intensive as aircraft, however things are done on a larger scale.

  19. #94
    Aha: Death=Preconception Lordinajamjar's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,705
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldie fish
    Well latest story I heard is that this large ship may reduce the fleet to 7 in the short term, to make up the difference in crewing size. (one large vessel, and another OPV are being considered to replace Emer,Aoife and Aisling,however the Latter may remain in service longer, with longer times tied up at the quayside)).

    Has nobody voiced any opinions about making more use of the reserve personnel to support manning levels to keep the Aisling at sea in this scenario. The navy has come a long way from the dark days when they only had the ability to support just one Flower class at sea using cannibalised parts from the other two Flowers which were no longer sea worthy. It seems odd that anyone in the service would support any backward steps that would effectively cut the current fleet strength.

    Tell me it ain't so Goldie.

    I remember a Granada TV programme from the 1970's which did a pretty good story on the INS. I'll never forget the interview with a group of cadets standing in front of an old rowboat that looked like it served in the Napoleonic wars. The poor guys were asked if they had ever been to sea with the INS and they all shook their heads. I don't know but I think that this may have been the kick in the pants that made an embarrassed Irish Government go out and quickly obtain 3 ex RN minesweepers.

  20. #95
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    The NSR are already being used on a regular basis to crew Naval vessels. However it is a small force, and most of them have full time jobs, and are unable to give the 4 weeks that is now required for Patrols.

    I think you misunderstand me somewhat. I am not suggesting that either Aoife or Aisling would be mothballed,on the contrary, both ships would remain at full readiness. However getting the crews is the difficulty. The Navy, like the rest of the DF has its establishment set at a certain figure, and they are prevented from recruiting above this figure. The Kiwis are suffering a similar problem, but they are finding "if you build it, they will come". As more of the public see the great progress that the Navy makes in new ships and capabilities, you will attract a greater cross section of potential recruit. But until that is done, the NS have to make do with the people it has, who are admittedly under pressure to juggle home life and the Governments expectations of vessel availability.
    If each ship is spending 200+ days a rear on patrol, and when its not at sea its crew are getting caught for duties up to 1 in 4, then you will see greater wastage in the long term.

    The solution as it was explained to me was to scale back the operations of P22 and 23 following the retirement of P21, to increase their usable Life beyond their proposed retirement date. This will allow for a longer workup for the New vessels. The Crew that would normally be on the vessel tied up would be reassigned to the Newer Larger crewed vessel.
    P51,52 and 53 will be available for Longer patrols.
    P61 will be available for longer patrols when not engaged in her secondary tasks,
    P31 will be available for longer patrols.
    P22 and P23 will alternate their active service towards the eventual end of their careers, maximising their availability until P61 is capable of fulfilling her longer Patrol routine, and will hopefully be capable of carrying out the patrol tasks previously carried out by the smaller P20s. The P20s will then be gracefully retired.
    So in place of 2 CPV,1 HPV 3 OPV and 2 LPV, you have 2 CPV, 1 HPV,3 LPV and 1 Blue/green. You have one vessel less, but you are theoretically able to fulfil more patrol days.

    WHat happens when the CPVs have to be replaced is a discussion for another thread, and another day.

    You still have a fleet of Larger ships than ever before in service. This is not just an irish solution. The RN are doing the exact same thing at the moment, reducing their Fleet numbers for more capable vessels.

    The Key, according to my source, is not actually the ships themselves, but the manning of them. The Irish NS has always been keen to keep the same crew with a vessel for as long as is practical. Some Senior ratings have spent their entire careers on one vessel. However the current model worldwide is to have a crew in excess of that required aboard the vessel.
    If the vessel requires a crew of 45, then it has a crew of 70. This allows people to leave the ship for Leave, courses etc, without impacting on the vessels availability. However it does require the cooperation of those in the base who do not want to go to sea, as well as those responsible for recruiting.
    My one regret during last years open day was meeting the otherwise enthusaistic O/Sig, who looked forward to going to sea on one of the smaller vessels, because "their patrols are shorter".
    There is no place in a modern naval force for sailors who do not want to go to sea.

  21. #96
    Intelligence Officer The Blue Max's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Finner Air Station
    Posts
    516
    Post Thanks / Like
    Bandit the vessel that is displayed at beginging of the thread is a very capable design part of its design which is clearly displayed that it is capable of Embarkation And Operation of Landing craft similiar to the Landing Craft Utility (LCU) type which have been previouly been utilised by Overseas Army elements in Liberia operationing from the Dutch Rotterdam Class support vessel they did not need any port facilitys to operate from they just landed personnel and equipment (Mowags,CSS Trucks and Nissians) on the beach which had been "recce-ed" and made acceptable for landings by utilising a kind of lay-down mat that covers the mat on the sand to stop vechicles being slowed down by.

    This operation could easily be preformed by Irish Army and Naval Service personnel operating overseas such operation could be preformed the exact same with little difference at all (Obiviously apart from comparing ship sizes or preformance could easily be done) and this is how such irish Forces could be deployed to hot spots overseas like Sudan etc.. were port facilities are un availible or are in enemy occupation.
    British officer: You're seven minutes late, Mr. Collins.
    Michael Collins: You've kept us waiting 700 years. You can have your seven minutes.

    [As the British flag comes down]

    Michael Collins: So that's what all the bother was about.

  22. #97
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    Max, if you are going to agree with me, can you use the occasional full stop or comma?

  23. #98
    2/Lt Bosco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Tipperary
    Posts
    1,649
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldie fish
    Well latest story I heard is that this large ship may reduce the fleet to 7 in the short term, to make up the difference in crewing size. (one large vessel, and another OPV are being considered to replace Emer,Aoife and Aisling,however the Latter may remain in service longer, with longer times tied up at the quayside))There is about 1400 in the NS at present, and as mentioned earlier, most of the ships are achieving 200 days at sea per year. The Marine engineers job is to ensure that any repairs or maintenance that cannot be done at sea can be done quickly while the ship is tied up at the quayside, minimising the vessels downtime. The majority of work is being done either in the Naval base or in Cork Dockyard.
    Ships are not as maintenance intensive as aircraft, however things are done on a larger scale.
    Cheers Goldie that was what I wanted to know.
    Lifes a bitch, so be her pimp!

  24. #99
    Major General ODIN's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    3,812
    Post Thanks / Like
    Any idea when the replacement will be confirmed?!?
    What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

  25. #100
    Closed Account Goldie fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    you already know too much
    Posts
    33,440
    Post Thanks / Like
    How long is this?


Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •