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ias
16th January 2003, 14:09
As I live abroad and do not have a subscription to the Irish Times I can only see the headlines on breaking news!

I've just seen that it says the Minister has signed for the new trainers!

Does anyone have any other details?



IAS

Come-quickly
16th January 2003, 16:20
Yeah its 8x pilatus PC-9m for delivery by late 2004, in the end the contract was cut to E40m.
The Turbo props are to replace both the basic and advanced single engine trainer roles as previously filled by the 172's the SF260 and formerly the fougas...
This is the first MILITARY aircraft purchased by the A/c in a long time since they normally plump for cheaper less capable civilian machines at the DOD.

Come-quickly
16th January 2003, 16:23
http://aviation.pol.pl/jpg/02/18030.jpg

Head
16th January 2003, 16:26
Try this, http://www.pilatus-aircraft.com/8_news_information/frameset_news_news.htm

Goldie fish
16th January 2003, 20:32
The Minister on de fence speaks!

http://wwa.rte.ie/news/2003/0116/6news/6news3a.ram

Silver
16th January 2003, 23:04
From what I have read/heard, 4 of the PC-9's will go to BFTS for pilot training and 4 will go to "No 1 Ops Wing" for operational duties.
Is this correct ?
If so, will 4 aircraft be adequate for training ?


The report on Six One News didn't even mention what aircraft was chosen or show a picture of it.
Also, Smithy didn't proclaim the PC-9 to be "our high tech
air defence" - as most of us thought he would !

Goldie fish
19th January 2003, 01:51
You all know I am sure that SunTzu once said(among other things) "Know your enemy",Well This day I have been mostly doing that,and came upon some of the SF websites with that in mind.
What I read there has given me severe pains in my side from laughter :p
Wait till you see what Dublin MP(heh-heh) Anus Snotty had to say about our new warplanes!
Read it and weep!

Purchase of Military Aircraft suggests further moves to erode Irish neutrality and bring us closer to NATO

Sinn Féin spokesperson on International Affairs Aengus Ó Snodaigh TD this evening said that Defence Minister Michael Smiths comments that there can be no military neutrality have exposed the truth behind years of government lies. The Minister made his comments as he announced details of the signing of a contract for NATO compatible military aircraft. Deputy Ó Snodaigh asked if this contract signalled a ``further erosion of Irish neutrality by stealth.''

``Throughout the Nice Treaty campaign we listened to statement after statement from government spokespersons telling us that our neutrality was intact and not influenced by the ongoing militarisation of the EU. But this evening the truth was exposed by Defence Minister Michael Smith when he bluntly stated that there is no such thing as military neutrality.

``Earlier today the Minister announced that a €60 million contract has been signed for 8 Pilatus PC-9M military aircraft for the Air Corps. This aircraft is one recommended and endorsed by NATO.

``We need the Minister to come clean on whether this contract is in fact part of a NATO standardisation effort. If so, the public needs to know where the Government intends this to lead. The last two Nice referenda proved that Irish people value Irish neutrality. If the Government intends to change this policy, in the interest of accountability and transparency they must put their case to the people, not shift their policy incrementally and by stealth.

``In light of the Government's about-face on the Partnership for Peace; their failure to secure a neutrality Protocol to the Nice Treaty; their insistence on allowing Shannon airport to be used for US war preparations and especially in light of the Minister's comment earlier today - the time has come for the Government to clarify their true position on Irish neutrality and to ensure there is a full public debate on this issue and a opportunity for the people to have the final say by way of a referendum.''



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conco
19th January 2003, 12:58
You *really* don't like Sinn Fein do you?

I suppose it all comes down to whether you support neutrality or not, and it seems I'm the only one around here who does...

Aengus doesn't realise that the NATO compliant trainer, is infact the best for the Air Corps (although thats arguable), and what with the EURRF on the horizon and the possibility for the AC to partake in missions, such training with such a trainer would need to take place.

Goldie fish
19th January 2003, 14:56
Never have,never will..Not apologising for it either. Not going to get into it on the air corps board..you know how these things get sidelined.
Neutrality is dead.. Non Alignment is the word!;)

Silver
25th January 2003, 15:55
An updates on the paint scheme or weapons fit for the new trainers ?

Goldie fish
26th January 2003, 00:51
I believe the paint scheme on the Warriors was appreciated by the powers that be,as it reduced drag and weight,was not maintenance intensive,and looked pretty Military. I am not sure if it is the same scheme on the Cessnas,but I would hazard a guess that the new aircraft will be similar. However if they are going to fit air to air weaponry on them I would expect something like the Grey used by RAF Hawk aircraft(air superiority grey :confused: )
http://homepages.tesco.net/~xplanesx/xtra/xx177a.jpg
RAF Hawk T1 in "Air Superiority Grey"
The Casa,being the last new AirCorps aircraft was a break from the normal Hi Viz of the previous Maritime Patrol aircraft for an almost No-Viz blue of the current type.

Whiskey Section
27th January 2003, 19:02
I hope they don't go for silver with dayglo panels like the Fouga's. There was a time mostly in the 70's when nearly all Air corps craft were this manky colour- Provost, Chipmunk to name but two. And before anyone corrects me yes I know these two types came into service in the 60's not 70's. What type of equipment (weapons wise) does the PC 9 boast and would they more capable than the Marchetti and Fouga in this dept. Do you reckon It would be at all feasible to say dedicate two PC 9 to a purely defensive role ie have one on constant standby. But in saying that It would probably be pointless If no viable radar network system is in place.

Regards

Bourkey
30th January 2003, 12:41
I know I for one have said it before, a light AEW Fleet would provide the radar network that Ireland needs. Probably something like a CASA with an Erieye or similar would suffice.