View Full Version : Naval Rank Markings

Goldie fish
6th November 2004, 09:03
Depending on who you talk to,Its either a quill or a comb(not a comb you keep your hair with-but something to do with the feathered end of an arrow).
I'm not gonna argue this one.
Its like a CQMS having a wheel....some people only see the Q
(Thanks to bailer for the images)
Many more say the CS has the wheel...
I once referred to it as the feather and key and was quickly corrected,and told it was Key and comb...(Quill doesnt alliterate as well as comb).
In any case now,all those not involved in either Seamans or Engineering(at sea) will be part of Logs,though considering the way things go in the Army,Engineering too could be considered part of logs..

Its interesting to see that He dealt with Murfs paperwork. There is a good chance that everyone who Joined the NS since 1981 has had their details pass through his hands,and prior to that he was a Training NCO,so some could say that the NS has a lot to be thankful to WO Bates for.

7th November 2004, 22:17
Quill for writing....going back to when the admin branch was broken down in to scribes or writers...and key when the logs side were known as dusries as they looked after clothing and supplies.

Why not ask the man himself as he was a member of this divisionsince time began.

again look at the arm patch it self it is far more descrptive

Goldie fish
7th November 2004, 23:26
I'm not gonna argue this one.

I once referred to it as the feather and key and was quickly corrected,and told it was Key and comb...(Quill doesnt alliterate as well as comb).

At risk of repeating myself

8th November 2004, 13:48
no point in arguing as it is a Quill...my late gran Uncle was divisional officer and as a senior NCO during the Emergency was responsible for the inception of the Branch, bailers images are incorrect....ask any CQMS he will tell lyou its a wheel crossed with a quill and key...what sense would comb make,

Who ever argued with you hasn't a clue of naval insignia or its tradition. Refer them to me I'll soon put them staright.

Goldie fish
9th November 2004, 02:09
:mad: What part of "In not going to argue this one" did you not understand?

Duly edited.

12th November 2004, 03:40
well you did bring it up....!

Goldie fish
12th November 2004, 16:10
Right then smartypants...why do Irish Naval officers wear a star on their rank Markings instead of a curl Like the RN or some more Irish symbol? Considering our Army Officer system follows the British system,as does the Air Corps...

12th November 2004, 16:40
Goldie Fish, in answer to ur last, once heard it was due to been a Republic (no monarch ie). french, yanks etc they all have stars, same as the junior rates they wear a bobbin on their hats. how does that sound?

Goldie fish
12th November 2004, 18:28
I wanted Murf to answer ...The soviet navy also had stars..hardly a republic..

12th November 2004, 19:00
The Union of Socialist Soviet Republics.

Goldie fish
12th November 2004, 19:11
OK,that was a poor example...

12th November 2004, 20:22
sorry goldie for spoiling your fun, jumped to fast without read the thread correctly.
Am I right so, is that the answer?

Goldie fish
12th November 2004, 20:26
I dont know...its not a quiz..

Is Indiarrrrrrrr a republic? Or is it part of the Commonwealth?

13th November 2004, 19:12
<font face="tahoma" color="#ff9900">Well,

Being Resident expert on at least 1 Subject Here's My 2 Cents...

The CQ symbol is "A wheel, a Quill, A Key, a 'Q' and a Rifle. Symbolising Transport, Paperwork (encompassing all records accounts etc.), Stores, Quaters (accomodation) and Weapons (as in the Storage of). Now due to the haphazard way the military authorities in this country handle the 'heraldry' and symbolism of our insignia these get mixed up. The Quill has sometimes been replaced with an Arrow, Sometimes with a sewing needle.

Now in the New Logs corps symbol the Quill and Rifle have been replaced by a needle and Thread respectively. With the Addition of a Snake (have to let the Medics join in)

The Naval Variant for the Admin Brance would originally have been a Quill and Key. Which over time in Rank marking lessons been simplified to Comb and keys. and passed on as learnt.

The Irish Naval Rank markings reflect the American ones more than the Royal Navy. And yes a Star is more commonly used by Republics as in non "royal" navies.


Goldie fish
13th November 2004, 22:31
Thanks bailer...shows i didnt dream it..

14th November 2004, 01:37
The yanks vary the symbol over the rings according to branch...medics wear a diamond ..JAG wear an acorn... the star is a symbol of republic as is the bobbin....now why is the difference between the width of the two white bars on the blue jean collar....and it has nothing to do with the six counties...why do navies wear flared trousers and what is the silk scarf for....sorry goldie ...Iknow its in the book I loaned u....proves if u read it or not...

Its a ****ing quill....and always will be!

Goldie fish
14th November 2004, 02:00
Why do we have subbies with a bar and a half?

15th November 2004, 04:05
Because we followed the US in not having midshipmen...who were semi qualified cadets . Our Subbies are not full Lieutenants but are watch keepers with qualification in a particular role ..ie gunnery officers. So the basic qualification before watchkeeping sets them apart from Ensigns who are still seen as officers under training...cannot take a watch on their own and cannot operate as OOD.

Interesting to note that the gunnery officer is the executive branch divisional officer aboard ship but only holds the same gunnery qualification as an Ordinary Seaman or Able seamna which is an SG3....SG 2 is the qualification required to progress to leading hand but the course is not applicable to commissioned ranks. So theoretically an AB/Sea Gnr may be more qualified in the ships weapons than his divisional officer.

Vice Admiral
15th November 2004, 17:56
Two points:
Ensigns do perform OOD ashore and alongside, only restriction is at anchor.
S/Lt in appointment as Guns is not less qualified than an ordinary gunner, there is an entire gunnery course not required by ratings for Gunnery officers before they can run a shoot - they are also ordinance account holders and that is no small task in itself.

15th November 2004, 20:37
Used to be the way as when i was on my SG3 the class ahead of us were all S/lts and were told that they would never fire the weapons again having qualified on the SG3. Ensigns are not allowed to do OOD when a ship is on less than four hours sailing notice...and as I said in the olden days they were not allowed to a full days OOD in the base either........things change! I was aware of the anchor watch situation.