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Turkey
16th October 2006, 08:12
The rest of the P20 class will face retirement in the next few years, what d0 members feel should happen to these ships,
Should be one be preserved?
Should one be tied up as a static training vessel?
Should they sold as rich mans toys as the class leader was[P21 Deirdra]?
Should they be just scrapped?

Bravo20
16th October 2006, 14:55
I admit I attach very little sentimental value to material objects. In my opinion the ships should be disposed of such a manner that would be the most economical value to the state. i.e. which every will generate more money either scrapping or selling them off.

Bundy
16th October 2006, 16:52
are they gonna use the cannons on the next ships they get

DeV
16th October 2006, 19:01
Which option would result in the most money for the NS?

hptmurphy
16th October 2006, 19:16
We have only begun to realise our military heritage..why neglect the naval service..these were the first state ship s built by the state in the state..at least one should be retained as a maritime muesum.

It is too late for the other types..but they hold enough precedent to warrant historical preservation.

Goldie fish
16th October 2006, 19:17
Last time out, sale didn't do as well as was hoped. Then again P20 was well past being on her last legs.
Scrapping isnt much better.
Preserving, while well intentioned, is very expensive, as many preserved warships in the UK are finding out.(Birkinhead for example).
Unless you have an assured fund for the continued preservation of the ship, its better off selling it to the highest bidder.
As for the ships weapons, the 20mm GAMBO are being phased out, and replaced with a newer Rhein metall as mentioned elsewhere. The 40mm Bofors can be either used as a secondary or main armament on future vessels, or modified for Land use(their original role) and passed on to Air Defence Regiments.

armedboarder
28th October 2006, 14:26
Static trainer would be of huge benifet to the college, might even be room for the bridge to be lopped off and a simulator put in place. Also would be a huge aid to an already faltering NSR. No offence to the 10% who are outstanding personnel and always ready to give up their spare time to provide assistance for sea reliefs.

Sea Toby
28th October 2006, 23:52
I am opposed to static displays. There are many steam locomotives in parks throughout America rusting away as static displays behind chain linked fences. They are dying a very slow death. There are also many museum ships in America no better off than these steam locomotives. Not one of them is earning their keep.

The ship earning the most is still running red ink, the Queen Mary in Long Beach. As a hotel beside the Long Beach convention center, its still losing money.

I would prefer sinking them as diving wrecks, not a choice in the poll. Otherwise, send them to the scrappers.

Goldie fish
29th October 2006, 03:25
Diving wrecks seem to be an honourable end for old warships these days. I see the Aussies, and recently NZ and the US have disposed of a lot of their old vessels in this way.

Turkey
29th October 2006, 08:25
Diving wrecks seem to be an honourable end for old warships these days. I see the Aussies, and recently NZ and the US have disposed of a lot of their old vessels in this way.

I have to say that I like this idea, is there a suitable site to put down a ship the size of a P20, where it would be accessable and safe from storm damage?

Kieran
29th October 2006, 16:14
Diving wrecks seem to be an honourable end for old warships these days. I see the Aussies, and recently NZ and the US have disposed of a lot of their old vessels in this way.

That would be a good idea alright, i remember when they sunk H.M.S. silla ? off plymouth for this porpose

Sea Toby
29th October 2006, 16:34
I wanted to add that there are a few restored steam locomotives in America that are actually running daily as part of a theme park or tourist attraction. I heavily prefer an operatonal steam locomotive over a static display locomotive. Its great when a person can see, hear, touch, and smell an operating steam locomotive.

While a person maybe able to see or touch a static display, one does not get the sense of an operating one. For a nation the size of Ireland, having one static display as part of a larger national maritime museum in my mind would be okay, similar to America's Air and Space Museum. But laying her up as a tourist trap next to a pier won't be profitable. Eventually the ship will rust away, dying a slow death, because the ship won't be able to earn its keep.

At least a ship sunk as a diving wreck benefits the economy as a tourist attraction, and most importantly costs nothing to keep. Plus, the ship continues wholly with her name.

At first the Queen Mary was profitable. Long Beach built a large convention center and there were a shortage of hotels to serve it twenty years ago. However, within the past twenty years hotels were built in downtown Long Beach, all with larger rooms than the cabins on the Queen Mary. While the ship has been painted above the waterline, below she hasn't seen a drydock in twenty years. Eventually, she end up in the same condition as the battleship Texas, sitting on the mud next to her pier.

Goldie fish
29th October 2006, 16:47
There is plenty of space in the east of Cork Harbour or Bantry Bay should such a plan be considered.
The wreck near Bere Island that protrudes from the water is quite popular with divers, but can be dangerous to dive on, due to the numerous pishing paraphenalia that has become entangled on it.
As for Static trainer, the simulators in the college do much more than any ship could do in the way of realistic training.

discostu
13th December 2006, 09:48
Static trainer would be of huge benifet to the college, might even be room for the bridge to be lopped off and a simulator put in place. Also would be a huge aid to an already faltering NSR. No offence to the 10% who are outstanding personnel and always ready to give up their spare time to provide assistance for sea reliefs.


Have to agree with this... learning stuff in the classroom or the seamanship bay is all very well but the best training is hands on itself. As for the NSR I must say that most of the personnel that come out are able to a help in some way or another by the end of a patrol and I would welcome them anytime. It means that some of our permanent seamen can actually get their leave.