Russians' armour in Georgia...

[GoneToTheCanner]

Hi there
The Russian T-72s, as used by the Georgians, seemed to have followed the time-honoured convention of popping their turrets off when hit, as seen in downtown Gori.Also, they seem to have brought in T-62s and -55s.Not exactly premier-league stuff...
regards
GttC

[Fireplace]

Still, old T-62 and BMP-1 humiliate the western world.

[hptmurphy]

No point in commiting the good stuff when the 'enemy' still uses the older stuff and looisng the expensive gear in minor events.

The sheer amount of older tanks that the Russians can field would be enough to overwhelm a country like georgia

Hardly worth risking the more expensive kit to land mines or RPGs where the loss of a T55 or T62 will proabaly do the job and if they are hit or destroyed the loss is far less expensive.

[golden rivet]

could this lead to worse conflict as it seems to be a challenge to the west and what is the main reason for the invasion

[easyrider]

Remember it all started when Georgian forces went into South Ossetia, thereby challenging the Russians. The main problem is that idiot who's President of Georgia.

[Cereb]

Remember it all started when Georgian forces went into South Ossetia, thereby challenging the Russians. The main problem is that idiot who's President of Georgia.

Well that's a matter of interpretation. The Russians have been supplying the rebels with some pretty heavy equipment and probably gave them the push to start shelling Georgian forces thereby initiating a Georgian response. It was planned by Russia from the beginning until the end.

[greyfox]

Remember it all started when Georgian forces went into South Ossetia, thereby challenging the Russians. The main problem is that idiot who's President of Georgia.

that is a rather sweeping statement to make the Russians have been stirring the pot in the region since the fall of communism and the peace loving south occetians were skirmishing on the border in weeks before the gorgions attacked ,, i would say the russians have alot to answer for invading a sovereign country. gorgions probably have allot to take a large portion ot the blame too .
The Russians keep most of the good stuff on the Chinese border ,, and in west the older stuff goes to areas where they face less of a threat

[Come-quickly]

Easyrider: Pot - kettle.

[paul g]

The russians are paranoid about the way the americans have been developing bases around their border in the past decade or so, and rightly so.

The T-72 has a number of design flaws especially the storage of ammunition propellant for its main gun, hence when its hit the results tend to be disasterous, the earlier T-55 and T62 are older, but better designed.

[Victor]

The russians are paranoid about the way the americans have been developing bases around their border in the past decade or so, and rightly so.

They've been doing it for nearly a century or more from the Russia point of view.

[paul g]

Victor,

Can you tell us what source the attachment comes from.

[Aidan]

Finland is in kind of a strange category on that one. And Kazakstan and Belarus are a bit dubious also. Could that map be 10 years old?

[Fireplace]

The carousel autoloader with ammunition reserve stored under the floor is a death trap. You would have thought that the Russians would have changed things around when developing the T-72 into the T-90. At the time they probably hadn't got the resources for it. The Ukrainians changed around the T-84(re-developed T-80) with the Turkish tank contest in mind. 120mm gun in a bustle mounted autoloader. With blow out panels it's much safer for the crew, although the reserve doesn't seem to be kept in an armoured compartment like with western tanks.

Also worth nothing is that the Belgian CT-CV, talked about here for the Mowag, also has a bustle autoloader.

[Aidan]

Apparently it's the reserve being stored in the open thats the main problem with the T-72B. Russian crews have stopped carrying this reserve - just going with whats in the autoloader - a lot of the tanks you see without a turret didn't lose the turret when hit, rather the crew were able to get out, but the ammunition went off later on and took the turret with it.

The T-71M that the iraqis used had even poorer armour, and generally had full racks of ammunition in the hull and turret. Which was interesting.

It wasn't just the russians who made that mistake - the Leo II has (or had anyways) ammunition stored in the hull next to the driver.

[GoneToTheCanner]

The Russians use to make export (monkey models, as they called them)examples of their tanks with lower-grade armour, no NBC protection, no wading equipment, no fire suppression,etc...
regards
GttC