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  • #31
    What do you mean by that? (not being sarky or confrontational just curious to know)
    It is accepted that a vehicle of the APC is more efficent in dismounting troops from a powered ramp at the rear as opposed to Car type doors that the Sisus had. Removing of equipment is also eased by having a ramp. The tow doors at the rear of the Sisu split the entry exit thus limiting the nature of the load. the fact that the quite weighty doors had to be manually opened to allow troops to de buss was also seen as time consuming and even in some cases quite dangerous

    Surely in any patrol situation the troops would already be dismounted and ready to fight and if they were mounted then they would be in a convoy situation in which case they would withdraw quickly from the kill zone then, if required, dismount elsewhere out of the line of fire and engage any enemy.
    No bring the troops in range of the enemy and let them de buss while covered by the RWS or Turret weapon and let them egage the enemey at close quarters...Patrolling walking along behind an APC is akin to walking across the somme behind a tank.

    Do you mean that the ramp makes it easier to dismount?
    Have you not tried it. I sure you'll see the point when you get a chance to debus from both vehicles.


    BMP 76 was a quarter of the price and we didn't by them either.Technology outdated basic machine not as flexible as Mowag

    Tongue in Cheek, we had signed up for Eufor we needed compatible fight vehicles with the rest of the Euro super army, Mowag put us right up there and gave us credible APCs to operate alongside any european force, as highlighted in Liberia, Chad and Eiritrea.

    In terms of compatibilty with vehicles already in service with the PFP the Mowag put us on a level playing field without having to go down the IFV role.

    We have five variants in service, Patria could not match this and the level of technologhy built into each vehicle.

    Small proffessional army never going to able to operate large number of cheap vehicles so why not buy top of the range , knowing that you at least have the capacity to operate as part of PfP army.. which leads me to my Final poit.

    Sisu quite a good vehicle , I liked them,

    Mowag , they have been in service 10 years now and have acquitted themselves very well in some less that ideal trouble spots, the technology has moved on, Mowag has been good for the army moving them to the next level.

    Ok they are far from perfect, over priced, trouble some at times, spares an issue, I don't like them, but the army seems happy enough..and we haven't lost one person through a Mowag related incident,

    If keeps the lads and lassies safe..that'll do me.
    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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    • #32
      Well troops this is all good stuff and its great 2 get diffrent views, as 4 me its the Driving and the capeabilities in the roughest mountain areas that the Sisu passed all tests. I done a couple of Patrols in Norbatt and one was the Eagle Patrol which is the highest outpost in south lebanon (norbatt). Do not try this patrol with a hangover(lol). But the Sisu was the car 4 the job and i dont think i would try it in any other vehicle. I just think its a Fantastic Armoured Car. And thats just my opinion.

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      • #33
        The Sisu has been replaced in Finland, and other countries by the Patria AMV has it not.

        The Sisu was a good vehicle for its time, but the piranha offered a lot more with regards to development ( hence why it beat pandur), and given the americans have the stryker, then a mid life upgrade will provide a better vehicle

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Border Bunny View Post
          That pic was taken in Iraq not Afghanistan.
          Thanks 4 the pic Bunny,I love this Car.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by shanescott View Post
            Thanks 4 the pic Bunny,I love this Car.
            lol - thanks alot shane - i posted both those pics of the SISU!!!!

            lol
            RGJ

            ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

            The Rifles

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            • #36
              Surely in any patrol situation the troops would already be dismounted and ready to fight and if they were mounted then they would be in a convoy situation in which case they would withdraw quickly from the kill zone then, if required, dismount elsewhere out of the line of fire and engage any enemy.
              Evacuating your wounded in a stretcher is a hell of a lot easier when the stretcher carriers can just walk in and set it down instead of climbing in, and then trying to pass the casualty through.
              Plus other cargo is more limited by the size of the door as well.
              And, of course, it's just a hell of a lot easier to get into a ramp, esp when wearing armour and carrying a rifle.

              NTM
              Driver, tracks, troops.... Drive and adjust!!

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              • #37
                Originally posted by California Tanker View Post
                Evacuating your wounded in a stretcher is a hell of a lot easier when the stretcher carriers can just walk in and set it down instead of climbing in, and then trying to pass the casualty through.
                Plus other cargo is more limited by the size of the door as well.
                And, of course, it's just a hell of a lot easier to get into a ramp, esp when wearing armour and carrying a rifle.

                NTM

                This seems to be a silly fault with the brit warrior afv, a heavy side hinged door at the back. (powered by a hydraulic double acting actuator)

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by sofa View Post
                  This seems to be a silly fault with the brit warrior afv, a heavy side hinged door at the back. (powered by a hydraulic double acting actuator)
                  that same 'silly' door saved my mates life in Iraq - he was stood at the back door of the Warrior briefing the troops inside when a VBIED detonated near his vehicle. his legs were blown off from the knee down but the door took the blast, protected the rest of his body and saved his life.

                  every cloud has a silver lining...
                  RGJ

                  ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

                  The Rifles

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by shanescott View Post
                    Thanks 4 the pic Bunny,I love this Car.
                    Yeah, nice picture Bunny, well done.

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                    • #40
                      RGJ, What becomes of these poor soldiers like your mate who receive these horrible life changing injuries ? Do they end up on disabilities for the rest of there life, or (hopefully)
                      will the British Army find something for them to do?.

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                      • #41
                        well sofa, it depends to be honest on the severity of the injury and how the soldier feels himself after the event.

                        i have some friends who were platoon sergeants before they were injured, now with no legs running the training wing (excuse the pun) from behind a desk or working in the med centre or in the stores somewhere or if they are up to it - they can get even more involved and go on operations again:

                        www - Amputee returns to Duty

                        if the soldier is happy doing a job like this, he is mentally sound and we think his morale will be OK then this sort of job is offered in an effort to keep him 'employable' but sometimes this just isn't an option and they must leave with a substantial pay-out and disability payment for the rest of their lives.

                        but it's not uncommon now to see a couple of soldiers in any barracks with artificial limbs or other scars from the battlefield. in every married quarter patch now there are also specially adapted houses for soldiers injured in battle who have mobility problems.

                        support for PTSD is also much better now than it used to be and ALL soldiers are required to 'decompress' before being released from their unit after operations.

                        things aren't perfect but they are getting better.
                        RoyalGreenJacket
                        Commander in Chief
                        Last edited by RoyalGreenJacket; 24 January 2010, 00:10.
                        RGJ

                        ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

                        The Rifles

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