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  • Hopeless Humvees et al

    Hope Smithy has noted the rather disasterous showing of the humvee, LAV [Piranha 111] and British armoured landrovers in Iraq. The US grunts have now nicknamed it the hopeless hummer and renamed the M1A3 MBT the petrol can. Despite the humvees' problems being widely publicised in Somalia everyone is still using it as a mini apc!!!!
    I know we are a banana republic but that is no reason to send out the boys in borrowed British army landrovers in Liberia. If the same speed and efficiency that was demonstrated in acquiring the Learjet for VIP TRANSPORT was applied to equipment acquisition for all three services then we really would be able to interoperate with other forces on peace enforcement missions.
    Please explain why the Celtic Tiger hasn't produced the 80 armoured vehicles [small] promised during the restructuring? Please let them be Mowag Eagle 4,or krauss Maffei Dingo or Auverland 4.
    Urgent recommendations : sufficient Mowag Piranha 3/4 [uparmoured with 25 ATK turret] to equip 3 battalions. These should be supplied with rear video camera as every other western army has been. This order should include Piranha 4 10 * 10 raised roof command vehicles and the 2m Euro Piranha ARV crane and winch and not the fitters vehicles that Smithy euphemistically calls ARV!!!!!
    The army urgently needs new armoured recce vehicles for the cavalry. 40 Alvis Rooikat 105mm or Iveco-Oto Melara Centauro 120mm armoured with the new ceramic additional "plate" from Germany. NB same armour package is being supplied to Stryker apc [Piranha 4 ] for US infantry and Canadian army.
    60 armoured Pinzgauer 6x6 all terrain vehicles to pull 105mm artillery.They can carry 6 crew and shells and charges instead of those dilapitated 20 year + Acmats.
    Finally will someone for Godsake employ a qualified transport manager. How many different types of vehicle do 8000 troops need? Sell everything + spares and implement a five year procurement plan with Just-In-Time spares based around 4 vehicle types.Specialist vehicles such as dedicated heavy recovery vehicles, fuel bowsers, NBC detection vehicles would be in addition to this. It is frightening to think that we have "equipped" the army with 2 heavy recovery vehicles and they are both from different suppliers!!!! Lets hope the boys don't need one in Liberia, Eritrea and Liberia and Donnellys Hollow at the same time!!!!!
    Finally, could we have the correct helmets to fit individual comms, about 6000 should do and about 1500 FN Minimi for the new 4 man fire team [like every other army in the Western world. Thankyou.

    If the politicians, people and the media don't realise the importance and legal requirements for an army, then transfer everyone to the Garda and merge the"navy" and "air corps" into a coastguard. Oh sorry what's that you say? They are planning to do this anyway! Oh well, we might as well go to the pub then!!
    Sarsfield

  • #2
    The anger is strong in this one.
    It is only by contemplation of the incompetent that we can appreciate the difficulties and accomplishments of the competent.

    Comment


    • #3
      can you imagine the crusty green outcry ? that could push the defence budget to an astronomical 1% GDP are you mad ! with all those hospital trolleys in the corridors , and the crime wave sweeping the country , and anyhow the hard working TDs are long overdue a pay rise , good points though sarsfield ,
      "take a look to the sky right before you die, its the last time you will"

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      • #4
        If the government got rid of some of the bloody tribunals maybe more money could be spent on the Defence forces and hospitals.
        What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

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        • #5
          I wouldn't worry about the cavs requirement for new AFVs as they are being retasked in the CTR role with training ongoing at the moment and the next deployment to liberia will signal the cavs commencement in that role.
          Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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          • #6
            Forgive me...

            "Hopeless Hummer"? Never heard that one yet.

            "M1A3 MBT?"

            "Petrol Can"

            What have you been smoking?

            The M1114s are doing pretty well, there just aren't enough of them. One of ours ran over a mine with a 152mm shell under it, it flipped over the vehicle but the armoured crew compartment remained intact.

            Stryker (LAV) users I've run into over here seem quite satisfied with the vehicle.

            There's no such thing as an M1A3

            Americans don't even use the word 'Petrol'. So I would be reluctant to say that they call anything a petrol can, even if it's a fictional tank.

            NTM
            Driver, tracks, troops.... Drive and adjust!!

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            • #7
              Originally posted by hptmurphy
              I wouldn't worry about the cavs requirement for new AFVs as they are being retasked in the CTR role with training ongoing at the moment and the next deployment to liberia will signal the cavs commencement in that role.

              Just because the cav is tasked with CTR doesn't mean that they're requirement for new AFV's isn't urgent. CTR is only one of many tasks that the cav is required to undertake.
              Death before Dishonour.

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              • #8
                I assume that CTR is close target Recce. Is direct fire support not one of the roles of the cav?
                When I breeze into that city, people gonna stoop and bow.
                All them women gonna make me, teach 'em what they don't know how

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                • #9
                  I heard,from someone who was speaking with a Col he served with overseas that a large number of Humvee type vehicles are back on the shopping list. This may be an exacceration,but is 100 a lot to expect?


                  Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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                  • #10
                    The vehicles will arrive when the new minister is good and ready to part with the cash.The CTR role requires substantial funding with a requiremnt for the aquisition of more NVG . letsget equipped for the new role before we go overhauling the fleet of vehicles we already have. the upgrades in the AFVS will be seen as a reduction in urgency for replacement.

                    why is such a small corps tasked with so much!
                    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Sorry about the typo, I was referring to the MIA2 which has thrown up many problems since the real conflict started , after George told everyone the war was over. An American crewman said the Abrams has now the same nickname that the Sherman had in WW2 which was coined by British crews. Officially there has been an urgent upgrade ordered due to a previously unaware of chink in the Abrams which has seen it vulnerable to RPG Heat rounds which left it with the propensity to become engulfed in flames. This is not helped as it is the only modern tank to run on 'gasoline'.

                      Regards the Hopeless Hummer, crews have been desperately sourcing local steel plate to weld on the doors while orders for 4 urgent armour upgrade kits have been ordered to be fitted in situ. AM General has now built over 245,000 various models of the HMMWV [Humvee] but its O'GARA HESS that build the armoured versions M1114 / M1116 and so far only 2200 have been manufactured!!!

                      Denmark has not been pleased with there 'armoured humvee' in Yugoslavia/ Bosnia. This is of course the Mowag Eagle 2/ 3, which could explain by Mowag / General Dynamics based the vastly superior Mowag 4 on the Duro chassis.

                      Our US friends should note , despite a recent 'analysis' done in the US, that the Abrams is not the best tank in the world. They should also note a UK Challenger 2 took 8 direct hits from RPG HEAT rounds, turned around and promptly obliterated the ambush!!!!

                      The US Army does not operate LAVs, they pulled out of the competition in the late 80s. The US Marines have had to upgrade their LAVs [ Piranha 3 ] with the same 'mesh' that the UK had to introduce in South Armagh and the Russians introduced in Chechnya to protect against RPGs. The US Army have only recently introduced the Stryker [ Piranha 4] into service and none have left CONUS yet. Secondly please note that the Army has acquired Marine mesh and is hastily welding it over the rear engine which has proved so vulnerable.

                      Don't mess with the best , 'cos the best don't mess ......Sarsfield.
                      Sarsfield

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                      • #12
                        There's no such thing as an M1A3
                        I thought there's one in the works???

                        This is not helped as it is the only modern tank to run on 'gasoline'.
                        No it's not, it's run on JP 5 or JP8, like any other US military vehicle....basically, high speed diesel, not close to "petrol"....or MOGAS as it's called in the US military.

                        Regarding the HMMWV - there are multiple variants, only some of which are armored....this shouldn't be news to anyone.

                        The US Marines have had to upgrade their LAVs [ Piranha 3 ] with the same 'mesh' that the UK had to introduce in South Armagh and the Russians introduced in Chechnya to protect against RPGs.
                        You make this sound like a design flaw - the LAV protects up to 7.62, hardly news.

                        Our US friends should note , despite a recent 'analysis' done in the US, that the Abrams is not the best tank in the world. They should also note a UK Challenger 2 took 8 direct hits from RPG HEAT rounds, turned around and promptly obliterated the ambush!!!!
                        Yes it is - get over it.
                        "Hello, Good Evening and Bollocks..."

                        Roger Mellie

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                        • #13
                          Referring to above General Dynamics, Land Systems MIAI / MIA2 new production ceased 1996. All US Army being remanufactured to M1A2 Standard. Built in Lima Army Tank Plant, Lima, Ohio and assembled under licence in Egypt. Now I wonder how those nasty Iraqi armed groups got to hear about how much fun you could have with the Abrams.

                          Best tank in the world = the Krauss Maffei Leopard 2A6 [with MTU MB873 Ka501 4- stroke, 12 cylinder multi-fuel, exhaust turbocharged LIQUID-COOLED DIESEL, developing 1,500hp at 2,600rpm. Janes Armour. In use with Germany, Netherlands, Sweden, Switzerland, Austria, Denmark, Poland and ordered by Greece and Finland.

                          Abrams, Textron Lycoming AGT GAS TURBINE producing 1,500 hp at 30,000rpm. Remind me again what it is that Textron Lycoming is famous for? Oh thats correct HELICOPTER ENGINES!!!

                          Abrams users = US, kuwait, Saudi Arabia and Egypt. Australia just ordered 59 reconditioned Abrams at knock-off prices.

                          PS, Americans have such broad minds open to widespread debate and discussion, obviously engendered by such a superb education system, it is easy to see how they never offend and have so many friends!!!!!!
                          Sarsfield

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Sarsfield
                            The US Army have only recently introduced the Stryker [ Piranha 4] into service and none have left CONUS yet. Secondly please note that the Army has acquired Marine mesh and is hastily welding it over the rear engine which has proved so vulnerable.

                            Don't mess with the best , 'cos the best don't mess ......Sarsfield.
                            Strykers have been in Iraq since Dec 2003 approximately.

                            The Stryker is not the Pirhana IV, it is based on the Pirhana III.

                            The slat armour is not confined to the area around the engine compartment but is all around the vehicle.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by combatlogo
                              Yes it is - get over it.
                              California Tanker might not agree with you.

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