USMC Advanced Reconnaissance Vehicle

[DeV]

There is to be a few interesting AMV variants
https://twitter.com/ronkainen7k15/st...edOPxrU6-kM5sQ

[Come-quickly]

So the CTA cannon doesn't take a stanag 40mm round?

[paul g]

the problem with the CTA 40mm is that its very new technology and there are very few users, with the cancelation of the warrior upgrade and the fact that General Dymnamics are blaming the 40mm gun for the problems with Ajax it could end up with only Belgium and France using it on thier jaguar vehicles.. A key thing for the CTA40mm will be if the brits order it for their boxer MICV project, if they dont and unless there is another major order then the ammunition will be expensive, but the performance is not that much better than 30mm

the americans have 50mm version of their bushmaster in development that is going to be fitted on the bradley replacement, its got a lot in common with the 30mm Mk44 we have in service, the ammunition will be far cheaper, and it will offer far enhanced performance

look at what the americans are doing with the stryker units in europe for fire support, getting rid of the mobile gun system and using 30mm unmanned turrets with dual rws similar to the ones we got in the mowag upgrade, thats the way to go

[na grohmiti]

Wait till you hear what the 90mm used to cost compared to the 20mm...

[Come-quickly]

the big problem with the jaguar is the 40mm gun the ammunition for it is gong to be very expensive to buy compared to 30mm

But isnt the trend now for 35mm+ autocannons?

Edit: we're also talking about an intermediate calibre intended to replace low pressure 90mm guns and 105mm tank guns

[na grohmiti]

The tactical usefulness of an amphib is outweighed by its exposure when afloat. Particularly in the recce role. Better off with something that can ford anything not greater than its own hull height. After that you need to be calling the bridge builders anyway.
There is a good reason why there is no modern equivalent of the DUKW.

[DeV]

Affordable???? Each unit is at least €6m each. I will admit it is well armed but the CTA gun is a big unknown and its inability to swim is a major step backwards. It is always said you should never design for the last war but this is what the French have done. They have designed it to go running around the deserts of Africa. Even the Piranha have a swim kit, may nit be fitted but it is available.

Specific requirement was €1 million each (to the French)

Belgians are getting 60 Jaguars and 417 Griffons for €1.1 billion (2017 prices) including spares, training etc

the CTA appears to have shorter barrel life but packs a bigger punch….. not forgetting it also carries MMP anti-tank missiles (fire & forget and guided options) with a range of 4+ km

very very few amphibious vehicles any more - I assume that this is directly correlated to increased weight as a result of increased armour protection

[EUFighter]

In fairness, Jaguar is an extremely capable well armoured, affordable and well armed vehicle

Affordable???? Each unit is at least €6m each. I will admit it is well armed but the CTA gun is a big unknown and its inability to swim is a major step backwards. It is always said you should never design for the last war but this is what the French have done. They have designed it to go running around the deserts of Africa. Even the Piranha have a swim kit, may nit be fitted but it is available.

[paul g]

In fairness, Jaguar is an extremely capable well armoured, affordable and well armed vehicle

the big problem with the jaguar is the 40mm gun the ammunition for it is gong to be very expensive to buy compared to 30mm

[Rhodes]

What advantage would it have over the current CRV apart from being amphibious and having “see through armour”?

Not sure if the CRVs are getting the same upgrades as the rest of the MOWAGs with the 360 camera system and potential Javelin capability

They didn't get all the upgrades, the Infantry cars are more advanced.

[DeV]

The CRV and MRVs both got the same upgrade. Cav are not looking at another converted APC to fill their AFV requirement. The Jaguar is what they are drooling over.

In fairness, Jaguar is an extremely capable well armoured, affordable and well armed vehicle

[apod]

The CRV and MRVs both got the same upgrade. Cav are not looking at another converted APC to fill their AFV requirement. The Jaguar is what they are drooling over.

[DeV]

What advantage would it have over the current CRV apart from being amphibious and having “see through armour”?

Not sure if the CRVs are getting the same upgrades as the rest of the MOWAGs with the 360 camera system and potential Javelin capability

[EUFighter]

Where would it be useful for Cav in their Recce role?

IMHO it would make a good replacement of the P3 CRV. I know there are a lot of fanboys of the Fennek, which is a good recce vehicle but for me it lacks something it fore-barer the Luchs could do, swim. Not all the World is made of vast areas of dry desert, most of the world has rivers and as we have again seen recently being able to get across them is important. And IMHO for recce vehicles this is even more important. Just look at the BRDM-2 and how long it has been in service.

The USMC want a vehicle with a crew of 2 with 5 dismounts but it would probable be better with 3 crew and 4 dismounts with the third crew member being a systems/weapon operator. It seems that the other contender GDLS will offer a new version of the LAV-25, the new double hull version of the LAV-II. But I think the Cottonmouth will give it a good run for it's money.

[na grohmiti]

This was totally not on my radar at all, an interesting vehicle and would likely be a good fir for our Cav.

https://www.thedefensepost.com/2022/...uth-prototype/

https://www.textronsystems.com/capab...ns/cottonmouth

Where would it be useful for Cav in their Recce role?