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  • Fire support vehicles

    Hi all from downunder can someone answer this question ,does the irish army still use the scorpions in the recce/fire support role.In nz we use the lav3[105 delievered] but there is serious talk of getting 18 to 24 lav3 with 105mm or cv90 with 120mm.We looked at upgrading our scorpions but decided against it.

  • #2
    Yep thast what we do with them.....for another while anyway.we did the same and even refused to aquire anymore.....the day of tracked vehicles in the DF is all but gone
    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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    • #3
      Hi HPT
      What is it about tracks that the Bosses are so afraid of? Heavier tanks and other tracked vehicles are used in worse terrain than ours. It would be crazy to allow the institutional experience of tracked armour to deteriorate.
      regards
      GttC

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      • #4
        Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner
        Hi HPT
        What is it about tracks that the Bosses are so afraid of? Heavier tanks and other tracked vehicles are used in worse terrain than ours. It would be crazy to allow the institutional experience of tracked armour to deteriorate.
        regards
        GttC
        The reason we went to wheeled apc in nz was easier to deploy ie australia/less logistical tail required/less maintenance.We know tracked apcs have a better advantage but does it matter if a rpg/missle system can take out anything regardless.

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        • #5
          Less damage to roads as well.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by kiwi
            The reason we went to wheeled apc in nz was easier to deploy
            Yeah doesn't tracked armour need to be transported by trucks?
            Theirs not to make reply,
            Theirs not to reason why,
            Theirs but to do and die:
            Into the valley of Death
            Rode the six hundred.

            The Charge of the Light Brigade

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            • #7
              Hi all
              We should always retain even a token force of tracked vehicles to retain operational experience. What would happen if the UN offered tracks for overseas service and the Army were found wanting?
              I'd prefer a squadron of Scorpions or some other light tracked AFV, which offer little prospect of damaging roads,whilst still offering some kind of fire support capability.
              regards
              GttC

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              • #8
                I doubt it its finance calling the shots now, they will not want their new roads built under NDP to be hurt in any way!
                Lifes a bitch, so be her pimp!

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                • #9
                  Agree GTTC..but in the past tanks were bought as a training tool for anti tank forces. After WW2 it looked as if the DF were going to mage the giant step into armoured warfare .but the sixties negated this again. the Scorpion was procuured as a reece vehicle and not in a tank Role as in the real world these operate independently.

                  I think the associated costs, maintaince , training and army lack of interest in armoured warfare..seeing as the army is run by infantry men, have always let an armoured elemnet unless it is partof an infantry unit something to be desired.

                  The Irsh army was concieved as a force against internal agressions..this has developed into a peace enforcement unit without a role for armoured vehicles such as MBTs.

                  With commitments to deploymnets as elements of other peoples reaction forces I don't think the current DF strategy will ever give thought to an Armoured offensive unit such as medium or MBTs.

                  If thigs had been different during the sixties ..more money for the DF...and a Nato involvement where such equipment ewould have more easily available at great reduced cost thing smight be different.

                  Given the direction of the current Armys evoloution I reckon..and ist only my opinion you can write us off as having any serious commitment to armoured warfare.

                  Our current recce vehicle fleet are well past their use by date with no successor on the hozion. any future recce vehcle willbe an adaptation of an existing infantry vehicle rather than a dedicated cavalry one.

                  As for Tanks....its a bit like dedicated jet fighters..Tanks but no tanks....
                  Last edited by FMolloy; 23 October 2005, 13:08.
                  Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by mugs
                    Yeah doesn't tracked armour need to be transported by trucks?
                    Not necessarily. I think the Scorpions have rubber blocks that can be inserted in the tracks for driving on tarmac roads....

                    See THIS picture for what I mean...
                    Last edited by FMolloy; 24 October 2005, 01:43.
                    "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

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                    • #11
                      Yes..but given the price...we tend to put them up on low loaders and transport them...plus its cheaper on Petrol....and given the lack of availability of petrol in transport yards..well..i hope the commanders credit card is up to date.....mine would'nt power a lawn mower...
                      Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Truck Driver
                        Not necessarily. I think the Scorpions have rubber blocks that can be inserted in the tracks for driving on tarmac roads....

                        See THIS picture for what I mean...

                        They are already fitted with these. However they cost a fortune to replace. Remember every time the vehicles makes a slight turn, these pads wear away. I think it costs something like 10grand per track(just to replace the rubber pads) and they last about 2000km.
                        Last edited by FMolloy; 24 October 2005, 20:06.


                        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Goldie fish
                          I think it costs something like 10grand per track(just to replace the rubber pads) and they last about 2000km.
                          Those are expensive f*****g "tyres"...
                          "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

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                          • #14
                            Why not buy new tracks with replaceable rubber pads then?
                            http://www.steyr-motors.com/news/media_scorpion.htm

                            The K10,000 track might do the trick

                            Rgeards

                            Måk

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Måk
                              Why not buy new tracks with replaceable rubber pads then?
                              http://www.steyr-motors.com/news/media_scorpion.htm

                              The K10,000 track might do the trick

                              Rgeards

                              Måk
                              No because its not the army way (it makes too much sense!)

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