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  • Avro Cadet to return.

    Originally posted by Itchy
    One of the first and only surviving biplanes used by the Air Corps 75 years ago is to be purchased on the State's behalf by Minister for Defence Willie O'Dea.
    The purchase of the Avro 631 cadet model, used in second World War patrols off the Irish coastline, is expected to cost more than $200,000 (€152,000), with additional delivery costs.
    There are "no plans" for the Minister to fly it back to Ireland from New Zealand, according to his department, but it may be shipped in time for the general election.
    Confirming the bid yesterday, the Minister said that he was "very conscious of the Air Corp's proud past and of the desire of many aviation enthusiasts, military and civil alike to preserve as much of the Air Corps heritage as possible". The current owner was keen for it to be returned to its original aerodrome in Baldonnel, he said.
    In March, 1932, the Air Corps took delivery of a number of Avro aircraft - the 631 Cadet model - at Casement Aerodrome in Baldonnel. The planes were painted in Air Corps colours of black and silver, with the national flag across the rudder and wingtips.
    The C7 in New Zealand was a replacement for one of the Avros which crashed in 1932, and was used by the Air Corps from 1934. Later it was sold into private ownership, and was consigned to the rafters of a timber mill for more than 40 years before a well-known aircraft restorer in England, Ron Souch, located it.
    By the time it arrived in New Zealand most of its fuselage structure had been restored. Rare aircraft collector Jim Schmidt continued the project, and also retains the plane's original log book.
    It includes a letter from a former Air Corps pilot, Donald MacCarron, describing his experiences in the C7 on patrol during the second World War. "At one point he jokes about the boredom almost driving him to join the Luftwaffe!" Schmidt told The Irish Times when it reported on the discovery two years ago. One other Avro 631 exists but it is on display in a Portuguese museum. The C7 is the world's only "active example", still flying in the Irish colours.
    © 2007 The Irish Times

    http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ire...575793490.html


    An admirable decidion by the Dept, however we are approaching the situation where the Air Corps has a Larger Museum flight than operational aircraft.


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  • #2
    hi there
    Goldie, we'll rig up a Lewis Gun on a Scarff ring in the backseat and train you up as an Air Gunner. Can't say fairer than that...
    regards
    GttC

    Comment


    • #3
      Twin mount and I'm there. I'll even bring my own scarf and goggles.


      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

      Comment


      • #4
        hi there
        I could get all bitter and cynical but how long will it take before some Don officer comes up with a scheme to get his arse all the way out to God's Country to personally collect the Avro, rather than just strip it down and stick it in a crate and send it by ship.I feel a big, fat, sub run coming on.....
        regards
        GttC

        Comment


        • #5
          how many sets of rain-gear for the RDF would this little expence be able to buy?

          or, to put it another way.....

          how many RDF personnel will be able to shelter under its wings because they don't have rain-gear?

          cynical mood relieved now!
          Fate whispers to the warrior, "There is a storm coming"

          And the warrior whispers back "I am the storm".

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by X-RayOne View Post
            how many sets of rain-gear for the RDF would this little expence be able to buy?

            or, to put it another way.....

            how many RDF personnel will be able to shelter under its wings because they don't have rain-gear?
            If the RDF have to shelter under the wings of the Cadet it's the Ministers fault. The Cadet is not coming out of his purse.
            GttC as for getting it home perhaps "Squadron Leader" MC Carron can fly it home after all he is credited with flying coastal patrols (sic) during the Emergency.
            Tony K
            Last edited by Boomer; 21 February 2007, 22:41.

            Comment


            • #7
              regardless of whose purse its coming out of over e200,000 have been found to be spent on antique military hardware that is not going to benefit the DF in any way, improve soldiers conditions or improve the DF capabilities!
              Fate whispers to the warrior, "There is a storm coming"

              And the warrior whispers back "I am the storm".

              Comment


              • #8
                I suggest you look at the Imperial War Museum in Britain before you judge, X-Ray.

                I for one am happy to see that finally the Irish Defence Forces have taken an interest in their history!
                If you have to do it, you always have to do it right. Either it makes a difference, or it’s good practice so that when it does make a difference, it gets done right.

                -Me.

                Comment


                • #9
                  i'll be happier to see them take more of an interest in their future!!
                  Fate whispers to the warrior, "There is a storm coming"

                  And the warrior whispers back "I am the storm".

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    how many sets of rain-gear for the RDF would this little expence be able to buy?

                    or, to put it another way.....

                    how many RDF personnel will be able to shelter under its wings because they don't have rain-gear?
                    have you ever been stuck for rain gear? Have you ever been sent out in inclement weather without decent (gucci or otherwise) kit? I doubt it. Maybe what you are referring to is personal issue for the RDF, and IMO the plane is a better investment than that.
                    "Why, it appears that we appointed all of our worst generals to command the armies and we appointed all of our best generals to edit the newspapers. I mean, I found by reading a newspaper that these editor generals saw all of the defects plainly from the start but didn't tell me until it was too late. I'm willing to yield my place to these best generals and I'll do my best for the cause by editing a newspaper"
                    Gen. Robert E. Lee

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      yes actually i have been sent out in inclement weather without rain-gear. once upon a time the FCA wasn't even issued combats. they had to be "acquired" or got somehow. so i know what i'm talking about.

                      take a look at all the posts on this forum giving out about lack of pool stock rain-gear, poor quality stock, lack of good quality webbing. the problems may not be as bad as the old days of the FCA but the problems are still there. if the problems were solved reservists wouldn't be buying so much gucci kit.

                      and yes i do think there should be personnel issue for reserve personnel. rain-gear or webbing or whatever is not "gucci", these are basic necessities for effective soldiering!

                      how do you think this plane is a better investment than basic equipment for troops?
                      Fate whispers to the warrior, "There is a storm coming"

                      And the warrior whispers back "I am the storm".

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Viking View Post
                        have you ever been stuck for rain gear? Have you ever been sent out in inclement weather without decent (gucci or otherwise) kit? I doubt it.

                        Yes more than once. Was doing a platoon in attack demo for some high ranking officers in the glen a couple of years ago (3-4) spent the better part of the day out in lashing rain with no wet gear at all.

                        My uniform so wet that it wasn't dried by the next day so I couldn't escort the weapons back as I was detailed to do. Had no access to the laundry facilities.

                        Also spent a weekend on the range once and there was not enough rain gear to go around. People had bits and pieces. I managed to get my hands on a jacket but one of the sleeves had a big tear in it.
                        "Those who have long enjoyed such privileges as we enjoy forget in time that men have died to win them." - Franklin D. Roosevelt

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Never even seen pool issue rain gear, although plenty of high and mightys seem to have no trouble accessing DPM versions of the stuff...

                          Why not sieze the initiative and WEAR (dare I say it) your poncho, sure when on an OP in the glen at night, you can pretend your in Platoon, just sitting there listening to the patter of raindrops...
                          *patter patter patter*
                          waiting for charlie in the rain forest.....
                          *Snap* *crack*
                          etc

                          Anyway its nice to see them take notice of our history, sometimes having pride in what has been, can be taken as a positive step forward, that by enshrining an interest in our past and where we've come from, we set ourselves more suredly on the path to a better future.

                          Also.... I like aeroplanes :D
                          Methinks that the OP's thread, doth be shanghai'd by scurly peasants who speaketh with forked tougues.
                          Last edited by morpheus; 22 February 2007, 16:26.
                          "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
                          "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            To quote the Minister - http://www.defence.ie/WebSite.nsf/Sp...E?OpenDocument

                            ... I am very conscious of the Air Corp’s proud past and of the desire of many aviation enthusiasts, military and civil alike, to preserve as much of its heritage as possible and I am delighted to announce today that I have given the go ahead to the purchase by my Department of an ex-Air Corps Avro 631 Cadet biplane. This aircraft was disposed of back in 1945 and is currently located in New Zealand where I understand that it has been restored to flying condition by a collector of old aircraft, Mr. Jim Schmidt, who is keen to see it returned to its former home here in Baldonnel. GOC Air Corps will be visiting New Zealand shortly to examine the aircraft and finalise the arrangements for shipping it home to Ireland.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              DeV
                              It is still my understanding that it is not coming out of the Minister's purse and also the Cadet was not "disposed of back in 1945". However perhaps X-RayOne has a point, history after all is a thing of the past. Why not sell all that scrap in the military section of the National Museum.
                              Tony K

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