Helicopter Aramament

[GoneToTheCanner]

Lads,
Heli 101 class: unless the heli has deicing equipped rotors, it cannot fly into known icing (the average winter day in Ireland generates such weather) but it can fly in rain, fog, low cloud and into cloud, as long as they have the ability to land back at base (instrument approaches). Possessing NVE and FLIR allows them to operate off-base in bad weather and not depend on airport-based beacons to land. NVE is fine but the loss rate in training is very high (see US Army for details) as NVE makes depth perception very difficult and is no proof against wires and masts, which proliferate in Ireland.Give the AC pilots time to get used to their aircraft and let them get familiar with NVE/FLIR in low-level ops over protected(screened for masts, wires, obstacles) ground first.I'd imagine the Bosses are anxious to avoid another Dauphin-style disaster.
regards
Gttc

[ZULU]

And FLIR!

FLIR is useful in daylight too. Cuts through Fog - Smoke etc. Seems a bit much if they're going to buy a Heli like the AW139 and only use it during the day in clear weather!

[tonyrdf]

And FLIR!

got me! Although FLIR would have a use for ops (other than SAR) at home,
convoy escorts etc. GPMGs dont except for aerial firepower (HA!) demostratons,
and looking Gucci in recruiting videos!

[The real Jack]

And FLIR!

[tonyrdf]

To provide a limited amount of covering fire for the section getting in or out. They would also provide a small self defence capability versus people on the groung with RPG's etc.

I think he ment whats the point in having them on the helis if there not going to be deployed.

[ZULU]

Better fit them to the 172s aswell. I've heard they get shot at alot by RPGs!!

[The real Jack]

You're probably right, but if that's the case, what's the point of door-gunners?

To provide a limited amount of covering fire for the section getting in or out. They would also provide a small self defence capability versus people on the groung with RPG's etc.

[tonyrdf]

You're probably right, but if that's the case, what's the point of door-gunners?

Good question. Id have to say, so that recruitment videos would look more Gucci.

[Turkey]

Err, when Scorpy posts I read carefully.
When the Fennec fan posts I either laugh, or search for Valium.


carpark, we do not need another Air Corps, we have one, it just needs the right investment and support, it certainly does not require any guidance from a Yank hating, left-wing, uncivil servant with the IQ of a door knob.

[Jetjock]

Dear Scorpy,
Reading back through the previous posts I cant say I see much impatience and over excitement.The only miracles I see someone expecting on this page are the photo of the Longbow, or Denmark expecting someone to be scared of a Fennec "gun ship" .Before you get to your cover there what in God's name will come?? Are there prizes for guessing?? Expand on your statement a little bit.Enlighten us.:confused:

Yours in anticipation!

JJ

[Scorpy]

There are lots of people getting excited about the 139. A little bit of temperence and patience would be well served by all. It will come. (RUNNING FOR COVER)!

[thebig C]

armed helicopters

The AC arent going to be splashing out on an attack heli anytime soon,
nor will they deploy assets to anywhere that they might get shot at.........except maybe Limerick

Just to clarify, when I mentioned armed escort helicopters, I was thinking more of something like this



or this





not so much this



or even this!

[thebig C]

The AC arent going to be splashing out on an attack heli anytime soon,
nor will they deploy assets to anywhere that they might get shot at.........except maybe Limerick

You're probably right, but if that's the case, what's the point of door-gunners?

[Jetjock]

Lets not forget that the original tender for the UH contract included the request for options for the ability of the aircraft to be able to deliver a "range" of unguided fire support weapons. The AB139 was initially marketed with stub wing mounted podded weapons including cannon and rockets and I'm sure our birds are capable of being modified with said items if there was a requirement. Before we get there, the Air Corps need to instigate a mind-set within the Army where Air Corps participation is considered a valuable asset. To do this, the advantages of an "Air Mobile" element within a broader tactical doctrine needs to be demonstrated by a willingness to make aircraft available to any Army training operation, that will bring the Defence Force policy makers to the thinking that an airborne element is indispensable to any future operation, be it at home or overseas. This is the first time in Air Corps history that the equipment is available to demonstrate their potential as a valid component of an integrated military capability. Let's hope that when the aircraft have "worked up" sufficiently and are fully operational that this opportunity is grasped and the force multiplication offered by such a capability is recognised, just as it has been by any serious military force for the last 40 years. Hopefully such thinking will bring an end to "token" 100 here, 200 there overseas deployments and in the future we will see fully integrated all-services deployments where the Irish Defence Forces take a lead role.

[tonyrdf]

But the Italian experience does suggest that if tactical troop transport helicopters are to be used in a combat environment, they may need armour and/or armed escorts. This of course is a lesson that was also learned the hard way in Vietnam.

The AC arent going to be splashing out on an attack heli anytime soon,
nor will they deploy assets to anywhere that they might get shot at.........except maybe Limerick