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  • buried Hurricanes....

    I need some info on something that has been brought to my attention lately.
    Could anyone who was involved in the destruction and subsequent burial of the Hurricanes please contact me by PM or E-mail...
    The aircrafts were buried sometime in the mid-sixties under a ''lend/lease aggrement.
    "We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey"
    Radio transmission, siege of Jadotville DR Congo. September 1961.
    Illegitimi non carborundum

  • #2
    Irish hurricanes?

    I do know that two hawker hectors were buried in a scrap yard in Dublin that was cleared out in the late eigthies, the remains were stored in Waterford for some years were then removed to the UK where they were involved in a rebuild.

    The Hurricanes like the Seafires as opposed to the Spitfires were total demolished.

    All of the seafires are still in existence either in the UK of the USA , most in an airworthy condition.

    I am positive about the hector/demon fuselages as I saw them in Waterford and was only enquiring about them over Xmas.
    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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    • #3
      Hi there,
      The 1st Apprentice Class, during their term as Aptces., were marched to the dump, which ran from Heli Flight's hangar-side office to the windsock at the corner of the hedge (which was well over a hundred yards, so you can imagine the amount of stuff that was there), were handed picks, shovels, sledgehammers and cutting tools and ordered to reduce the derelict aircraft, especially the Hurricanes and any other aircraft capable of carrying a gun or bomb, to pieces, which they duly did. They were not allowed off site until the aircraft were completely demolished and reduced to scrap. This included the deliberate smashing of every instrument, windscreen, engine parts, gun mountings, gun sights, propellors and so on. The whole lot was then driven over. A lot of stuff was also set alight, to assure destruction. Source: RSM Bobby Gallagher, who was one of the wreckers.
      regards
      GttC

      PS: that whole area has been dug up and redeveloped several times and many tons of concrete poured on. Where the new hangar stands, would have been the centre of the dumping area. There were also lesser dumps, such as a small one which stood near the Engine Test Cell, up by Stores and other units, such as Transport, also had their own dumps.
      Last edited by GoneToTheCanner; 11 January 2011, 13:32.

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      • #4
        The whole lot was then driven over. A lot of stuff was also set alight, to assure destruction
        .

        Hence the name the fire dump?
        Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
          Hi there,
          The 1st Apprentice Class, during their term as Aptces., were marched to the dump, which ran from Heli Flight's hangar-side office to the windsock at the corner of the hedge (which was well over a hundred yards, so you can imagine the amount of stuff that was there), were handed picks, shovels, sledgehammers and cutting tools and ordered to reduce the derelict aircraft, especially the Hurricanes and any other aircraft capable of carrying a gun or bomb, to pieces, which they duly did. They were not allowed off site until the aircraft were completely demolished and reduced to scrap. This included the deliberate smashing of every instrument, windscreen, engine parts, gun mountings, gun sights, propellors and so on. The whole lot was then driven over. A lot of stuff was also set alight, to assure destruction. Source: RSM Bobby Gallagher, who was one of the wreckers.
          regards
          GttC

          PS: that whole area has been dug up and redeveloped several times and many tons of concrete poured on. Where the new hangar stands, would have been the centre of the dumping area. There were also lesser dumps, such as a small one which stood near the Engine Test Cell, up by Stores and other units, such as Transport, also had their own dumps.

          I'm struggling to think of a reason why all this had to be done to dispose of aircraft that were no longer in use....was there any logical explanations at the time?
          Everyone who's ever loved you was wrong.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by The real Jack View Post
            I'm struggling to think of a reason why all this had to be done to dispose of aircraft that were no longer in use....was there any logical explanations at the time?
            Its about as logical as being detailed to cut-up into ribbons issued clothing / kit being,
            the kit in question being removed from the lockers of men who had either deserted or gone A.W.O.L. in some cases the kit was brand spanking new, never on a mans back. I perfectly understand the issue of health with regards any vests and jocks, or shirts.

            I did try to swop my worn and faded P.D.F combat jacket for one about to be shredded only to be told by the F.C.A. N.C.O. in charge, that that was not allowed as all the material had already been weighed.

            At that point in time the mid-1970's 28th Bn soldiers were only being issued one set of combat clothing per 3 years!!!!!

            Items to be "written off / signed off" the strength of the establishment by an Officer had to be rendered so as not to turn up in the future and cause an embarrassment to the government and officer in charge particularly so if they had a scrap or rag value.

            Connaught Stranger.
            Last edited by Connaught Stranger; 11 January 2011, 18:41.

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            • #7
              Hi there,
              The Baldonnel dump wasn't formally a fire training dump, as such, but sometimes wrecks were set alight away from the main dump, specifically for the fire crew to deal with.......Even at the time (whenever the 1st Aptce Class was in being), there were informal requests made to them upstairs to keep at least one Hurricane intact but it was not to be. As for uniform and clothing, well, it had been policy for decades to scrap by destruction old uniforms and especially combat clothing, so as to prevent access by subversives. I saw used clothing being weighed and then doused with red paint and then set alight, all witnessed by the Clothing Officer. Surplus flying equipment, such as helmets and suits and so on also went the same way, which is why genuine Air Corps issue flying clothing is scarce. Naturally, the system was not foolproof as anyone who has ever worked on an Irish building site will tell you, as there always seemed to be a labourer or two around, wearing an old combat jacket or a pair of old Army boots.
              regards
              GttC

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              • #8
                I was with a group who took a Provost and the Pod from a vampire from the fire dump in 1987...there was literally nothing esle intact and the remenants of the airframes had been 'vandalised beyond economic repair.

                The army operated this policy in relation to vehicles up to recently also believing that former military vehicles if released on to the market could end up in huge insurance claims and as such were just chopped up. Used to be a scrap yard outside Galway that always had a few under the blade.

                Only in recent years did vehicles become available. Some of the best bargains to be had amongst the motor cycles and DAF 4x4 TCVs.

                In one of the old blocks on the front of the naval base they stored returned clothing, and some of this was really old.Funny thing was they had to reissue the 1st line reservist new kit or bits thereof every year instaed of storing their former kit and letting them draw it when called up.
                Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by hptmurphy View Post
                  The army operated this policy in relation to vehicles up to recently also believing that former military vehicles if released on to the market could end up in huge insurance claims and as such were just chopped up. Used to be a scrap yard outside Galway that always had a few under the blade.
                  Or they have so main miles/hours on them no one would want them, especially considering how unresourced the DF was until around 1998 or so

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                  • #10
                    Hi there,
                    When I entered the Don in 1984, there stood Provosts 181 and 184 on the dump, as well as various derelict Leonides engines for same and a few Vampire hulks and a few Chipmunk bits. Everything else had been burned, cut up or flattened. Later, I did find other interesting items but they have long since gone, either outside or to the Museum.
                    There was also a story of a good Landrover being offered as surplus out of Collins Barracks. It was related to me that when it was found out by some of the Transport fitters, that an officer from the same Barracks was bidding for it (and expected to get it for a song), some of them went round it with a sledgehammer first.
                    regards
                    GttC

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                    • #11
                      [TROLL]
                      So if they'd stored the Spits/Hawkers til today, they could have sold them and bought some fast jets.
                      [/TROLL]
                      Meh.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        With regards soft-skin military vehicles there were official auctions held from time to time in Custume Barracks Athlone in the 1980's as far as I recall, old Landrovers were being bought by farmers.

                        Connaught Stranger.

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                        • #13
                          Hi there,
                          They've had them recently enough,too and the vehicles were in better condition, ie, worth buying to refit for road use. Dawned on the authorities that useless scrap wouldn't sell, after all....I prefer the American attitude to military surplus; the taxpayer paid for it, they can have it back if they want it (with obvious exceptions, but you you what I mean).
                          Anyhow, possibly, if the Don allowed it, you could take a walk with a metal detector around where the old dump was......
                          regards
                          GttC

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                          • #14
                            I remember seeing some photos of dumped aircraft at Baldonnel with bullet damage. Were aircraft wrecks used for target practice?

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                            • #15
                              Or they have so main miles/hours on them no one would want them, especially considering how unresourced the DF was until around 1998 or so
                              No..Army trucks were like gold dust as they had never pulled a heavy load in their lives and were well sought after.

                              Mine....I have them scanned on and will re post at some point...Was the Provost but given the location of the wrecks I doubt if the marks on the windscreens were cause by small arms as there were no other 'bullet holes' on the aircraft and it was to close to a populated centre to have been used for target practise.
                              Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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