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Defending the Irish airspace

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  • madmark
    replied
    Originally posted by na grohmiti View Post

    Not being able.to maintain a pursuit because the unknown aircraft increased its speed to 400mph does not inspire confidence in its abilities.
    Maximum speed of the FA-50 is Mach 1.5 or 1,837.5 km/h so id say there was more to that intercept then meet the eye as an increase of speed to 400mph is well with in the reach of the aircraft

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  • na grohmiti
    replied
    Originally posted by madmark View Post
    Not being able.to maintain a pursuit because the unknown aircraft increased its speed to 400mph does not inspire confidence in its abilities.

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  • madmark
    replied
    https://www.manilatimes.net/2021/09/...IINuvXQXjxKBAs FA-50 doing intercepting work

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  • EUFighter
    replied
    The Czech and Hungarian lease of Gripens are often highlighted as possible solutions. However there are two fundamental points that have to be taken into account:
    (a) Both those air forces had long histories of operating modern high performance jet fighters. They had at the time in their fleets MiG29 fighters. The closest we have ever got to a frontline fighter was the Seafire and that was out of date when it entered service.
    (b) Secondly both are land locked members of NATO. This means that they have access to the full support of NATO in terms of overwatch.

    So just because a lease of 14 aircraft each works for them does not mean that this would be sufficient for an independent air intercept capability. The SADF number of 26 is more realistic although even this is on the low number. There are two key drivers of the minimum number of aircraft:
    (a) Redundancy. A QRA will normally be two ready aircraft with two back-up. The back up are there for a number of reasons not just endurance but also in case of a technical defect or just the need to directly launch another pair once the first have returned from their mission. And this is why AAR for small fleets does not make much sense as there needs to be 2x AAR aircraft always available.
    (b) Pilot proficiency: this is the main driver of the number of aircraft, to have a 24//7/365 QRA there is a need for more than 36 pilots each of which should get around 200 hours per year of flight time. Taking a simplified approach that each aircraft has a limit of 6000 flight hours and that they are expected to be in-service for 30 years this means one aircraft per pilot. Simulation can reduce the need a bit but only by so much.

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  • Graylion
    replied
    Thanks and understood. So really it is down to leasing a dozen (+2) Gripen. I am also thinking that if we expand the C-295 fleet, we might get

    a) firebombers

    and

    b) AAR out of it.

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  • Orion
    replied
    Originally posted by Graylion View Post

    which one is Meridian's post?
    https://forum.irishmilitaryonline.co...280#post728280

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  • madmark
    replied
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PQl...nel=PrimeCheck
    ill just leave this here

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  • Graylion
    replied
    Originally posted by Sparky42 View Post

    Is it the only airframe they are using? They have F 16s and F15s and are building their own fifth gen, they aren’t using the FA as the core of their Air Force. It’s like how back in the Cold War the RAF had some of the Hawks equipped for some level of air to air capabilities, didn’t make them the core of the RAF fighter capabilities though. I’m guessing they are going to replace the F5# in whatever role they operate currently.
    But that FA-50 actually is a light fighter with radar and all. And supersonic.

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  • Jaque'ammer
    replied
    Fair point, I'd be happy with anything faster than a truboprop at this stage

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  • Sparky42
    replied
    Originally posted by Jaque'ammer View Post

    Seems to be good enough for the Koreans?
    Is it the only airframe they are using? They have F 16s and F15s and are building their own fifth gen, they aren’t using the FA as the core of their Air Force. It’s like how back in the Cold War the RAF had some of the Hawks equipped for some level of air to air capabilities, didn’t make them the core of the RAF fighter capabilities though. I’m guessing they are going to replace the F5# in whatever role they operate currently.
    Last edited by Sparky42; 3 September 2021, 19:09.

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  • Jaque'ammer
    replied
    Originally posted by na grohmiti View Post

    Read 199 on Meridians Post. Explains well why an aircraft of this type cannot do that job.
    Seems to be good enough for the Koreans?

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  • Graylion
    replied
    Originally posted by na grohmiti View Post

    Read 199 on Meridians Post. Explains well why an aircraft of this type cannot do that job.
    which one is Meridian's post?

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  • na grohmiti
    replied
    Originally posted by Graylion View Post
    I had a look at the FA-50. 30 M$ a pop? Now that is cheap. And the KF-21 at 60 M$ is downright sexy. And there is of course the C-295 AEW ...

    Limited to Sidewinder and AMRAAM though. One would want the EU combinations of IRIS-T and Meteor. IRIS-T on the FA-50 should suffice for QRA in the beginning maybe?
    Read 199 on Meridians Post. Explains well why an aircraft of this type cannot do that job.

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  • Graylion
    replied
    I had a look at the FA-50. 30 M$ a pop? Now that is cheap. And the KF-21 at 60 M$ is downright sexy. And there is of course the C-295 AEW ...

    Limited to Sidewinder and AMRAAM though. One would want the EU combinations of IRIS-T and Meteor. IRIS-T on the FA-50 should suffice for QRA in the beginning maybe?
    Last edited by Graylion; 3 September 2021, 09:46.

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  • Graylion
    replied
    Originally posted by na grohmiti View Post

    A good start point for leasing though, proof of concept etc.
    The customers who have leased Gripen C for the purpose lease 12 Charly and 2 Delta. That seems to be a sustainable minimum. I'd a go with that.

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