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  • Originally posted by DeV View Post
    Now add enough aircrew to make EAS sustainable, 4 SAR detachments and FWSAR plus normal DF work
    Then strategic transport, ground based air defence (radars etc) and the sums begin to add up. The force levels would likely be close to that of the Danish Air Force and would only come when a "2%" sized budget is allocated. It is one of the reasons why a proper deep assessment of our defence needs is required and why the Commission on Defence is so important.

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    • Originally posted by DeV View Post
      Now add enough aircrew to make EAS sustainable, 4 SAR detachments and FWSAR plus normal DF work
      Yup, soon enough you might be looking at the stuff that every other state thinks of as being the baseline of what a military is for...

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      • One question in my mind is if we were to step up to the plate and put on "big" boys clothes in terms of defence would the Irish SAR regions and ATC regions stay the same. If one looks at both off the Donegal coast, one does not have to travel far out to be outside both, normally just outside the territorial limits. It might make sense to extend the ATC region north to take in some of the NOTA especially as this is used more with direct flights from the US west coast.

        A consequence would be that something like a Rafale rather than a Gripen might then be better suited.

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        • Originally posted by EUFighter View Post
          One question in my mind is if we were to step up to the plate and put on "big" boys clothes in terms of defence would the Irish SAR regions and ATC regions stay the same. If one looks at both off the Donegal coast, one does not have to travel far out to be outside both, normally just outside the territorial limits. It might make sense to extend the ATC region north to take in some of the NOTA especially as this is used more with direct flights from the US west coast.

          A consequence would be that something like a Rafale rather than a Gripen might then be better suited.
          That would require big changes for the IAA & NATS in the U.K.

          It is little to do with defence and a lot to do with civil aviation

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          • Originally posted by DeV View Post
            That would require big changes for the IAA & NATS in the U.K.

            It is little to do with defence and a lot to do with civil aviation
            Hard to find a good map of the UK ADIZ but did come across this from the RAF from last year.



            Before anyone read too much into the western boundary, IMHO they have just continued the 8deg W line north, as the scale is also a bit off unless we have drifted west a fair way. In principle their ADIZ matches their FIRs.

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            • You know that silence that comes from certain political parties when the Russians come for their flying visits, how long before they are foaming at the mouth about this.



              B52 flying over Ireland yesterday apparently.
              Last edited by CTU; 15 December 2020, 11:59.
              It was the year of fire...the year of destruction...the year we took back what was ours.
              It was the year of rebirth...the year of great sadness...the year of pain...and the year of joy.
              It was a new age...It was the end of history.
              It was the year everything changed.

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              • Originally posted by CTU View Post
                You know that silence that comes from certain political parties when the Russians come for their flying visits, how long before they are foaming at the mouth about this.



                B52 flying over Ireland yesterday apparently.
                Oh I have little doubt that's going to be an issue all of a sudden, just not one that would be enough for the usual suspects to support spending on the DF of course.

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                • Engine problem caused emergency landing in Fairford on the 5th, flew back to US for full overhaul apparently.
                  For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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                  • Originally posted by CTU View Post
                    You know that silence that comes from certain political parties when the Russians come for their flying visits, how long before they are foaming at the mouth about this.



                    B52 flying over Ireland yesterday apparently.
                    Depends on if they sought and were granted permission.

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                    • The USAF will have filled a flight plan, talked to and complied with ATC and had their transponder on, they will have complied with the Chicago Convention so no need to deny permission. If the Russians did the same for their Tu-142's then their would be no issue. Difference is the Russians are not doing harmless transit flights they are passive aggression flight design to provoke a response.

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                      • Originally posted by EUFighter View Post
                        The USAF will have filled a flight plan, talked to and complied with ATC and had their transponder on, they will have complied with the Chicago Convention so no need to deny permission. If the Russians did the same for their Tu-142's then their would be no issue. Difference is the Russians are not doing harmless transit flights they are passive aggression flight design to provoke a response.
                        Sadly, it is the USAF flight that the crusties will get hot and bothered about.
                        For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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                        • Originally posted by na grohmiti View Post
                          Engine problem caused emergency landing in Fairford on the 5th, flew back to US for full overhaul apparently.
                          The dreaded seven engine approach.

                          Regarding overflight this like all military overflights will have been subject to the seeking and granting of diplomatic clearance to transit.

                          ATC are aware in advance of all cleared overflights.

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                          • Originally posted by Jetjock View Post
                            The dreaded seven engine approach.

                            Regarding overflight this like all military overflights will have been subject to the seeking and granting of diplomatic clearance to transit.

                            ATC are aware in advance of all cleared overflights.
                            True, but that won’t stop the usual BS...

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                            • Originally posted by EUFighter View Post
                              We need to tell the Greens and other tree huggers that the Gripen can fly with bio-fuel (well so can most modern jets if we are honest).

                              https://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...en-engine.html
                              Originally posted by DeV View Post
                              Not just the Greens


                              Popular Mechanics 15/12/20: RAF to Use Sustainable Fuel Sources

                              Add some rapeseed oil into this mix and we could even get the Greens and the IFA singing off the same hymn-sheet.

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                              • Just like the rest of the RAF then
                                'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
                                'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
                                Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
                                He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
                                http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

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