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  • Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    Sick of saying it,Spark 23. Strip out an MPA or buy a second hand 235 and use it for dedicated transport/ crew familiarity/casevac/para, etc, etc. Utility is the watch word here.
    Nowhere to park it sure.
    ​​​​

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    • It wouldn't break the bank to tarmac and build another hangar.

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      • That's just an excuse; the only aircraft that need permanent hangarage are fabric covered wooden or light allow tubed airframes. Metal aircraft have been living out of doors since the day they first flew. NO operator of any airliner anywhere puts it into a hangar unless it's being serviced or overhauled. A-checks and all other routine,low level servicing is done outdoors,even in Ireland's climate. Even deep work such as engine and APU changes are done outdoors. Apart from that, only some business jet operators,who are obsessed with external appearance would consider parking aircraft indoors overnight. Helicopters are often hangared to keep them out of gusty winds but mostly,they live outside.

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        • Originally posted by Graylion View Post

          I'd rather a 3rd MPA
          And what exactly would the DF use for SOF PARA OPS, Cargo RESUP Missions to our overseas units etc etc if all the C-295's could be used for was Maritime Patrols?

          Navel Gazing or is that Naval gazing?
          "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

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          • Originally posted by apod View Post

            And what exactly would the DF use for SOF PARA OPS, Cargo RESUP Missions to our overseas units etc etc if all the C-295's could be used for was Maritime Patrols?

            Navel Gazing or is that Naval gazing?
            the C295s will allegedly be capable of rapid changeover to plain cargo/para/casevac. Allegedly. Not in the real world,though.

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            • Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post

              the C295s will allegedly be capable of rapid changeover to plain cargo/para/casevac. Allegedly. Not in the real world,though.
              I've seen the AC powerpoint briefing on the new aircraft. Impressive is not the word.They will be a huge leap up in terms of capability and range.And No.They will NOT just be used to fly over fishing boats.
              "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

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              • Originally posted by apod View Post

                And what exactly would the DF use for SOF PARA OPS, Cargo RESUP Missions to our overseas units etc etc if all the C-295's could be used for was Maritime Patrols?

                Navel Gazing or is that Naval gazing?
                A CASA 295 Doesn't have the range to reach Lebanon unrefuelled, let alone Mali. It is the wrong tool for the task. And since when do we need Para ops? I'd like 2 A321-XLR please so that we can delivr troops and supplies to most places our troops are active. We don't need a tactical transport. We need a bird with some range.

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                • Originally posted by Graylion View Post
                  A CASA 295 Doesn't have the range to reach Lebanon unrefuelled, let alone Mali. It is the wrong tool for the task. And since when do we need Para ops? I'd like 2 A321-XLR please so that we can delivr troops and supplies to most places our troops are active. We don't need a tactical transport. We need a bird with some range.
                  How do you know we don't need a Tactical Transport??

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                  • Originally posted by Charlie252 View Post

                    How do you know we don't need a Tactical Transport??
                    To be more precise, I'd put it way down the list. First priority is to get goods into theatre. Delivering them locally by plane comes after. Before acquiring paratroopers admittedly.

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                    • Originally posted by Graylion View Post
                      To be more precise, I'd put it way down the list. First priority is to get goods into theatre. Delivering them locally by plane comes after. Before acquiring paratroopers admittedly.
                      All part of the process, Air Transport has to be part of the mix.

                      What about Rapid resupply, ability to operate into non commercial airstrips, the ability to operate with out the need for ground service equipment, the ability to carry large loads and or Vehicles. The Ability to airdrop troops or materials. The ability to operate at night into unlit strips, the ability to extricate personnel from less then ideal environments???

                      And most importantly what air transport gives you is range and speed.

                      If you agree with the list above then the answer has to be a Tactical Air Lifter.

                      If the Missions is 150 troops and baggage to an international airport then the answer is an Airliner, and then charter is the best option.

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                      • Originally posted by Charlie252 View Post

                        All part of the process, Air Transport has to be part of the mix.

                        What about Rapid resupply, ability to operate into non commercial airstrips, the ability to operate with out the need for ground service equipment, the ability to carry large loads and or Vehicles. The Ability to airdrop troops or materials. The ability to operate at night into unlit strips, the ability to extricate personnel from less then ideal environments???

                        And most importantly what air transport gives you is range and speed.

                        If you agree with the list above then the answer has to be a Tactical Air Lifter.

                        If the Missions is 150 troops and baggage to an international airport then the answer is an Airliner, and then charter is the best option.
                        This could be the answer Charlie. Kill both birds with one stone. Though it can only manage 128 troops.

                        https://www.beehive.govt.nz/sites/de...0Factsheet.pdf

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                        • Originally posted by Graylion View Post

                          A CASA 295 Doesn't have the range to reach Lebanon unrefuelled, let alone Mali.
                          A C130J-30 doesn’t have the range to reach Beirut or Gao from Dublin

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                          • Originally posted by Graylion View Post

                            A CASA 295 Doesn't have the range to reach Lebanon unrefuelled, let alone Mali. It is the wrong tool for the task. And since when do we need Para ops? I'd like 2 A321-XLR please so that we can delivr troops and supplies to most places our troops are active. We don't need a tactical transport. We need a bird with some range.
                            Quite aware of that. The difference is the 295 only need one refueling stop. The 235 needed two.(To Beirut) Same with Mali(One stop),So no. It is not the wrong tool for the task.

                            Also. no one is talking about Para BNs or even Coys. Para OPS encompasses the ARW abilities to deploy both on island and abroad. So I ask again. Concentrate on purely Maritime support and what do we use to maintain the Wings capabilities?? The PC-12 is too small and unsuitable for that task.
                            "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

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                            • Originally posted by DeV View Post

                              A C130J-30 doesn’t have the range to reach Beirut or Gao from Dublin
                              It does DeV. In fact with 15 tonnes payload / 8 463L pallets it can. Beirut is 2115nm from Dublin. Check that fact sheet above again.

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                              • Originally posted by Anzac View Post

                                It does DeV. In fact with 15 tonnes payload / 8 463L pallets it can. Beirut is 2115nm from Dublin. Check that fact sheet above again.
                                15 Tonnes is perfect, 120 troops and a lot of baggage, ideal company size transport.

                                That Factsheet is gold dust should be sent to the Cabinet and the Sec Gen DOD along with a Picture of a Mowag driving out of a C-130..

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