Why we need Helicopters/ Disaster Imminent(Merged)..

[Goldie fish]

Where is the winch?

[Dogwatch]

Uk Cg S-92



The CHC S-92 operating in the UK now, replacing the S-61's

[Goldie fish]

Had we got medium lift helis back then, we could not have afforded alouette and gazelle replacements.
In hindsight, it was a good decision cancelling that order.

[DeV]

The air corps have the option to submit a tender to provide SAR cover in the same way as CHC scotia, or in the Past, Irish Helicopters have. However they have decided not to, and concentrate their meagre resources on military flying for now.

They could if they had had medium lift / range helicopters. But lets not get back to that one.

[Dogwatch]

The UK is moving slowly away from using the RAF as the Primary SAR asset. While the sight of the yellow Sea King is not gone from the skies, Coast Guard Sea Kings are taking over most of the Coastal work, as the RAF helo commitments become stretched with the new troop transport arrangements for the British Army. The SAR that the RN used to provide With their Distinctive Orange and Grey Sea Kings has diminished greatly in profile. Worth mentioning that there has been no mention of a replacement for the SAR sea kings in the UK, which have been in service since the early 70s.

CHC are now employing S-92's in the UK and are about to deploy AW139's


'Search and Rescue
CHC will deploy the Sikorsky S-92 and the Agusta Bell AB139 in connection with the Maritime and Coastguard Agency (MCA) SAR contract announced December 12, 2005. CHC will operate two S-92s at Stornoway and two S-92s at Sumburgh, plus two AB139s based at Lee-on-Solent and an additional AB139 at Portland.

The introduction of the S-92 and the AB139 will mean an increase in the Coastguard's operating range and speed, so that the time to arrive ‘on scene’ will be reduced. Combined with an increase in the speed of the winch, the overall result is a reduction in the time taken to get medical aid to those in need. '

http://www.chc.ca/europe_uk_search_and_rescue.php

[SARMAN]

Hi all
The only thing preventing the Air Corps from doing any kind of SAR is itself.The heads destroyed their own SAR by claiming that a labour dispute among the noncommissioned SAR crewmen brought about the end of AC SAR....The Alouette was too small and had only one engine...the Dauphin was better but not big enough and was a huge budget-eater...getting the S61 was simply too late.Official confidence in the Air Corps was lost.End of story.
regards
GttC

I think you are miss-informed on the labour dispute issue, your quite right about the capability of the Alouette and the Dauphin. As for why the AC lost SAR im not going to be dragged into a pissing contest because that is not what this thread is about and I think some people posting have hidden messages they may want to vent. If so i will meet you in the hand ball alley!!!! Joking by the way :-)
This thread was interesting but I will not be posting until it gets back on to the topic thats "Why we need Helicopters/ Disaster Imminent"
Slán..

The UK MCA are curently changing their fleet of SAR S-61's to 4x S-92's to the north and 3x AW 139's to the south. As Goldie said the UK mil still have to make up their mind on a Sea King eplacement, bit you can expect to see major changes in UK SAR from 2012 with a possible knock on effect here.

[GoneToTheCanner]

Hi Goldie
Probably a question of capacity.A civvie S61 can hold 26 casualties/survivors, so it's hard to beat.
regards
GttC

[Goldie fish]

I WOULD NEVER UNDERESTIMATE OR UNDERMINE WHAT AC SAR PERSONNEL HAVE DONE - GO MARDIS BEO SAYS IT ALL.

I'm not refering to times gone by when AC had aircraft on standby at various times in Shannon, Finner, Silgo, Waterford & the Don.

I'm refering to the situation NOW - the only SAR aircraft on standby in the Republic are those of CHC (a contractor (IMO for shame)).

The air corps have the option to submit a tender to provide SAR cover in the same way as CHC scotia, or in the Past, Irish Helicopters have. However they have decided not to, and concentrate their meagre resources on military flying for now.

SAR is not a military task. Their are actually very few countries who rely on the military air wing to provide SAR. Instead, it is provided by a coastguard, with the military providing a backup SAR function, due to the availability of CSAR assets. For example, the USN routinely flies SAR helis from its aircraft carriers, yet these are not considered primary SAR assets. Instead the USCG provides front line SAR, with the ANG providing a second line, with their CSAR para rescue helis. They already have the redundant capacity, so they use them.
The UK is moving slowly away from using the RAF as the Primary SAR asset. While the sight of the yellow Sea King is not gone from the skies, Coast Guard Sea Kings are taking over most of the Coastal work, as the RAF helo commitments become stretched with the new troop transport arrangements for the British Army. The SAR that the RN used to provide With their Distinctive Orange and Grey Sea Kings has diminished greatly in profile. Worth mentioning that there has been no mention of a replacement for the SAR sea kings in the UK, which have been in service since the early 70s.

[GoneToTheCanner]

Hi all
The only thing preventing the Air Corps from doing any kind of SAR is itself.The heads destroyed their own SAR by claiming that a labour dispute among the noncommissioned SAR crewmen brought about the end of AC SAR....The Alouette was too small and had only one engine...the Dauphin was better but not big enough and was a huge budget-eater...getting the S61 was simply too late.Official confidence in the Air Corps was lost.End of story.
regards
GttC

[DeV]

I WOULD NEVER UNDERESTIMATE OR UNDERMINE WHAT AC SAR PERSONNEL HAVE DONE - GO MARDIS BEO SAYS IT ALL.

I'm not refering to times gone by when AC had aircraft on standby at various times in Shannon, Finner, Silgo, Waterford & the Don.

I'm refering to the situation NOW - the only SAR aircraft on standby in the Republic are those of CHC (a contractor (IMO for shame)).

[hptmurphy]

Its hows the professionalism and the commitment shown by the CG..Top notch bunch of guys putting their life on the line for others...carrying on the tradition the AC SAR units built in their days in the role.

Very positive article good to see positive reporting on the subject.

I will stand corrected on this. But I think you will find that SARMAN is an ex member of the Aer corp

Good for him thank you for providing the SAR cover for 30 years when the state didn't give a damn as is proven by the conditions the crews were expected to operate under and with the machinery to hand.

I think the point was missed....We will be eternally greatful to those who did the job under the worst conditions immaginable with very little recognition.....The whole scenario has taken giant leaps for ward but none should under estimate those who did the job in the past.

I never intended it to be a slight on anyone involved.

[GoneToTheCanner]

Dev
You are underinformed.For years, the Duty SAR crew in the Don stayed in the Duty room 25 yards from the aircraft.They even had their own door, facing the aircraft.They were never off-base during their shift and were only out of the duty room to use the toilet or go to the dining hall/mess in small groups, with someone always in attendance at the duty room.They literally could be in the aircraft in seconds, if they needed to. Then it depended on how quickly they could get on the full body SAR suit and get the engine started. Mere minutes in the case of the Alouette.
Quite simply, they were good enough for long enough, when it mattered.
regards
GttC

[SARMAN]

Quite correct I am an ex-member of the unit. At no time have I ever said or tried to under estimate what the Air-Corp have done in SAR infact they have produced world class crewmen and pilots who do SAR all over the world and are highly regarded in all SAR circles. I have lost friends and work mates in the Air-Corps SAR and they should never be forgotten.. Go Mardis Beo

[Jetjock]

Nice article in Todays Munster Express on the SAR unit in waterford..no I'm not scanning it on....very good read and totally vilifies what has been said about the coast guard units.

In what way does it vilify the CG murf?