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Re: C27 J on DF wishlist

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  • Re: C27 J on DF wishlist

    Elite corps parachutes in for demo

    A MILITARY transport plane in use by NATO air forces has put on a demonstration for the Irish Defence Forces, and has been used to parachute elite Army Rangers in an airdrop.

    The twin engined American-made C-27J Spartan, used by US, Greek and Italian air forces was tested at Baldonnel airbase before Christmas and later visited Sligo regional airport.

    The long-range aircraft gave a demonstration of it's very short take off capabilities and airdropped Army Rangers before an audience of Army top brass.

    The plane - which can carry 24 paratroops, an armoured car and a jeep - is believed to be on the Irish Army's 'wish list' this year to help move forces on UN peace-keeping missions and bring humanitarian aid to Irish NGOs, but budget constraints make it a big wish.

  • #2
    Not such a big wish if it replaced the Govt Jet.....we could defeat the enemy by dropping Irish bureaucrats into their government and civil service buildings and sit back to watch their comparatively advanced nations (ie Somalia) crumble into ruin.

    Seriously I think that Bertie might have been shaken by not being allowed to play with the other children in afghanistan due to the whole issue of our logistical abilities or lack thereof
    "It is a general popular error to imagine that loudest complainers for the public to be the most anxious for it's welfare" Edmund Burke

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    • #3
      There was a write up about that in this month's An Cosantoir. I don't have it to hand but I'm pretty sure that said they jumped out of the CASA.
      "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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      • #4
        Now call me stupid(Stupid!!) but would it make any sense at all to get something like a C27 instead of a new government jet?
        Could the seating arrangements be changed depending on the role,ie. benches for normal troop transport/parachuting etc,and normal airline seating with different pitch for long range transport or VIP.
        We know mary can rough it...the casa hardly has what you would call first class seating,and the onboard meals are minimal at best(unless you bring take away)
        So then could you get a twin engine turboprop such as the C27 or C295 to be used for MATS or troop transport/Cargo??
        A single role aircraft such as a mini executive jet serves no purpose in our Air Corps. At least the BBJ could carry troops (in some comfort) to overseas missions,the new jet couldnt even carry a section!


        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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        • #5
          lets see this one again..
          The Kingair is being replaced,and everyone assumes its with a learjet or some other impractical toy...wouldnt one of these make more sense? I mean,it has a ramp so harney coud find it much easier to get into than the SKA200,twin Turboprops,more forgiving on jet novices than turbofans,and whats more It could be used for all those neglected military tasks such as Military transport, combat parachuting,military transport,military transport etc..get the picture?

          I am sure they could strap down an armchair for Harney to sit in if the bench seats were not to her fat arses liking..


          Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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          • #6
            They were talking about the new government jet on Pat Kenny yesterday. He mentioned getting something big-ish, but getting it in modular form so it could be converted for personnel transport or cargo. At least someone in the mainstream media is giving it some serious thought.
            "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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            • #7
              Was there ever any further talk about the possible purchase of the C27J?? Ive heard several months ago that this issue is still on this said wishlist and the IAC are still looking for this aircraft to give them a Tactical Airlift Capability in support of DF units operating domestically and acourse overseas aswell as NGOs operating in places such as Africa or transporting goods to to Disaster Zones etc...

              Oh and was there ever any photos of this visit??? I know it was a long time ago but ive searched Franks site and havent found any or did anybody withness the visit themselves.
              British officer: You're seven minutes late, Mr. Collins.
              Michael Collins: You've kept us waiting 700 years. You can have your seven minutes.

              [As the British flag comes down]

              Michael Collins: So that's what all the bother was about.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by FMolloy
                They were talking about the new government jet on Pat Kenny yesterday. He mentioned getting something big-ish, but getting it in modular form so it could be converted for personnel transport or cargo. At least someone in the mainstream media is giving it some serious thought.
                Yes but it was PAT{the plank} KENNY.
                Trouble, Trouble, I tried to chase trouble but its chasing me.
                Trouble, trouble, trouble with a capitol T
                do do do do do do do da do do do. etc etc......

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                • #9
                  Blue Max, I think it was reported on Franks old message board by P.Doff, who is still a poster on the present site, but the old message board seems to be inaccessable at the moment, why not PM Frank?
                  The ARW have jumped from our own Casa's, but they did a demo from the C27j as well, I am pretty sure the post that was on Franks site mentions this.
                  "We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey"
                  Radio transmission, siege of Jadotville DR Congo. September 1961.
                  Illegitimi non carborundum

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by The Blue Max
                    Was there ever any further talk about the possible purchase of the C27J??
                    This was an unsolicited visit. Manufacturers have done this many times over the years, particularly when they hear the AC has an interest or is looking for replacements.
                    "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by The Blue Max
                      Was there ever any further talk about the possible purchase of the C27J?? Ive heard several months ago that this issue is still on this said wishlist and the IAC are still looking for this aircraft to give them a Tactical Airlift Capability in support of DF units operating domestically and acourse overseas aswell as NGOs operating in places such as Africa or transporting goods to to Disaster Zones etc...

                      Oh and was there ever any photos of this visit??? I know it was a long time ago but ive searched Franks site and havent found any or did anybody withness the visit themselves.
                      We should be thinking of the C-130J not the C27J. We need a decent airlift capacity and could do with 2 of them. Of course while the government has that crappy government jet its unlikely that they will fund transport planes for the aircorps.

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                      • #12
                        Interesting article re ireland testing the C27J here.

                        http://images.google.ie/imgres?imgur...ctive%26sa%3DN

                        Bulgaria Finalizes Order for 8 C-27J "Baby Hercs"
                        28-Feb-2006 08:41 | Permanent Link
                        Related stories: New Systems Tech, Transport & Utility, Finmeccanica, Lockheed Martin, Americas - Other, Australia & S. Pacific, Europe - Other, Contracts - Intent

                        Finmeccanica notes that a the C-27J Spartan (aka. "Baby Herc"), developed as a joint venture between its Alenia Aeronautica subsidiary and Lockheed Martin, has been finalized as Bulgaria's choice to replace its current fleet of Antonov An-26 "Curl" airlifters. The Bulgarians want 8 C-27Js, which share significant commonalities with the C-130J Hercules that extend to most of their avionics and their engines as well as their look. The "Baby Hercs" will be used for troops and material transport within Bulgaria, and may also participate in NATO operations (Bulgaria has been a NATO member since April 2004) as they are fully compliant with civil and military interoperability standards. Contract negotiations are due to start shortly.


                        C-130J Hercules
                        (click to view full)The C-27J has been ordered so far by the Air Forces of Italy (12) and of Greece (12, in a deal worth EUR 297 million). In the U.S. the aircraft is a candidate for the FCA (Future Cargo Aircraft) program to provide local airlift within theater, and Spartans are also being proposed as Canada's new search-and-rescue aircraft. Finmeccanica notes that the C-27J is also under evaluation by Portugal, "other countries recently become NATO members," plus Australia (to replace the fantastic but aged DH-4 Caribou), Ireland and Taiwan.


                        Whatever came of this? Anyone?

                        In most of these cases, the C-27J is competing with CASA's C-295. Based on DID's research, the key tradeoff is that CASA aircraft is more efficient per flight hour and also longer, which gives it the capacity for more standard pallets. On the other hand, the C-27J offers extensive Hercules compatibility, as well as internal dimensions and floor strength levels that let it carry smaller armored vehicles like an M113 or even a prepared OH-58C Kiowa helicopter internally.
                        "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
                        "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

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                        • #13
                          The U.S. military recently selected the C-27J over the C-295 as its Joint Cargo Aircraft. As you say, C-130 compatibility seems to have been a major factor.

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                          • #14
                            Hi all
                            The C-27J is a warmed over G222, an aircraft with which the Don is already familiar. It can go neither far nor fast so as a long-range load lifter( to Africa or the Near East) it's no bloody good.The only suitable aircraft is a Herc...if you don't see it earning it's crust in Africa or suchlike, then it's not good enough.
                            End of story
                            regards
                            GttC

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                            • #15
                              I have to agree with GTTC here, the C-27J would be ok as a parachute trainer, or for getting a very gross health minister from one side of the country to the other to do something totally unimportant, but if the government are serious about anything, then the C-130J is the best choice....
                              "We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey"
                              Radio transmission, siege of Jadotville DR Congo. September 1961.
                              Illegitimi non carborundum

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