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Soldiers (ALLEGEDLY) advised not to join ARW

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  • Soldiers (ALLEGEDLY) advised not to join ARW

    Soldiers advised not to join Rangers
    05 August 2007 By John Burke

    The elite Irish Army Ranger Wing (ARW) is facing a crisis as soldiers’ representative body PDforra is set to discourage members against joining the anti-terrorist force.

    The Sunday Business Post has learned that the specialist army unit has lost experienced members to private security companies in the Middle East and Europe, while others have returned to regular army units, due to low morale over the allowance paid to ARW members.

    A request to review and increase the allowance has been turned down. This ha s prompted PDforra to recommend that serving regular army members cease volunteering to join the ARW at the representative body’s forthcoming annual conference, in the absence of a commitment to higher pay and enhanced career paths for specialist troops.

    However, the Department of Finance has told PDforra that no additional money is available to increase the weekly allowance of e 143.01 per member on top of the basic salary paid to the 100-strong elite unit.

    Private security companies offer salaries of more than €2,500 per week to experienced ex-ARW members to serve as so-called ‘‘shadow guards’’ on valuable cargo passing through European ports.

    Ex-rangers can command more than €1,000 per day in Afghani s tan and Iraq, although only a small number are believed to have accepted such high-risk contracts.

    ARW troops face heightened risk of injury due to demanding training and duty. All soldiers who joined the army after the introduction of a new system of contracts must now pass rigorous fitness levels at five and 12-year junctures or risk their contracts being revoked.

    http://www.sbpost.ie/post/pages/p/st...689-qqqx=1.asp

  • #2
    What do the PDF lads on here think of this move by PDFORRA?

    Comment


    • #3
      What, the ARW gets extra pay? What's wrong with pay accoring to rank, as per most normal countries?

      NTM
      Driver, tracks, troops.... Drive and adjust!!

      Comment


      • #4
        Unlike their American/UK and European counterparts, our SF do not get paid extra money for Parachuting, Diving, Hazardous Duty or any of their other specialist qualifications. AFAIK, they are paid a flat allowance called ARW Allowance, which is supposed to cover all these aspects.

        Comment


        • #5
          Doesn't specialist troops in the US recieve extra pay as well?

          High risk duty allowance etc?

          Rangers, airborne, force recon, etc


          And to the arw members joining private security companies, i seriously don't blame them.

          Comment


          • #6
            Cal...ARW are also paid according to rank, as well as the usual allowances payable.

            poor form by PDFORRA...soldiers leaving for better paying civvy jobs is nothing new. air corps especially suffered over the years with pilots and winchmen, mechanics, etc. all leaving for better paying jobs in civvy land. but its not exclusive to them..i know of guys getting apprenticeships and leaving as soon as possible, officers get degrees and move into business, etc.

            however for PDFORRA to advise for serving members not to try to join the unit is poor tactics and smacks of a publicity stunt to gain attention. whatever problems there are should not be aired in a way that makes them worse. if ARW is under strength due to personnel returning to units (as always happens regardless for many reasons) no point increasing the problem by encouraging others not to join.

            i would advise anybody considering the ARW to do selection....a great learning experience that will serve you well and increase soldiering skills even if it is not passed. if it is passed there are huge opportunities for skills development and career. plus the extra pay:wink:
            personnel going forward for it know what is expected of them and what pay and conditions they will receive. most will decide to try to join not for monetary reasons, there are easier ways to make a few extra euros!
            Last edited by X-RayOne; 5 August 2007, 19:29.
            Fate whispers to the warrior, "There is a storm coming"

            And the warrior whispers back "I am the storm".

            Comment


            • #7
              Have to agree with what pdforra are trying to do

              The lads who are going into the arw are going into it for there own reasons and are not getting the pay they deserve, however there are always other companies that will pay better no matter what industry you are in.

              Comment


              • #8
                whilst not wanting to get into the rights and wrongs of this

                when the pilots were making a big big fuss of leaving and the department

                bent over and had its bellied tickled

                pilots got a retention bonus - of which they still get

                and after 9 11 when even the wright brothers couldnt get jobs as pilots

                the Dept still payed this

                and I beleive they are still paying it to lads who are so near retirement that it would be

                great if they just went.


                This ha s prompted PDforra to recommend that serving regular army members cease volunteering to join the ARW at the representative body’s forthcoming annual conference, in the absence of a commitment to higher pay and enhanced career paths for specialist troops.
                Has anyone who is a serving member actually seen any of this recomendation

                I know I havent- I havent seen any on one of the biggest barracks in the Country

                I havent even heard of anyone talking about this.

                Could it be black propoganda by the department.

                air corps especially suffered over the years with pilots and winchmen, mechanics, etc. all leaving for better paying jobs in civvy land
                Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                Are full of passionate intensity.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by California Tanker View Post
                  What, the ARW gets extra pay? What's wrong with pay accoring to rank, as per most normal countries?

                  NTM
                  If they are a private when the did selection, they get promoted to corporal on completion of the basic skills course (which could be up to €90 extra a week) and €143 a week ARW allowance.

                  I know from an SAS book (think it was one of Andy McNabbs) that they work something like this (can't remember exactly so apologies for an errors):
                  - when an NCO joins they lose their rank and become a trooper (private)
                  - they only get their rank back (plus pay) and their special allowance after they have completed the specialist course for their troop (platoon).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    But dont SAS members stay at their rank in their original regiment, and only go back to trooper in the SAS??
                    What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Don't know just saying it isn't just the ARW that get an extra allowance.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by kermit
                        Hedgehog, there is a massive shortage of pilots in civie street.
                        after 9 11 there wasnt

                        and some of our biggles

                        wouldnt even get to fly for ryan air


                        the point i was making though Kermit

                        was the dept went over board to pay to retain the prima donna pilots

                        who were simply delaying the air lingus entry

                        whilst the ARW who do a really really really valuable piece of work etc etc

                        but as i also said I dont know anyone who was told not to apply
                        Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                        Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                        The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                        The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                        The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                        Are full of passionate intensity.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          im not too keen on pdforra recommending not to apply for something that is so valuable and necessary for the defence forces, i realise that they have a responsibility to their members to advise for what it thinks is the greater good for its members.

                          personally i dont think that any of the people that go for the ARW do it for the money, I would imagine that is one of the last things on their mind.

                          also, personally double the defence forces wages in my opinion, they earn it fully.
                          courage, endurance, mateship and sacrifice

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            if it is passed there are huge opportunities for skills development and career. plus the extra pay
                            If you pass but do not get offered a place in the wing, do you get a pay rise or any benefit?
                            "Why, it appears that we appointed all of our worst generals to command the armies and we appointed all of our best generals to edit the newspapers. I mean, I found by reading a newspaper that these editor generals saw all of the defects plainly from the start but didn't tell me until it was too late. I'm willing to yield my place to these best generals and I'll do my best for the cause by editing a newspaper"
                            Gen. Robert E. Lee

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by womble View Post

                              personally i dont think that any of the people that go for the ARW do it for the money, I would imagine that is one of the last things on their mind.

                              I agree but in comparison to other countries SF, they seem to be grossly underpaid.

                              Comment

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