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Low morale in the DF (moved from RM)

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  • #16
    go on my son you tell him
    Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.

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    • #17
      [QUOTE=Connaught Stranger;197537]". . . almost had 10 years service as a full time soldier 9 years 1 day ? 9 years 1 month?
      Are you adding your time as a member of the Reserve in amongst the 10 years ? or is that extra?

      So your mentality is if there was enough work in civy street you would be off! Met your type before in my service, only in it for the money or the cushy numbers.




      All are volunteers in the Defence Forces, you serve overseas, you get your leave then its back to work, if you have to go again then think of the extra money to help pay your "finanical commitments and constraints." (so your relationships are under strain, imagine how she would feel if you were deployed to an actual war, like some of the international armies you are whining on about).



      I never denied it it did not occur, you were asked by me, to list what type of bullying mental or physical and to give instances, you can leave out names, use Private X and Corporal Z.



      Tough titty you joined the military and guard duties, cash in transit, border patrols, Officers orderly, bar work or even waiter in the Mess, or "dixie bashing" is all part and parcel of the job. If you dont like it, well you know where the gate is don't let it hit you in the arse on the way out.




      NO! you don't have an Army per se you have an Irish Defence Forces, which you are foolishly trying to compare to N.A.T.O. players out there in Europe. Ireland's military is not comparable to other European countries due to its small size, So your argument for an international standard goes out the window (Read up on the kit deficiencies the British are experiencing in Afghanistan and Iraq, same as the Americans, if they cant get all they want, do you realy think the Minister of Finance will approve an open Budget for the Irish Defence Forces I am sure that will go down well with the Irish Taxpayer who pay your wages. As I read this you seem to be a driver, so what's the point in giving you all new kit to play with? You will never get near it because your trade description is Driver. . . .


      (A case of Penis Envy Syndrome with regards International Military Forces.)??



      I find your percentages to be way high, care to prove any of that? (How is your problem because without proof you are making unfounded accusations,) you can list the UN Missions you were on as well by year if you want.

      Please explain having worked very closely with the Cavalry, were you even part of the Armoured section or not, I stood closely beside Panard 90's APC in the Lebanon does that mean I am working very closely with the Cavalry??.

      (A case of I want to be in the Cavalry Envy Syndrome??)

      Originally posted by The Thing View Post
      I cannot supply a statistical fact count on the GS model Nissan patrol only to say that they are an unsafe vehicle to drive in my respects, they have no ABS braking system, no radio for driver comfort (you know some of us have to do those long cashes that you seem to love and long escorts and details) . Poor lighting alightment for the driver. No first aid kits or proper break down kits.

      Well, they might not be suited for cross country, but lets be truth full and admit in Ireland's Green Isle you wont be doing much of that, you should have spent time in the back of a canvas top landrover in the middle of winter, or with a Toyota Land Cruiser. You had a jack, wheel brace, etc... what more Gucci kit do you need??

      A civvie Radio for Driver comfort!!!!! ROFLAO

      (Sonny, you are suffering from "White Van Man" Syndrome.)



      So you claim to be a founding member of P.D.F.O.R.R.A.? have you ever held a post with them??



      So you contend all the guys who join the R.M. from Ireland are ex-members of the Irish Defence Forces sour because they did not get enough "Bling-Bling" to play with!!!

      Would love to see the look on the Recruiting N.C.O.'s face when he reads that answer to: "Why do you want to join H.R.H. Royal Marine Commandos:"

      And I feel sorry for the poor buggers who get stuck on duty with you and have to listen to your complaining, and comments on what should be done and how it should be done.

      You try to word your posts as to show its all about the "thousands of other soldiers" who feel the same way as you do, well I dont here them shouting, I cant recal any posting comments here, I cant recall from when talking to friends back home in
      P.D.F.O.R.R.A. that there was such a critical equipment problem, to my mind its all about YOU!

      Barrack Room Liar Syndrome?

      Through the history of any military there are those who will always be playing at catch up, its a part of the job, you are in a military that is confined to a certain financial budget, there is very little justification in spending excessive amounts of money on equipment you do not need or will never have the cause to use.

      Connaught Stranger.

      All I can say to you Connaught Stranger is that if you are happy then we all are.
      You are taking my points on why many members of the defence forces might leave the PDF and join the Marines in the total wrong context. I once again stick firmly to the belief that if those people who left were satisfied with the defence Forces in the first place then they wouldn't leave.
      I was never a founding member nor did I say that I was a founding member of PDFORRA. If as you say morale with the job was so strong then such a body would not have been founded and would have ceased by now to function due to lack of interest. The majority of enlisted men and women to this date are members of PDFORRA as it fights to make the job for a soldier, sailor and airman a better place.
      But once again I'm glad all is well in your utopian vision of the defence forces
      Last edited by The Thing; 26 February 2008, 13:17.

      Comment


      • #18
        I for one did not join the DF to become a bar waiter or a batman .. If I wanted to be a waiter then I could look for a job in the Shelbourne.. Was detailed once when a Pvt to serve at Officers XMAS dinner party, went to see the CS respectfully told him I had not joined to become a waiter and was promptly switched to a 24hr checkpoints, standby..He understood what I was on about , I was happy some guy looking for a cushier no was happy, CS looked at me in a different light . NOT SURE WHY ALL SOLDIERS JOIN CAN ONLY SPEAK FOR MYSELF: a little patriotism, tradition, liked outdoor life keeping fit, wanted to blow up things , shoot weapons maybe even a few bods so welcomed training etc. However Barrack guards most boring duty u can do and if u ever did one at the Old Collins Bks, Dublin not really an effective way of securing a barracks .
        Cash Escorts well a debate as to whether soldiers should be doing this work, thank god there has not been a shootout in the likes of Thomastown with 5.56 bouncing around sure half the town would be wiped out. Its ridiculous a section of troops popping out of cars armed to the teeth and frightening the old age pensioners.. No Hedgehog I am not yet an OAP.
        So THING has a few points whether he has 9, 10 or 20 years in the DF IS NEITHER HERE NOR THERE I know guys who did their 21 and managed to avoid all aspects of soldiering but they called themselves soldiers.

        Comment


        • #19
          Less of the personal attacks folks. The Thing has a valid opinion, regardless of his service. Just because he wasn't serving in the stone age(also known as the 70s and 80s ) does not mean his opinions should be cast aside.

          BTW, if you worked on APCs in Liberia, you worked very closely with cav, and their Panhards.

          The fact is, like everything else in this country, only lipservice is given to the defence forces. The idea that part scavenging is an acceptable practice would be fine for a 20 year old armoured car, not for a 3 year old APC still under warranty, where the Manufacturer was under obligation to supply spares as required. Back in the 70s every Cav Sqn had its own Workshop Vehicle and Recovery vehicle. Nowdays these items are a LSB item, and LSB, in particular base workshops, don't go overseas much any more.


          Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

          Comment


          • #20
            Dear Thing,
            I had the pleasure of serving for ten years in the Defence Forces during which time i crammed as many career courses and trips overseas as you could care for. I thoroughly enjoyed it. But you won't carve out a rewarding career in the DF sitting around on your arse cribbing and moaning about issues that are decided above your pay scale. You get out of it, what you put in soldier !
            Any tool can be uncomfortable

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by black ops View Post
              Dear Thing,
              I had the pleasure of serving for ten years in the Defence Forces during which time i crammed as many career courses and trips overseas as you could care for. I thoroughly enjoyed it. But you won't carve out a rewarding career in the DF sitting around on your arse cribbing and moaning about issues that are decided above your pay scale. You get out of it, what you put in soldier !
              Some common sense in a short post... more like it!!.. and maybe an addition as follows, Thing, if you dont like it, get out.. the Army was never famed for good wages, so if your looking for good wages and a steady job, just hit civvi street and build a civvi career for yourself, I did so with relative success that Im more then happy with... being a whinger is bad for unit morale, so bear the bright lights of civvi street in mind before you start again, cos its certainly obvious from you novel sized posts that you can only be happier there...

              Exo...
              "There is nothing braver then the heart of a volunteer" Lt. Col. Dolittle, USAC, 1941.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by black ops View Post
                Dear Thing,
                I had the pleasure of serving for ten years in the Defence Forces during which time i crammed as many career courses and trips overseas as you could care for. I thoroughly enjoyed it. But you won't carve out a rewarding career in the DF sitting around on your arse cribbing and moaning about issues that are decided above your pay scale. You get out of it, what you put in soldier !
                I totally agree with the above, just sorry I cannot express myself in so few words

                If "Thing" is so in favour of P.D.F.O.R.R.A., and holds them in such high regard,

                then why have they not been able to address all his concerns,

                with regards bullying, health and safety, "Driver comfort" ??

                Connaught Stranger
                Last edited by Connaught Stranger; 27 February 2008, 08:51.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by The Thing View Post
                  As a serving soldier I can say that there are so many problems with the defence forces where do I start....
                  Quit bitching, you don't even know you've been born.
                  sigpic
                  Say NO to violence against Women

                  Originally posted by hedgehog
                  My favourite moment was when the
                  Originally posted by hedgehog
                  red headed old dear got a smack on her ginger head

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Malek
                    Jesus wept.

                    None of the above have anything to do with soldiering in the real sense of the word. You obviously come from an era where you might get to see a pack ration once every five years.
                    It must be very disappointing for a young lad to be taken in by the Defence Force advertisements on TV and then realise that the reality of Military Service is as outlined in the above paragraph. I don't particularly agree with everything The Thing has said but some of his arguments have merit.

                    If you don't like it, try and fix it!

                    So do tell us all about REAL soldiering then!! I am all ears.

                    Well that will teach you to believe all you see on television then. Your young lad or lassie as the case may be VOLUNTEERED (even more surprising that the THING waited in for 10 years!! if it was so bad why did it not not leave before that)

                    So a Pack Ration a day is the mark of a good soldier, get a life!

                    It boils down to this, a whining red-arse will get nothing fixed, you are there to take orders and do the duties prescribed to you, end of story.

                    I served from the 4th of May 1976 till the 24th of October 1997, and my first two Guard duties were done in Custume Barracks, Athlone as a recruit.

                    Straight after passing out, I served in the 28th Infantry Bn, Finner Camp, where our main duties were Border Patrols, Border Checkpoints, Camp Guard, in between you slotted in your 3 Star Course, Regimental Signals Course and 84mm Anti-Tank Course.

                    When work in civvy street was on the up, many soldiers jacked in the army, so that meant we who remained (because we considered this to be what soldiering was all about) were doing a week on Patrol, 5 days off, a day on H.Q. Guard, Resting off, Cliff Power station Guard, Resting off, a Day on General Duties, then a day on Guard, resting off before being slotted back on Border Patrol.

                    *General Duties such as peeling spuds, Dixie Bashing, Hut and later Block Orderly, Company Runner, etc.. etc..

                    I have even know of H.Q. Guard in Finner Camp to consist of 2 Privates , a Corporal, and a Sgt as Guard Commander, as there were not enough Privates to go around.

                    I have no idea how many Guard Duties I have performed, but I performed them in:

                    Athlone, Finner Camp, Cliff Power Station, Sligo Post Office, Manorhamilton Military Post, Blacklion Checkpoint* Rockhill House, Renmore Barracks, McDonagh Guard in the Curragh, Kilworth.

                    I have also lost count of all the Border Patrols done even before there was any such thing as Cash in Transit Patrols, as well as all the hours spent on Clayore Checkpoint checkpoint duty.

                    I did the Dublin Fire strike, and I also spent hours scouring the beaches and shores on the Donegal coast retrieving pieces of wrecked fishing boats, as well as searching for the bodies of the crew.

                    I also served with "C" Company, 46th Irish Battalion in U.N.I.F.I.L.

                    I was placed on attachment to Castlebar Military Barracks, and being the only single guy there spent weeks in the Curragh Camp as an orderly on various courses at the Military College, I spent 4-6 weeks at a time in Renmore, Galway while the Armourers were annually checking the 18th Inf. Bn. weapons, because that was what the job was all about.

                    I came out with my pension, and the word EXEMPLARY written beside the Military Conduct section in my L.A.89. And I am very proud of my service in the Irish Defence Forces & U.N.

                    The problem today is some you want to have Union Rules in a non-union job and you want to be up there with the "INTERNATIONAL" N.A.T.O. Forces, well that ain't going to happen while you are not in N.A.T.O.

                    And I have said it before and I will say it again, its all relative to a matter called Finance, if you have a small military budget then you will have to learn to live with peanuts, and work with monkeys.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Take care, breaks being thrown all over the place here.


                      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        The thing makes no valid points what so ever

                        we are wasting valuable space and time debating the writings of a liar

                        and worse still and exagerator.

                        His ramblings on 2 Bn are pooh -

                        we are all Soldiers here- either full time or Reserves- we all have had some pretty hard

                        times- but what made us stand out as Soldiers and seperated us from wasters

                        was - we did what we were told- we dried our eyes and we moved on- plain and simple.

                        If the DIm thinks he is being bullied- then surely its cowardly of him to come on here

                        anonmyously and say that-

                        surely you have a duty to report it-

                        like wise if you know

                        of others being bullied but prefer to write about it than do something- people like that are

                        called Clonanbergs.

                        Whether Nissans are safe- whether the radio doesnt work- whether your like me and hate

                        hate hate hate Cash escorts -doesnt mean squat now -

                        because I for one wont listen to you because your a

                        cribber

                        and you can bet your spotty arse that 99% of the real soldiers on here

                        saw you for what you are

                        a whinger.

                        One of the great things about the DF is if you dont like it- no one will make you stay

                        so why dont you fkuc off and stop annoying us- we have real work to do on here

                        like slag of gingers and try and figure who has the bigger tits SNB or SUil Ni G.

                        Do one

                        by the way- stop PMing me you sick (cant put the rest because I will get points)
                        Last edited by hedgehog; 27 February 2008, 17:57.
                        Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                        Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                        The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                        The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                        The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                        Are full of passionate intensity.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Whinging was a capital offense in my old unit, and listening to Guys like "Thing" and other things like him, I understand why we had a zero tolerance to guys like that... Ive seen OTT stuff in my unit, but nothing we didnt sort out in double quick order.... case closed, drive on!!... period!!...
                          "There is nothing braver then the heart of a volunteer" Lt. Col. Dolittle, USAC, 1941.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by hedgehog View Post
                            ....by the way- stop PMing me you sick (cant put the rest because I will get points)
                            You're being stalked you jammy bstard.
                            sigpic
                            Say NO to violence against Women

                            Originally posted by hedgehog
                            My favourite moment was when the
                            Originally posted by hedgehog
                            red headed old dear got a smack on her ginger head

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Groundhog View Post
                              You're being stalked you jammy bstard.
                              I always thought the eastern command guys were close knit

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                The original/start of this thread does highlight some genuine concerns, and some that are a reflection of softness. While check parade's may be a pain at 1615, the working day is until 1630...and that's what we're all paid for. Don't complain about actually having to complete a full day in barracks. Surely this is a question of respect and trust...and this works both ways, up and down the chain of command. So the check parade at 1615 is a result of some unprofessional types skive-ing off and not being available for work. Sadly, the chain of command has to legislate for the lowest common demoninater - the waster!

                                'Driver comfort' is a laughable comment - more of a reflection on you than anyone else...

                                Bullying needs to be dealt with, immediately. This is what the chain of command, DCP's and any NCO or officer you may trust has to deal with. Report it fast. Don't apologise for it. Remember you took an oath of loyalty to the Constitution and the Defence Forces. Whether your a private or the Chief its the same oath....get on with it. Don't whinge on chat room.

                                Nobody wants the sh1t jobs like sweeping leaves in the barracks...a life less ordinary it isn't. All jobs have their unattractive, boring and rubbish parts. Weigh it against the positives and don't constantly think that the army can give you. It's a two way street.

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