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  • #31
    I'm a student and I work shift hours partime in a small firm, so I "kind of" get unpaid leave when it comes to field days, but I can't get every field day / weekend that is on the programme but I get as many as I can.

    No one seems to recognise that the vast majority of the lower ranks (ptes + cpls especially) are students, both secondary and third level, and have partime jobs

    The people who come up with training programmes, duties etc seen to assume that no one has anything to do outside work (full-time with regular hours) and RDF, just look at the fact that the PDF want RDF to cover duties in a number of barracks for a month (for which you WILL NOT receive security duty allowance)

    You can see an employers point in not wanting to lose an employee for 1+ weeks each year and holidays

    On an aside:
    RDFRA has be seeking guarantees on civilian employment and unpaid leave but the DOD says its a matter for the Dept of Entreprise, but under current legislation, representative bodies (ie PDFORRA, RACO, RDFRA) can't talk to anyone outside DOD


    • #32
      in that case, represent to DOD under S7 Second Schedule (o) - 2

      for an S7 change to sec.6 para (2) to include the relevant departments

      Cool. It's monday and already I'm DFR ing
      "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

      "No, they're trying to fly the tank"


      • #33
        military leave

        Greeting's all, been a while, I ended up in the Middle East for a while (year actually) with little or no internet, so I'm back home now and been checking in on the board.

        here in the US our jobs are protected by law if you are in the reserves. After my "trip" I returned to my old job, even same shift, everything. Of course it's unpaid leave, but it works as the Army pay covers the bills. We are allowed by law take unpaid leave for any training, courses, etc, which helps.

        Having said all the above though, reservists still get "invisible discrimination" on the job. I was passed over for a promotion, found out later through the grapevine the expression "well he is gone a lot with the Army" came up during discussions. That sort of thing happens a lot. It's illegal, but you have to prove they used it against you, and most of it is "informal" stuff like that. A mate in my unit who is in sales returned to find his sales route had been given to someone else and he got a crappier one, but he got his original job back so no laws broken.......

        Here there has been some mention of incentives, especially for smaller companies, but it's not getting a lot of attention despite the massive use of reserves since Sept 11. Simple, it'll cost money.

        If the RDFRA is looking for info on the US stuff, check out it's the office of DOD that is charged with facilitating employer/reservist issues. They may be helpful in the fight.

        Again, good to be back. Let the fun and games begin.


        • #34
          Ok need advice lads,

          im working in my 4th month of a 6 month contract, i need time off for recruit camp...

          should i ask for unpaid leave

          should i ask for the weeks holidays

          Which approach do you use or have you found to be the most accomodating to employers? do many like the unpaid leave idea or prefer you to use your own holidays? I was thinking of unpaid leave for ONE camp and then if my contract is further extended, ill take a weeks paid holidays for the annual camp.

          My boss is approacable, but im not sure what his reaction would be to this unpaid leave, im getting a "calling out notice" from my unit this week to say that i have been asked to attend camp or something which may facilitate me a little, I was thinking along the lines of, ill bring it in, let him read it and then ask for the unpaid leave.
          "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
          "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."


          • #35
            Initialily a recruitment agency got me this temporary position, I havent set myself up as a contractor, rather im working on a 3 month contract as a temporary employee, this is my second 3 months, but i get paid the same way as everyone else and they pay my PAYE for me, if thats what you mean?

            theres a chance at the end of my second 3 months that i may be taken on full time.

            Anyway i have signed a temporary contract with the company to keep me on here until the start of May and like i said they pay my taxes and i have the same rights as full timers, so your saying i should just go in and say, look i need 5 days unpaid leave in April for military service, heres my call out notice.
            "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
            "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."


            • #36
              Talk to your employer about it. The least costly option to your employer is take it as annual leave. The "call out notice" isn't worth the paper it is written on, it only really works in the public sector. In the private sector employers are smart enough to actually read the notice and will realise that all it is doing is asking the employer to release your. Basically if your employer is approachable talk to him and get his opinion.


              • #37
                Or perhaps go into him/her with your "call out notice" and ask them which is better for them, annual leave or unpaid leave, most people like the choice/option and if you are hopeing to become permenant in your job you may as well be nice to them until you are.

                Give them as much notice as possable.

                Tell them it will be 10 days this year but probally only 5 most years, best of luck.


                • #38
                  I would ask can you take unpaid leave that you are going to be with the RDF, if they say NO, then say you want to take the week in holidays


                  • #39
                    Start off with finding out can they let you off at the required time then negotiate whether or not you will take the time as unpaid or holidays. BTW Unpaid leave is more costly to your employer than paid leave.


                    • #40
                      I agree with Bravo20, all the "callout notice" says is you have been asked to attend training, the dates, location (I think?), and the rates of PRSI that will be deducted from your DF pay


                      • #41
                        Ok, so any final advice?

                        im going in today without a callout notice, Ive thought about it and dont think its a great idea to have one, im just going to ask can i take a week off in April, I dont have enough holidays to take the week, but im asking anyway. Im really stressed over this, for one thing, im still not sworn in so therefore technically dont qualify for recruit camp... yet if i keep waiting ill have little more than a weeks notice for my employer, not good.

                        Should i just say, i need a week off, or should i say i need a week off for RDF!? They dont know im in the RDF as i joined it AFTER i joined the company.
                        "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
                        "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."


                        • #42
                          I think you should tell them the reason. Most employers are pretty ok about it. The decision will be made on a business case anyway (i.e. can they spare you). Don't get to stressed but don't start jumping up and down regarding entitlements anyway.

                          Have you figured out if you will be sworn in before the camp? Is there a way you can make your holiday request provisional i.e. if you don't get sworn in can you cancel your holidays and go back to work.

                          Anyway good luck.


                          • #43
                            probally a better chance if you tell your boss why you need that week off,
                            ring your cadre first as ask when they expect you to be sworn in, it takes a couple of weeks between being sworn in and the payroll being sorted out.

                            dont get stressed,


                            • #44
                              I have given up my annual leave entitlements every year for the past 14 years to go on annual training..This can range from 1 week to 4 weeks. Initially it caused domestic problems but the wife understands that this is what I do for enjoyment .

                              My employers have never been friendly toward the concept of me dissappearing into the mists of time dressed up for war but who cares. The issue of paid time or unpaid time has been an issue for years but the employers will always win out as the DF does not carry enough clout to win them over. The DF are not taken seriously by many in civvy employment so our part time commitment is hard to understand.
                              Covid 19 is not over's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe


                              • #45
                                This is a real Bugbear of mine, I really believe retention rates in the RDF would be dramatically improved if RDP personnel were entitled under law to at least 1 week unpaid leave for training.
                                I may be wrong but I believe that this is the system in Europe, can anyone confirm this?

                                Unfortunately this is such a political Hot potato that progressive governments have avoided the issue.
                                Heres one for you, with the local elections coming up, put the question of Defence policy to the canvassers and see how they react.
                                I had great fun with them at the last general election; they squirm and try to direct the conversation towards health or education. :p
                                "Dwight D. Eisenhower: The best morale exists when you never hear the word mentioned. When you hear it it's usually lousy.