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  • Chain of Command - DOD / DF

    to bring things back onto a somewhat more serious note

    From Defence.ie

    SPEECH BY MR. PAT CAREY, T. D., MINISTER OF STATE AT THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENCE AT A COMMISSIONING CEREMONY FOR RESERVE DEFENCE FORCE OFFICERS

    Defence Forces Training Centre, 23 November 2008. Curragh

    Assistant Secretary, Chief of Staff, Distinguished Guests, Ladies and Gentlemen, I am delighted to be here in the Defence Forces Training Centre at the Curragh today to perform my first commissioning ceremony as Minister of State at the Department of Defence. My colleague, Minister O’Dea has asked me to pass on his best wishes to you all and to congratulate on his behalf the Reserve Officers who have just been commissioned. Unfortunately, he is unable to be present today because of Government business.

    Assistant Sec now gets preference over full Irish Defence Forces Chief of Staff

    no offence to the Civil Service

    but a poxy clerk is now higher than a decorated General

    FFS X 17
    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.

  • #2
    The Department of Defence is over the military so he would be credited first.
    It is only by contemplation of the incompetent that we can appreciate the difficulties and accomplishments of the competent.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Bam Bam View Post
      The Department of Defence is over the military so he would be credited first.
      Is that an opinion or is it a fact

      if its a fact- have you a source of reference
      Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
      Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
      The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
      The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
      The best lack all conviction, while the worst
      Are full of passionate intensity.

      Comment


      • #4
        Didn't you ask this before or am I experiencing deja vu? Again.


        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

        Comment


        • #5
          No before it was the Sec of the Dept

          this latest one is for the ass sect

          its really rubbing salt in the wound
          Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
          Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
          The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
          The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
          The best lack all conviction, while the worst
          Are full of passionate intensity.

          Comment


          • #6
            There has to be a DoD chain of command somewhere.


            Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Goldie fish View Post
              There has to be a DoD chain of command somewhere.
              I would love to see it
              Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
              Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
              The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
              The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
              The best lack all conviction, while the worst
              Are full of passionate intensity.

              Comment


              • #8
                Secretary General is the main man in a department

                So the Assistant secretary would be just a level below.

                Basically their DCOS.
                It is only by contemplation of the incompetent that we can appreciate the difficulties and accomplishments of the competent.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Goldie fish View Post
                  There has to be a DoD chain of command somewhere.


                  To the best of my knowledge the COS reports to the Minister (although DOD may think differently).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Bam Bam View Post
                    Secretary General is the main man in a department

                    So the Assistant secretary would be just a level below.

                    Basically their DCOS.
                    great and when the Min is making a speech at a civil service session

                    then Sec Gen is the top man

                    What I am asking is where does it say that the top civil servant in a dept is

                    higher than the top Soldier
                    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                    Are full of passionate intensity.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It likely comes down to either the preference of the speechwrite or not wanting a military representative to be seen as greater then the civilian government representative.

                      I don't have the answer for yoiu.
                      It is only by contemplation of the incompetent that we can appreciate the difficulties and accomplishments of the competent.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Maybe the PDFORRA know? They usually make speeches like this. They have to have the etiquette for such an occasion.


                        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I thought maybe that some of the boys were right

                          that a civil servant rated higher than a Soldier

                          but taken from http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/...,%20Templemore

                          Address by Mr. Brian Lenihan T.D. Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, at the Garda Graduation Ceremony, Garda College, Templemore
                          Commissioner, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen

                          and another passing out

                          Address by the Minister at the Garda Graduation Ceremony, Garda College Templemore


                          Commissioner, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen.
                          and yet again

                          Address by the Tánaiste at the Garda Reserve Graduation Ceremony in the Garda College Templemore
                          Commissioner, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen.

                          It is an honour and a very great pleasure for me to be here today to celebrate the graduation of the first Reserve members of An Garda Síochána.

                          Dept of education

                          23 February, 2004 - Speech by Mr. Noel Dempsey T.D. Minister for Education and Science At the Launch of the A.T.E.C.I. Booklet and Website On Monday 23rd February at Navan Education Centre

                          PLEASE CHECK AGAINST DELIVERY


                          A dhaoine uaisle go léir,
                          Agriculture

                          ADDRESS BY BRENDAN SMITH T.D. MINISTER FOR AGRICULTURE, FISHERIES AND FOOD AT THE OFFICIAL OPENING OF THE ASA CONFERENCE FRIDAY, 12th SEPTEMBER 2008


                          Thank you Mr President for your kind introduction.
                          ADDRESS BY MR. TREVOR SARGENT T.D. MINISTER FOR FOOD AND HORTICULTURE AT THE DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE, FISHERIES AND FOOD AT THE NATIONAL IRISH FOOD AWARDS, AT THE DINGLE PENINSULA FOOD AND WINE FESTIVAL AT 5.00PM ON SUNDAY 5th OCTOBER 2008 IN BENNERS HOTEL, DINGLE, CO. KERRY



                          Ladies and Gentlemen, a dhaoine uaisle, I am delighted to be here at the inaugural National Irish Food Awards, “Blás Na hÉireann”, the first awards of their kind in Ireland.
                          Health

                          Minister Moloney’s Speech opening the NDA Annual Research Conference
                          13 October 2008

                          Ladies and gentlemen, it is a great pleasure and privilege to be with you here today to formally open the National Disability Authority 2008 Research Conference. Sadly as a Laois man, I don’t get much opportunity to visit Croke Park in the Autumn time, so I am particularly glad to be with you here this morning
                          Minister Mary Wallace closes the 2008 HSE Community Games Finals on Sunday 24th August
                          24 August 2008

                          Good evening Ladies and Gentlemen,

                          I am delighted to be here today in my capacity as Minister with responsibility for Health Promotion to close the 2008 HSE Community Games Finals.

                          as you can see

                          from a LIMITED trawl through Govt web sites


                          there does NOT seem to be any protocol in this matter

                          and it may just be a lazy script write copying a previous lazy one

                          I think the precedence we should look at is the Garda Speeches
                          Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                          Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                          The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                          The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                          The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                          Are full of passionate intensity.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by kermit
                            There were 2 Minsters there. If it makes you feel better, the other minster was credited after the COS, in the actual speech.


                            to bring things back onto a somewhat more serious note

                            From Defence.ie

                            SPEECH BY MR. PAT CAREY, T. D., MINISTER OF STATE AT THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENCE AT A COMMISSIONING CEREMONY FOR RESERVE DEFENCE FORCE OFFICERS

                            Defence Forces Training Centre, 23 November 2008. Curragh

                            Assistant Secretary, Chief of Staff, Distinguished Guests, Ladies and Gentlemen
                            Actually it doesnt make me feel better

                            and well done whether intentionally or not but you also strengthened the case

                            how are the mandarins in the DOD putting an assistant sec (very senior clerk)

                            higher than the other Minister


                            Thanks Kermit- I know I can always rely on you
                            Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
                            Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
                            The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
                            The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
                            The best lack all conviction, while the worst
                            Are full of passionate intensity.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Doing a deep trawl for you hog [ but with your training you should have the answer for us ]
                              "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

                              "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

                              Comment

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