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What is killing the RDF?

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  • What is killing the RDF?

    What is killing the RDF?

    I have heard it is a combination of things-

    But one of the main things is people in the higher positions and the old-schoolers wanting to hang onto the "good old days" and keep it as a drinking club. And as a result this mentality is passed onto other members of their unit. From recruit up.
    I have seen this go on a fair bit (and too much for my liking) and I don't think that it has any place in the army whatsoever.

    And I am referring to people really overdoing it night after night on FTT. And I mean a little bit more than one or two.I think it is something that gives people in the RDF an incredibly bad name, as it leads to everyone being painted with the same brush.
    This also seems to have a knock on effect of driving out people from the organisation because they are not interested in this outdated culture. A case of "thanks but no thanks".

    For the record, I am not "bag bashing" as I have time for members of the RDF who are willing to approach things with the right mentality and get stuck in.
    But for those who think of it as a drinking club, don't bother wasting my time as well as yours.

  • #2
    What do you mean?

    I am sure that there are a lot of things that are killing the RDF.
    The current embargo being a major one, and a lack of resources etc.
    But these are things that are beyond our control in the RDF.

    I would side with your argument if you are putting it across that the drinking culture is something that is destroying the RDF. I would side with you there because that would be something that we, the RDF, do have to hold up our hands on because it is completely within our control.

    But the older generation seem to think that it is acceptable.
    And I would side with you on the point that it does put a lot of good people off staying/joining the RDF because its something that really isn't part and parcel of what you expect from being in the military when you see it go on.

    I know that you are not a "bag basher" jonesy because I have seen you post on this before. So I would agree with your comment on this.
    ghostrider
    CQMS
    Last edited by ghostrider; 15 October 2009, 19:18.

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    • #3
      I wouldn't put all the blame on the old sweats. There is a large element of Young NCOs and 3 Stars who love nothing more than to continue their student drinking habits while on annual training, regardless of the consequences.
      I had one particular individual who decided I was a wierdo and creep because I suggested that perhaps her being on duty with a hangover was not the best idea in the world.


      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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      • #4
        I wouldn't particularly blame the embargo. In my opinion it actually could of meant a time of restructuring and upskilling. Ie. focus on getting people on courses, free up NCO's to concentrate their attentions on keeping training interesting for trained men.

        Upskilling should of been the order of the day.

        From my end I am seeing "Platoons" with 4 privates and 3 NCOs. Completely useless Cadre that do not actively engage in training the troops and passing down their knowledge to the NCOS (my local issue is actually tearing a coy a part regarding lack of courses / bickersniping).

        Officers pretty much flapping about doing nothing. Discontent NCO's. Bored Privates.

        I would of liked to see people on courses as opposed to everyone holding their breath and concentrating on their training as opposed to speculating on issues of impending doom.

        The owl shweats have their place but it should be back room.

        Bring in annual IT's compulsory amount of training nights and range practices. If not met then wave the dead wood good bye as they are bringing everyone down with cynicism and nay saying.

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        • #5
          I really don't believe that the Reserve is regarded as a "Drinking Club", never mind being a contributor to its current state.

          But to have my two cents;

          We are being defined by our lack of function, I'm not really sure what current state of integration training is but for me canceling the first integrated troops going overseas was a serious blow, more serious in fact than most people suspect

          There also is a downward spiral in terms of numbers due to not having enough bodies to perform exercises, which leads to people getting frustrated and not coming the next time and then in turn less people turn up frustrating more people.

          A lack of responsibility/trust being given to anyone but the most senior of NCO ranks, but this maybe more prevalent in some units which I really hope is the case.

          I wont even go into lack of resources, relocation of units and general lack of interest from the upper management.

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          • #6
            Is the RDF required to complete annual tests on key skills ? ie weapon handling, first aid, fitness, navigation etc ?
            Every man thinks meanly of himself for not having been a soldier - Samuel Johnson

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            • #7
              Originally posted by knocker View Post
              Is the RDF required to complete annual tests on key skills ? ie weapon handling, first aid, fitness, navigation etc ?

              hahahahaha we are

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              • #8
                Originally posted by knocker View Post
                Is the RDF required to complete annual tests on key skills ? ie weapon handling, first aid, fitness, navigation etc ?
                Yes and no.


                Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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                • #9
                  Goldie
                  Yes and no ? Youre wasted in whatever job youre doing, politics is your calling :wink: Would you mind explaining ?
                  Every man thinks meanly of himself for not having been a soldier - Samuel Johnson

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                  • #10
                    While you are required to complete some of the items you mention on an annual basis. If you don't, you don't have to go.


                    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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                    • #11
                      Sounds like an excellent opportunity to introduce the same set of tests as the regulars and see how many of the old guard step up
                      Every man thinks meanly of himself for not having been a soldier - Samuel Johnson

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                      • #12
                        In the good old days we did our fair share of drinking, but it didnt stop us doing a full days work the next day, but we only drank pints. Then again do the yungin's today know what a days work is.

                        To be fair drink is a fact of life, most of us do it, sometimes to excess but i dont think its the reason the RDF is the way it is.
                        I remember doing drills all day long and building things as well and having a good time too, but we always looked forward to the crack that night over a good few pints and slagging the arse off the Cork boys. And then do it again and again and again for aweek
                        Is slagging people off still allowed??
                        apc
                        Sergeant Major
                        Last edited by apc; 15 October 2009, 22:48.

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                        • #13
                          Exactly the reason fitness, first aid and navigation tests will not be introduced across the board. And some of the people who pass weapons tests, well...shouldn't.

                          There are a lot of things killing the RDF. Attitudes seriously need to change across the board. Poor attitudes and habits have developed over years and are next to impossible shift at this point. If somebody does manage to reform on an MOI or Career course, once they get back to their unit, they will be forced back to the old, and incorrect method of doing things. And before anybody jumps at me for being preachy, the only correct method is to be found in a manual that comes from the DF, and it remains correct until it is amended by the DF. The phrase "That's not how we do it in this unit" is something that is heard all too often.

                          As for the drinking culture, in the last three years on FTT, I can count on one hand the amount of nights I went to the mess or pub at the end of a days training. Its there for a lot of people, but not everybody
                          ODIN
                          Lt General
                          Last edited by ODIN; 15 October 2009, 22:54.
                          What are you cackling at, fatty? Too much pie, that's your problem.

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                          • #14
                            In the good old days we did our fair share of drinking, but it didnt stop us doing a full days work the next day, but we only drank pints. Then again do the yungin's today know what a days work is.
                            Apart from the text book answer this gets my vote.

                            the majority of the people there have no idea that they must work to make it work...the partying has to stopat some point and the workbegin.

                            As a former NCO coming out to lead a troop was heart breaking when most of them were useless due the the previous nights intake

                            And from the evidence in most cases the officers and NCOs were no better, By 2001 I had figure you couldn't mix the two during the working week and expect results.
                            Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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                            • #15
                              2 can rule ?
                              Every man thinks meanly of himself for not having been a soldier - Samuel Johnson

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