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  • DF v BA

    Originally posted by CS Gass View Post
    I'd bet most other units that make up the UK's frontline troops would have a good loud laugh at that drill. Are you manned up enough to shut up a Para or a Royal if he made a similar comment? Me thinks you feel a bit superior to those serving your place of birth
    I would not take it personally. All British army infanteers think of their regiments as better then then other BA regiments, its part of the competitive ethos. Digs at Royal Marines and paras are the norm. Infact in the 80s some of the rivelry between various regiments spilled over into serious punch ups. Not as intense now that basic training is centalised.

    No harm in believing your unit is the best.

    Its not a one way st either, its common to hear that Irish serving in the BA are Irish army rejects, not up to getting in the defence forces, from many inc the media in the republic.

    I personally do not understand how recruiting is done in the republic, a few yrs back my mate never got in but was accepted in the Royal Marines and served 5 yrs. I dont understand how high calibre people get rejected in some cases for people bordering on unfit and girls, I really dont get it.
    Last edited by Vanguard; 27 January 2010, 16:44.

  • #2
    No harm in believing your unit is the best.
    As long as your a 2 Bn Viking- anything else is just delusional and slighlty sad.


    I personally do not understand how recruiting is done in the republic,
    You and me and the rest of the Defence Forces on that one brother- I kind of think its the empty desk method-

    the manpower people throw the recruiting papers into the air- what lands on the empty desk is in - the rest is out.

    its common to hear that Irish serving in the BA are Irish army rejects, not up to getting in the defence forces,
    Thats a horrible thing to say-


    out loud.


    I dont understand how high calibre people get rejected in some cases for people bordering on unfit and girls,
    to be fair the Cav only get a few from each recruit platoon
    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
      undignified to me would be something like deliberately failing a hearing test so you can make a claim for compensation - something you cannot deny has been prevalent over there - were you one of them?!
      I can and do deny it. The DF made sure that anyone who put in a claim was sent to the Blackrock Clinic(or somewhere with similar high tech equipment) to have their hearing tested through"Bone Induction"(think that's what they call it).

      Anyway this test is reliant on sensors to say when you hear something rather than you telling the tester, the idea being that you can't fool it. People don't need to fake it, the DF were negligent, even after being warned of a possible problem.

      While I did not make a claim, I did make statements on behalf of friends who were threatened with being charged for wearing civilian hearing protection, at a time when the Army did not supply anything other than ear plugs which were clearly marked as being for swimming.

      Anyway back on topic.

      You started the slagging, you're getting thrown back at you, TAKE IT LIKE A MAN
      CRIME SCENE INSTIGATOR

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by sofa View Post
        also known as the Handbags by other units
        Originally posted by sofa View Post
        Goes back to the SLR days
        Hehehe, handbags, I like it.

        RGJ, think about what it used to look like carrying the SLR at the trail by the carrying handle.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
          undignified to me would be something like deliberately failing a hearing test so you can make a claim for compensation - something you cannot deny has been prevalent over there - were you one of them?!
          Undignified to me would be Recruits being bullied into taking their own lives.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by kermit View Post
            Undignified to me would be Recruits being bullied into taking their own lives.
            I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Mini Mokes and shovels yet.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Vanguard View Post
              I would not take it personally. All British army infanteers think of their regiments as better then then other BA regiments, its part of the competitive ethos. Digs at Royal Marines and paras are the norm. Infact in the 80s some of the rivelry between various regiments spilled over into serious punch ups. Not as intense now that basic training is centalised.

              No harm in believing your unit is the best.

              Its not a one way st either, its common to hear that Irish serving in the BA are Irish army rejects, not up to getting in the defence forces, from many inc the media in the republic.
              well spotted Vanguard - it's called 'Regimental Pride', something I don't see a lot of in here. yes the Rifles are better than the Paras, but the Paras are better than that Rifles, but we are both better than the Marines!

              Originally posted by Barry View Post
              Hehehe, handbags, I like it.

              RGJ, think about what it used to look like carrying the SLR at the trail by the carrying handle.
              simple things for simple minds....

              Originally posted by kermit View Post
              Undignified to me would be Recruits being bullied into taking their own lives.
              myself, Knocker, Certa Cito and a few others in here have all done the training - it can make you or break you - we made it, others broke.

              Originally posted by Barry View Post
              I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Mini Mokes and shovels yet.
              hi hoooooooo! hi ho, hi ho, it's off to work we go, with a Green Jacket bloke and a yellow Mini Moke, hi ho, hi ho....

              ...hi ho, hi ho, it's off to work we go, with Shovel and a Pick and a Danish Chick, hi ho...

              trust me - its not forgotten about in the British Army wherever we go.
              RGJ

              ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

              The Rifles

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
                well spotted Vanguard - it's called 'Regimental Pride', something I don't see a lot of in here. yes the Rifles are better than the Paras, but the Paras are better than that Rifles, but we are both better than the Marines!
                If you really had a look around, you'd see plenty of Unit pride around here.

                Also, what does hearing claims have to do with Regimental Pride? You just couldn't resist the opportunity to throw in a petty little dig. If you really want to go down that road, I'll gladly start bringing up the likes of Bloody Sunday every time I post on a thread to do with the BA.
                Last edited by Hello Alaska; 28 January 2010, 00:04.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I have to agree with Hello Alaska on this one. I must say I've noticed an inverted inferiority complex with some of the BA posters here on multiple threads. I not sure that it's the BA are great and the DF are shite but it certainly seems to be a case of 'Open Season' on the DF while the BA are a 'Sacred Cow' and that cow shits chocolate.

                  It reminds me of KFOR. The BA guys were mostly sound out. Most were very self deprecating as you'd expect of most soldiers, giving out all the time about their own crowd and using the positives of any other contingent to emphasize their own shitty lot (we had weatherhavens and o/seas allowance, they were living in shite and had lost BAOR money)

                  The BA guys that would really melt your head were the Irish born guys. There was a sense that they were looking for affirmation all the time about how great the BA were and how glad they were that they didn't join the DF. There was this constant ramming of post rationalization down your throat. I think the reality was that the reason many of them are in the BA was that the DF were not recruiting at the time or they didn't make it through the DF interview process which is no major reflection on them as the process is much more competitive from a applicants versus positions numbers POV.

                  I was commissioned in the gym in the Curragh on a summers day and the gym and only the gym was the norm for my vintage. The commissioning on Pearse Square was reintroduced some time back and I was on an officer GOH for that in (2004 I think). Admittedly, there is a little more 'theatre' to Pearse Square but the gym has its advantages too. To my knowledge the main issue for indoor/outdoor parades in the DF is not the soldiers getting wet, but the uniforms getting wet. I don't know about the o/ranks SD 1's but officer superfines are never the same after they get wet. As for greatcoats they look poxy at the best of times. Fair enough if the venue dictates an outdoor parade like Kilmainham or the Garden of Remembrance, or Aras or any other GOH etc, put on the greatcoats and drive on. Taking a parade inside makes absolute sense when its pissing rain. Even if its not raining an indoor ceremony can look just as gildy as outdoors and in many cases provide a better experience for the spectators/guests who are often uppermost in the minds of those taking part....family, friends etc.
                  Last edited by Jessup; 28 January 2010, 01:45.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Yes traditions are important and without a doubt the Brits are very good at using it to instill pride in their troops. So also do the french, indians, Pakistanis but not as good. As we are a relatively young army and have not had the war experience nor the long history of the brits we come up a bit short on this one. But there is still unit pride and perhaps more could be done to promote it .. I am still very proud of my old unit and my service .
                    Lets face it we cannot compare as Armies but can hold our own when it comes to soldiers.

                    Now RGJ is a bit over the top re the deafness debate, I also know brits , one an ex major who also got the compo so sones, glasshouses etc.
                    I agree with Jessup re meeting Irish who serve with the Brits they seem to need to reaffirm all of the time, had a discussion with one who kept referring to us as Dads army, as he sunk another bottle of scotch.
                    Just look at how some of the OIRISH regs go on about their Irish roots, Paddys day etc and I had this discussion with a former CO of the Irish Guards, whose grandfather was born in Ireland , of British stock etc
                    I feel that its got to do with an identity crisis re not being one hundred percent british and in their own minds not being 100% irish.
                    I done think they are West Brits not really sure what they are. Foreign army , foreign soldiers who have Irish passports but just look who have Irish passports nowadays.
                    I have met Irish in other armies and they did not have the same issues.
                    And what a great break from RGJ, 'advance to contact in Helmand " , are not embarrassed ? surely we could ask Hedgehog to organize an annual competition for the best break of the year,
                    U knowStart off with say that when u have done a checkpoint at Hackballs cross etc, when u have worn bullswoll in the congo, to cold in the Leb , Malaria in Liberia etc etc . It would be a great thread then maybe a ballhop thread as well
                    As for parades indoors, all for them in bad weather, its easy to be wet and miserable ..

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by BANDIT View Post
                      Yes traditions are important and without a doubt the Brits are very good at using it to instill pride in their troops. So also do the french, indians, Pakistanis but not as good. As we are a relatively young army and have not had the war experience nor the long history of the brits we come up a bit short on this one. But there is still unit pride and perhaps more could be done to promote it .. I am still very proud of my old unit and my service .
                      Lets face it we cannot compare as Armies but can hold our own when it comes to soldiers.

                      Now RGJ is a bit over the top re the deafness debate, I also know brits , one an ex major who also got the compo so sones, glasshouses etc.
                      I agree with Jessup re meeting Irish who serve with the Brits they seem to need to reaffirm all of the time, had a discussion with one who kept referring to us as Dads army, as he sunk another bottle of scotch.
                      Just look at how some of the OIRISH regs go on about their Irish roots, Paddys day etc and I had this discussion with a former CO of the Irish Guards, whose grandfather was born in Ireland , of British stock etc
                      I feel that its got to do with an identity crisis re not being one hundred percent british and in their own minds not being 100% irish.
                      I done think they are West Brits not really sure what they are. Foreign army , foreign soldiers who have Irish passports but just look who have Irish passports nowadays.
                      I have met Irish in other armies and they did not have the same issues.
                      And what a great break from RGJ, 'advance to contact in Helmand " , are not embarrassed ? surely we could ask Hedgehog to organize an annual competition for the best break of the year,
                      U knowStart off with say that when u have done a checkpoint at Hackballs cross etc, when u have worn bullswoll in the congo, to cold in the Leb , Malaria in Liberia etc etc . It would be a great thread then maybe a ballhop thread as well
                      As for parades indoors, all for them in bad weather, its easy to be wet and miserable ..

                      QUOTE BANDIT .."Just look at how some of the OIRISH regs go on about their Irish roots, Paddys day etc and I had this discussion with a former CO of the Irish Guards, whose grandfather was born in Ireland , of British stock etc
                      I feel that its got to do with an identity crisis re not being one hundred percent british and in their own minds not being 100% irish.
                      I done think they are West Brits not really sure what they are. Foreign army , foreign soldiers who have Irish passports but just look who have Irish passports nowadays.
                      I have met Irish in other armies and they did not have the same issues." UNQUOTE


                      ..................em.. Thats cause they are Irish regiments raised In ireland, whos symbols are things like the harp and shamrock, I suppose these symbols must be "west Brit" too.

                      People of Irish ancestory in Britain are entiltled to be proud of there heritage without snide comments that they are not really Irish, maybe thats why some is given back about Dads army, the Irish army being a soft ride etc.

                      Historically Irish regiments in the US and Mexican armies have taken pride in their heritage in the same way.

                      No identity crisis proud to be British proud to be Irish.
                      Last edited by Vanguard; 28 January 2010, 10:28.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Jessup View Post
                        I have to agree with Hello Alaska on this one. I must say I've noticed an inverted inferiority complex with some of the BA posters here on multiple threads. I not sure that it's the BA are great and the DF are shite but it certainly seems to be a case of 'Open Season' on the DF while the BA are a 'Sacred Cow' and that cow shits chocolate.

                        It reminds me of KFOR. The BA guys were mostly sound out. Most were very self deprecating as you'd expect of most soldiers, giving out all the time about their own crowd and using the positives of any other contingent to emphasize their own shitty lot (we had weatherhavens and o/seas allowance, they were living in shite and had lost BAOR money)

                        The BA guys that would really melt your head were the Irish born guys. There was a sense that they were looking for affirmation all the time about how great the BA were and how glad they were that they didn't join the DF. There was this constant ramming of post rationalization down your throat. I think the reality was that the reason many of them are in the BA was that the DF were not recruiting at the time or they didn't make it through the DF interview process which is no major reflection on them as the process is much more competitive from a applicants versus positions numbers POV.

                        I was commissioned in the gym in the Curragh on a summers day and the gym and only the gym was the norm for my vintage. The commissioning on Pearse Square was reintroduced some time back and I was on an officer GOH for that in (2004 I think). Admittedly, there is a little more 'theatre' to Pearse Square but the gym has its advantages too. To my knowledge the main issue for indoor/outdoor parades in the DF is not the soldiers getting wet, but the uniforms getting wet. I don't know about the o/ranks SD 1's but officer superfines are never the same after they get wet. As for greatcoats they look poxy at the best of times. Fair enough if the venue dictates an outdoor parade like Kilmainham or the Garden of Remembrance, or Aras or any other GOH etc, put on the greatcoats and drive on. Taking a parade inside makes absolute sense when its pissing rain. Even if its not raining an indoor ceremony can look just as gildy as outdoors and in many cases provide a better experience for the spectators/guests who are often uppermost in the minds of those taking part....family, friends etc.

                        Well, the soverigns parade where newly commisioned officers pass out at Sandhurst is always outdoors, as is Troop in the colour, Im sure the rain does not do their uniforms much good either, or guardmen outside Royal Palaces 365.

                        You guys have far better pay and conditions to BA soldiers, an Irish army private earns on par with a BA captain. I remember yrs ago on the border out for up to 10 days on patrol, cold and often soggy in some ditch seeing you guys in 4x4s, with flasks, half a mile a way, often going home at night, the Irish army is a decent number, thats why people stay in for so long.

                        But how would an average Irish army infantry unit perform in Afghanistan, with poor pay, conditions, living in shit as the above poster put it for 6 months, after having it so good, who knows ?

                        This is why the BA pushes the competive ethos and regimental pride thing it bonds people in adverse circumstances.
                        Last edited by Vanguard; 28 January 2010, 11:03.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by kermit View Post
                          Undignified to me would be Recruits being bullied into taking their own lives.
                          Yet your avatar is that national flag of a country that bullies it's citizens into taking their own lives by joining an active military?
                          Amateurs built the ark. Professionals built the Titanic.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by BANDIT View Post
                            ....It would be a great thread then maybe a ballhop thread as well ...
                            Oh Jaysus, NO.....

                            You don't know WHERE such a thread could lead....

                            Originally posted by BANDIT
                            its easy to be wet and miserable ..
                            Agreed - any gobsh1te can be uncomfortable, as CTD (E) were fond of
                            saying, in their day



                            Originally posted by Vanguard View Post
                            You guys have far better pay and conditions to BA soldiers, an Irish army private earns on par with a BA captain....
                            I' m finding that pay comparison very difficult to believe....

                            Can someone post up the relevant pay scales for comparison ?
                            "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Chief Bubblewrap View Post
                              Yet your avatar is that national flag of a country that bullies it's citizens into taking their own lives by joining an active military?
                              Come on, now.... a wee bit OTT, that

                              Israel is not the only country in the world to have national service

                              Israel is probably one of the few such nations to be in a constant state of war readiness,
                              though...
                              "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

                              Comment

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