The 2010 and 2011 Assessments

[trellheim]

from time to time when I was assessing I asked the PL/Comdr - what's happening now - what are you doing

[bohs fan]

Endorsed Bayern Fan

[hedgehog]

We learn SIA- PIA- CIA's as a drill

and the reason we learn them as a drill is purely to have a starting point;

we wont always get to put in a right flanking assault

the soldiers and commanders have to be able to adapt to the ground and the situation.

In general Unless you get your men killed then nothing you do is wrong (caution some provisios apply).

However your big mistake was going into battle with culchies and gingers

[Archimedes]

As to the SINCGAR, they ALL WORK if you get a working one from the start and mind it.

The biggest problem with the SINCGARS is that because of the wind, gunfire, hearing protection etc, the radio operator can easily miss hearing a message unless he goes around shooting one-handed and holding the handset to his ear the whole time.

There should be dual PTTs made available for the PRRs with the SINCGARS type audio connecter (u229) on the end of the cable. That way, the operator can press the top button to talk to his commander, the bottom button to talk back to HQ and never need to miss a call or fumble for a handset in the middle of a firefight.

[trellheim]

There should be dual PTTs made available for the PRRs with the SINCGARS type audio connecter (u229) on the end of the cable.

?

There are ! - I was Coy 2IC on Ex Leitrim recently and my Coy Radio OP had one.

[dasa29]

Lads i was there as part of the work party in the camp. The problem with the lunch in the camp on the sat was the cooks were told to expect 70 but 150 turned up. So they had a ticket system put in place for dinner and of 177 tickets only 170 were used.

An other point the number of personnel in the camp on the friday night did not tally with the marching in states, by that i mean the office thought there was 380. But the lad who dealt with the accommodation give out 415 beds.

Some of our lads who were enemy said they were told to stand up and give away there pos to the attacking section.

[trellheim]

the number of personnel in the camp on the friday night did not tally with the marching in states

This is a hangable offence in E Bde Res especially ! Thus you end up with crap like people in camp and rations needing to be moved around which causes enormous hassle for already overworked cooks.

[Archimedes]

?

There are ! - I was Coy 2IC on Ex Leitrim recently and my Coy Radio OP had one.

They're not reaching the people who need them. I imagine that a lot of people don't even know that the PRRs can be used to talk on a SINCGARS. With all of H&S re hearing, I'm surpised that its not mandatory for radio operators to use a peltor compatible headset such as PRR on exercises such as this.

[apod]

Well basically Muzzle, on our 2nd attack, as mentioned, I ID'd the DS/Sec, considered it hostile and asked for the FSG to be brought up on a ditch line perpendicular to our axis of advance. I then requested to halt the Pln where it was and scout ahead with the No.2 Rifleman to the next perpendicular ditch line before bringing up the Pln. The request was granted, and so myself and the No.2 scout moved ahead under cover of the FSG to recce the next tactical bound of the patrol.
No sooner had we advanced 10m ahead we were engaged from slightly left of axis, about 80m ahead. I along with my scout immediately bomb-bursted right and over the ditch line we were following. I gave "Contact, wait out" over the net, but couldn't see the En. A seperate target indication was given and whilst from my position I could ID the cover the En were behind, I couldn't get eyes on the En despite moving along the ditch. Using the PRR I sent my IC my LOCSTAT, and then advised the Boss that the right flank provided good cover. I got the No.2 Scout to go prone and provide flank security, whilst I used the ditch line as cover and started firing rounds into the cover the En were behind.

Then out of the blue, the Assessor is behind me shouting and giving out about why I'm in the position I'm in and not with my section. I tell him that I'm providing a point of fire whilst the other guy is securing the flank and that my IC is well aware of my location. I don't recall the reaction to my answer as I immediately turned after saying it to get stuck back into giving suppressive fire. This wasn't meant as an act of disrespect to his rank, but I was just too busy worrying about the En and what I needed to do.



Now, shortly after that incident, I heard that the ammo resupply hadn't come in yet, so I took any spare mags of the No.2 and crawled back to the section to dish out what I had spare.
During this action I thought I'd dropped the ball by leaving a man in a firm position by himself. (would appreciate feedback on that actually). Starting to doubt myself and worrying that the assessor was going to mark my Pln down for my decision to go firm ahead of my section, I said to the 2IC that I'll bring the No.2 scout in, and so I got him and returned to the firebase.

As it transpired, my Boss took the decision to assault right flank, so I do kind of regret relocating at the end, because we were in a good position to protect that flank and give a point of fire. What do ye lads think? Should I have returned to the formation, or held firm?

No criticism at all inferred here at all but looking at that map if i had been lead section Comdr there i would have left my FSG on the ditch line facing the enemy and used the scout group as a POF to give cover to the manouevre group so they could move up to the scout groups LOC. Visual recce(BINOS!!!)Then issue FRAGO(use the PRR whilst issuing to clue in the 2 i/c if he is not at your LOC(if he has one!)).Judging by that pic.It was a straight forward right flank attack.
No worries about dropping off a man on his own SaS.We do it with Flank scty and POFs dont we??

Another advantage of moving the Manouevre group up to the scouts in that particular sit(going by the map) would have been the whole Pln (bar Lead sections FSG) being on the same axis.Handy for the Pln comdr and Pln sgts resup/Casevac Plan.

Oh and BTW just to confirm there are dual role PRRs that can attach to SINCGARS(coiled lead) and to MOTOROLA (straight lead) on issue.Units just have to look for them.

[DeV]

So your saying that the setting up of the RDFTA/RDF BTCs and lads doing integration and the new format Pots/YO's course etc is a waste of time as the standards they have been given or taught by the PDF arent being passed down or adhered to??

There are a number of problems:
- not enough people attending (and now reducing due to cut backs/promotion ban)
- people who have done the courses leaving
- lack of opportunity to practice

Now.I was one of those who criticised the turnout of that individual with the santa claus beard who marched in NY.MY opinion stll stands.He should have been clean shaven in accordance with Admin Instruction A9 which applies to both PDF and RDF unless medically excused.I also blamed his chain of command for allowing it.When in uniform in public you represent the DF and the country if overseas .Standards are there for a reason.We cant pick and choose which ones we follow.So are you still calling me a fool??

And how do you know he wasn't medically excused!?

No.DS staff or security should never compromise exercise troops positions by standing up when they can hunker down next to say a section manouevering up a flank on a SIA or by having white light on when everybody else is using light discipline.Especially if those troops are being assessed.
If there is a real safety alert IE a no duff scenario then white light goes on and the staff/Security take over.Thats the only time it should happen.
All of this is enshrined in most units SOPS especially the BTCs.

There was a shortage of filters in 1 basecamp (and in some cases torches (eg phones being used)!

The DS & Security should be well away to the side so they can observe and don't get in the way..... what about the hivis!?

However I dont think its fair to be able to identify the person in question- a pic is a snapshot in time,

we dont know if the soldier had plunged his hand into enough water to clean of the camo

we dont know if the soldier sweated so much the camo ran- we dont know if the soldier was

in the process of reapplying camo and was ordered to stand too

we dont know if the soldier rerapplied camo just as soon as the photographer left

therefore we should give our comrade the benefit of the doubt

and black out his face and name tag.

Well said!

An other point the number of personnel in the camp on the friday night did not tally with the marching in states, by that i mean the office thought there was 380. But the lad who dealt with the accommodation give out 415 beds.

That 35 people could be cadre, if not they shouldn't be paid!

This is a hangable offence in E Bde Res especially ! Thus you end up with crap like people in camp and rations needing to be moved around which causes enormous hassle for already overworked cooks.

On a recent course a lot of people had never heard of a marching in state!

[dasa29]

Originally Posted by Dev That 35 people could be cadre, if not they shouldn't be paid!

the 380 was broken down as 343 RDF and 37 PDF Cadre.

[Paddy Mayne]

For the first time i was based in the camp and i must say what a waste.

This was the first time I saw the inside of Fentons!!
And there was a number of pers who were supposedly in the woods sitting at Fenton's enjoying a few pints.
I was chatting to an inf officer from the south. So not everyone that was on the ground had a "dry" weekend.

One of my jobs was to drive a certain officer who was complaining about te lack of orders, (BTW he was not speaking to me), or more precicely the faileur to pass orders down the chain.

there was a large tpt contingent. Many were PDF. Most were surplus to requirement.

S and W Bdes brought TCVs which were not required as the plsns were bussed to the Glen and from there "walked"
EBde were transported by TCV from CBB but their drivers were part of their support on then ground.

Loads of Military police whos only function was to stand around.
They operated a one way system for military vehicles but ignored it themselves.
They had signage on the route but switched the route to the opposite direction without switching the signs. They only manned "photo opertunity" locations. I am surprised that there is no photos on the web!!
Then the critical time they were required, ie when everyone was departing the jumped into their tpt and made a quick exit instead of providing points men on the route.

On the food front. rations were a total FCUK up.
There was tons of food but also a load of pers not were they were supposed to be.
Hangers on that were supposed to be out on the ground were of course in the camp. Sat lunch there was no rations sent to the units on cemetary hill . according to one cook there was supposed to be 150 pers in camp. They made 180 meals to account for the senior officers etc. Yet they ran out with about 20 people still on the Q.

At 14.30 there was a parade in the camp, to count who was there. A lot of people had to be woke up. Nearly half on parade were PDF. And more than half were "tpt element"

From my perspective there was just too many senior NCOs and officers there for the beer. Too many cadre standing round with their buddies while their RDf Q did the actual work.
But I am glad that the lads on the ground enjoyed the experience.

Luchi your a pleb sometimes, you should stay away from comments about corps units that you know nothing about! Those MP's on Duty were points men for busy junctions. It was'nt just your little transit using the route that day..

Photo opertunities?? I dont see any PA's in any of those photos, they wer'nt training, they were working, not exactly riviting tasks but tasks that had to be carried out all the same..

In regard to your comments about the route directions and one way systems, this was an order coming from the "top brass" on the Hill during the late O Group on Sat night & not an idea of the PA's..

Also The MP's didn't ignore the one way system, this is a very wild fantasy story by someone I can only assume carries a very large chip on they're shoulder against the PA's for some benign & childish reason?? Infact I'm quite surprised at you for this!

[sofa]

Maybe a nice big bunch of flowers and a apology be sent to all who are shamed and framed here,?

or would this not be touchy feely enough. They messed up on basic stuff, and should be rubbed in it.

[ltsmarty]

Prr

With all of H&S re hearing, I'm surpised that its not mandatory for radio operators to use a peltor compatible headset such as PRR on exercises such as this.

The aforementioned peltor are in the LTAVs gone to Sweden. PRRs are not CIS provided equipment, they're issued directly to PDF Units, so if they wish to become mandatory for Field Ex such as last weekend, you just add another headache for the PDF Cadre in sourcing/begging/borrowing/returning !

[Paddy Mayne]

Maybe a nice big bunch of flowers and a apology be sent to all who are shamed and framed here,?

or would this not be touchy feely enough. They messed up on basic stuff, and should be rubbed in it.

What basic stuff?