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  • #46
    Until the mid 70s the US Natl Guard had more or less the same system in place with regard to training- summer camp , training nights and weekends. The full 8 week basic training followed by the advanced individual training was implemented with new recruits being sent and the older guardsmen were allowed to continue on as the had.When I was in the Natl Guard there were only about 4-5 of these men left and were almost outnumbered by our Vietnam Vets.

    I cant see any reason why the Defence dept would not implement something along these lines -at least for the integrated reserve.Well other than the money involved in wages that is. The new reservists could then apply for overseas deployment. Pperhaps using a short term contract - which I believe is how the TA does individual soldiers deploying with reg units, all this would add to the effectiveness of the reserve as a whole.
    When I breeze into that city, people gonna stoop and bow.
    All them women gonna make me, teach 'em what they don't know how

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    • #47
      i agree with queenie i think recruits should be allowed to gel with the people on there course i was a recruit once and i worked hard during the day then got my uniform ready and boots shining for parade the next day, tired as i was i still went out to socialise with the rest of my section. im my beliefe it made us work better as a team through out the duration, after the few in the mess we all worked and helped each other out just much and as hard as we had the day before. ( im not saying u have to get stoven drunck just a few to be sociable.)

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      • #48
        I don't think your really expected to be thaught how to be a soldier on you recruit camp. Recruit camp just gives you an intro to military life and teaches you footdrill.

        The little bit we get thaught about soldiering is generally taught on Summer camps, field days, thursday nights and exercises.

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        • #49
          Some of these issues have been discussed HERE

          Regards etc
          Support the Search Function.

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          • #50
            So you're advocating working troops 17 hours a day, for 7 days straight? Would this include those required to drive vehicles on public roads?

            Have you ever subjected yourself to such work?
            "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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            • #51
              Goldie what recruit camp were you on that didnt allow recruits drink or smoke?
              Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body,
              but rather to skid in sideways, Champagne in one hand - strawberries in the other,
              body thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and screaming........................
              WOO HOO - What a Ride!" :tri:

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              • #52
                Originally posted by How Ya Doin?
                Goldie what recruit camp were you on that didnt allow recruits drink or smoke?
                I never said I was on one. It was the PDF who had ths policy. I don't know how far it went,but basically you done all your drinking and smoking during your weekends off,if you had them. It promoted a healthier lifestyle. The RDF unit I was in at the time considered it,but found it to be unworkable in the wishy washy cry baby outfit that is the RDF


                Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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                • #53
                  It was the PDF who had ths policy. I don't know how far it went,but basically you done all your drinking and smoking during your weekends off,if you had them.

                  No recruit is allowed drink during the week. If he or she gets a weekend off they can do what they like at home. I've only heard of one instance where smoking was totally banned. Usually it's just curtailed, but I had one experience of a recruit who applied for his discharge because he wasn't allowed a smoke. One of the things that surprised me about recruits is the amount of them that do smoke. What happened in the 80's and 90's to all those "Smoking is bad for you ads."
                  sigpic
                  Say NO to violence against Women

                  Originally posted by hedgehog
                  My favourite moment was when the
                  Originally posted by hedgehog
                  red headed old dear got a smack on her ginger head

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                  • #54
                    Pdf recruits are not allowed to drink until the night of their pass out parade.Most platoons are allowed an hour in the caner to watch the tv,drink minerals etc.This however is dependant on how they perform during the day and if there arent late lessons to be completed.Smoking is actively discoureged by most training staff.

                    I dont agree that recruits on rdf camps should be allowed to drink.Last night or otherwise.All this does is encourages them too go wild on the last night and digrce themselves.Nine times out of ten the pdf either see or hear this and it colours our attitude to the rdf.So really you are shooting yourselves in the foot.

                    I recruits want to drink let them do it after camp,on their own time,where the pdf cant see them and where its their own problem.:o

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                    • #55
                      Jimmy C: I would prefer if you kept your criticism of my comments to the board,instead of Private messages.
                      If you served as long as I have served,and witnessed what I have witnessed,you would agree with me.
                      The RDF is not a social club.


                      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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                      • #56
                        Hmm...

                        But surely it helps with morale! And definitely helps the recruits get to know the 2* and 3*s with whom they'll be grouped after the camp...

                        They all know not to drink too much, and if they do, their Cpls are easily able to bring it up with them in the morning!
                        Last edited by Hang-Fire; 5 September 2004, 19:57.

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                        • #57
                          Forgive the length of the post but I feel strongly on this matter . . .


                          On an ordinary RDF recruit camp, Recruits should finish up late to cover as much as the syllabus as possible, but still be able to have a couple of sociables with their new colleagues before lights out, and also get talking to a few older heads about the organisation and what it has to offer.

                          How many people would go on their first camp if they were told they could not have a couple of hours to socialise and the crack that goes with it ?

                          Be Honest - How many would come back without experiencing the camaraderie of a few shared stories and nights out ? Would you yourself keep coming back year after year to the same old syllabus, if it wasn’t for a bit of a social life in a different town in the evenings ?

                          Moderation is the key, e.g. no out town every night for recruits, (if there’s a half decent mess) no shorts etc, and instill in them the responsibility of having a soldier like manner off duty so no one, PDF or otherwise, have reason to be embarrassed by their conduct.


                          . . . Reading all the above posts on the matter, the whole argument has again boiled down to the RDF/FCA -v- PDF debate. . .


                          There's little point comparing the RDF recruit training to PDF recruits, - its Mars versus Venus. The RDF is merely a taste of military life . . . and all its joys.

                          I've 17 years in the FCA/RDF, and many courses under my belt, of which I've topped one or two, but I don’t and never will consider myself "a Soldier".

                          I'm a proud skilled civilian with some military training that will be enough to bolster the military in the event of an emergency, and get me round a military barracks, its duties and its courses, in a soldier like manner in peacetime, with the ability to stand up to any PDF who thinks he can take liberties just because I'm RDF/FCA., yet I’m ready and willing to keep learning and working alongside any PDF willing to work alongside me.
                          - In return the experience broadens my horizons and outlooks, but it doesn’t make me a soldier. (Nor do I want to be one, if I did, I'd have joined the PDF)

                          Reserve armies the world over never have, and never will, match the level of their professional counterparts, without full time, long term training, otherwise they wouldn’t be a reserve. Whole time professionals will always be a step ahead of part time amateurs, the PDF / RDF is no different, and both PDF/RDF should accept and ‘get over this’. (Granted a few enlightened people on both sides have)

                          However, I presume, and hope, everyone who joins one of the new integrated units of the RDF will experience PDF recruit training for real, . . . . and rightly so. (After all its a back door, exchequer saving, quasi-PDF for people who will be happy to accept even less employment rights than the yellow packs have), but at least it will be an individuals choice to join and put up with that . . .as it is for a PDF recruit.

                          P.S. Before I’m berated / nitpicked for any of the above by inexperienced (but granted enthusiastic) RDF/FCA NCO’s . . . . .I once thought what you think now.

                          i.e.

                          What you are . . . . I once was . . .

                          What I am you will be . . . .
                          "In the absence of orders, go find something and kill it." Erwin Johannes Eugen Rommel

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                          • #58
                            Under no circumstances should recruits be allowed to drink outside the barracks, as if left unsupervised, there is likely to be huge problems.

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                            • #59
                              I have to say that I find it an utter disgrace that a PDF recruit has to do 18 weeks of basic training before he can call the uniform his own and in that time he his not allowed drink. Then there's the RDF, who do 1 week and who can be found in the mess nearly every night. This argument that it helps bonding and is good for morale is utter crap,PDF recruits get to know each other back in there rooms while going over notes and cleaning the lines and getting kit sorted for the next day.

                              Alot of Irish blood was spilt in the past for us to have the honour of wearing the military uniform of a sovereign independant state, don't disrespect it by thinking that just because you're RDF your not bound by the same code of conduct as PDF personnel. When you put that uniform on you are a member of the Irish Defence Forces and you should act accordingly.
                              Death before Dishonour.

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                              • #60
                                Recruits are for the most part, under the age of 18, and thus are not allowed, by law, in the mess after 9pm. Although I have yet to see it enforced in a Barracks...

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