Inactive...In for the €'s

[How Ya Doin?]

Ok ive just got used to people crawling out of the woodwork to put ther name down for camp and get a few handy bob during the summer but for some reason lately they seem to think that because they joined 10 years ago they are entitled to full run of the barracks. Do not have to parade, do not have some do the same training as everybody else and some think that they can even do it without even bothering to put on their uniform.

So my question is:
Is it better to have inactive members who turn up for camp and we can throw them into the kitchen out of the way,
Would it be better to have them turn up for training the odd night it suits them and disrupt the rest of training for everybody else, or
Show them where the gate is.

[hptmurphy]

this is where the adavantage of a quarterly retainer would come into place...If people were made financially deficient for there abscence ...there would be a major attitude change.


as it stands the paperwork involved...and the lack of people willing to put in place means that these people will continue to turn up whenever it suits them.

They hold up appointments and promotions.And some of the attitude when they do turn up is wonderful. Its a nice idea getting rid of them but not as easy as one would think. :confused:

[Arty Farty]

How you prove that they never showed up for training? I ask this because when ever we have training parades/ Weekends I'm always amazed at the amount of people that showed up according to the Unit RO's... maybe I didn't see them because they all look the same in the DPM uniform!

[strummer]

Yes, I'm amazed at the number of people I haven't seen in years appearing on the books as having attended a field day, or training night... Which is why they get the grat when they appear for their yearly appearance!

Surely some sort of larceny by fraud being commited here? Someone is cooking the books...unit leadership, NCO's and Officers, cadre...?

Call in the MP's or the Gardai...the state is being defrauded. Reseve Component soldiers have gone to the slammer for similar antics in the US.

Later.

[Itchy]

Again highlights the need for a minimum amount of training days for which you are obligated to surface for.

[JAG]

Surely some sort of larceny by fraud being commited here? Someone is cooking the books...unit leadership, NCO's and Officers, cadre...?

Call in the MP's or the Gardai...the state is being defrauded. Reseve Component soldiers have gone to the slammer for similar antics in the US.

Later.

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Naive like a child.......

[combatlogo]

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Naive like a child.......

With that attitude, you would have had the same response 15 years ago if anyone would have suggested CJH would have been disgraced by a tribunal or that Lawlor or Rambo would have been doing porridge.

What's wrong with his suggestion? The attitude that the civil/public service exist to allow their members to suck on the taxpayer's hind tit needs to be demolished.

[Docman]

What's wrong with his suggestion? The attitude that the civil/public service exist to allow their members to suck on the taxpayer's hind tit needs to be demolished.

The problem with it is that EVERYONE does it. If it wasn't done, nothing would work. By increasing the numbers on the books, you get a larger budget which allows you to train better. Units that don't do it soon cease to exist due to extremely limited budget, and Officers and NCOs who get the chop because the DoD is more interested in everything looking right than functioning properly.

What is wrong is when a unit doctors the books to get better finances and then spend that budget illegally.

I am not condoning it but saying it is the system rather than the people.

[DeV]

You only have to do 24 hours training on nights / field days / weekends + a weeks camp to get grat, its not a whole lot

[happenin]

The problem with it is that EVERYONE does it. If it wasn't done, nothing would work. By increasing the numbers on the books, you get a larger budget which allows you to train better. Units that don't do it soon cease to exist due to extremely limited budget, and Officers and NCOs who get the chop because the DoD is more interested in everything looking right than functioning properly.

I gotta agree. Think of the shitty field days etc. we would have if the unit was too underfunded to organise it propperly. (not that its organised spectacularly as it is.) Things could be worse and in my opinion,we dont suffer enough because of these members to make a big deal out of it. I'm sure docman can look into it more when he's elected onto the rdfra commitetee thingy he's runnin for.

[strummer]

OK, if you all want to be accessories to a larceny...up to you, I suppose. But I see constant bitching about lack of personal equipment on these boards. Why not demand or forcefully take back any and all equipment issued to your no-shows??? Enlist the help of an FCA MP unit if you have to.

Enough people were bitching about some bricklayer wearing a field jacket to work in previous threads, some wanting to "citizens arrest" him in the street, for Christ's sake....!!! Apply the same outrage to the ghost troopers in your unit, take back all of their equipment and issue it to those that actually show up.

Later.

[JAG]

With that attitude, you would have had the same response 15 years ago if anyone would have suggested CJH would have been disgraced by a tribunal or that Lawlor or Rambo would have been doing porridge.

What's wrong with his suggestion? The attitude that the civil/public service exist to allow their members to suck on the taxpayer's hind tit needs to be demolished.

I agree completely. But the idea that going to the Gardai or the MPs would get any sort of a reaction within ten years is laughable- no offence intended Strummer. And with officers rotating on a regular basis in the PDF, most will have served in an FCA unit, and know full well what is going on, because they have done it too.

Ideally, a unit (whether reserve or permanent) has funds appropriate to it's authorised strength and is assessed every year on a number of criteria, such as recruitment, retention, and standards of training. If a CO fails to achieve expectations consistently, that should affect his career, his leave entitlements and his pay. You perform well, you get promotion and greater opportunity. You perform badly, you get booted.

But this will not happen- for the pure and simple reason that to many government (which usually means trade union) employees, the idea of linking performance, promotion and reward is akin to the idea of having their testicles removed without anaesthetic, ground up into a pate and served to them on toast.

[How Ya Doin?]

Ok i know i started this thread and i still want to get peoples opinions but it has been pointed out to me that in my short number of years serveing in the rdf i have never worked in the kitchen, never cleaned the toilets/showers, never made an officers bed etc. and i dont intend starting now.
So i suppose somebody has to do it.

[How Ya Doin?]

Its been done.

[clare101]

You should get the people who just turn up to do the real shitty work e.g. Kitchens, toilets etc and let the people who want to learn.. learn. Bringing in the MP's.. For what. They are most likely doing what you are trying to get other people charged with. It would never work.. Bulking up numbers those have its disadvantages as someone stated. Holding up promotions is one very important one. In my company there will be four positions for sgt in the next couple of months but the powers that be wont take them off the books as they think this will affect what happens on camps and duties.