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RDF on Camp. My Experience.

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  • #31
    Its all about attitude mate strive through the bull work your way up and when you become an NCO marginalise the useless ones. go the extra mile and then things will change if not transfer to a unit who will want someone with motivation
    But there's no danger
    It's a professional career
    Though it could be arranged
    With just a word in Mr. Churchill's ear
    If you're out of luck you're out of work
    We could send you to johannesburg.

    (Elvis Costello, Olivers Army)

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    • #32
      The solution to the rdf problems does not come from everybody transferring out /or leaving.However from what i have seen of some auld sweat rdf officers/sncos they are no more interested in upskilling their units mostly cos they havent a clue themselves and are only concerned with protecting their own little kingdoms.i had hoped as an interested observer that when the re-org came in that everyone would have to re-enlist into the new organisation and have to pass tests to get in,such as the i.ts.that would have got rid of the detritus that is holding ye back.How wrong i was.Same shit different name
      i particularly get annoyed when those same auld sweats pour scorn on the enthusiasm of the junior officers/ncos.that is what kills peoples interest in the organisation and that is why the good people allways end up jacking it in .(or they join the pdf )
      "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

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      • #33
        Well, thanks Goldie, always a fair hearing on this board

        I'm still up for the re-org and that's not going to change soon [ someone needs to be ]

        The exact same thread could have been written pre-reorg.

        I try and get my lads on courses, give them a half-decent programme, get kit for them when it's there and generally try and do my job [ steer them through the shite ] .

        Yes, i'm "middle management" or whatever you wish to call it, "walter" or whatever

        Is it all our fault ? "No such thing as bad soldiers, only bad leaders "
        "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

        "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

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        • #34
          Originally posted by trellheim

          The exact same thread could have been written pre-reorg.
          True, But don't you think the need for such a thread should be no more post reorg? All the issues being complained about should have been addressed and eradicated prior to the reorg.

          Apart from a renaming, nothing has changed really. To be honest things were more organised when I done my recruit camp back in 1988. The Training program was full(if obsolete), there were sufficient NCOs, who led by example, and at the end of the week we had nothing to complain about, apart from tiredness due to our busy training program, but we all couldnt wait to return for more.


          Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by apod
            .However from what i have seen of some auld sweat rdf officers/sncos they are no more interested in upskilling their units ........are only concerned with protecting their own little kingdoms.
            That there is the root of the problem, far too many little fiefdoms. Politics is the major obstacle to progress in the RDF.

            Training needs to be standardised through out the RDF, the introduction of BTC's within the brigades should start to bring this about, but a question for our PDF observers, Sgt X is posted to a RDF Bn and draws an FCA allowance, Sgt Y is posted to a PDF Bn and doesnt draw an FCA allowance, will Sgt Y be happy to train RDF troops along side Sgt X?
            You're even dumber than I tell people

            You might have been infected but you never were a bore

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            • #36
              Originally posted by silverwings
              As regards what sandbag stated, the situation would not happen within the PDF, the Nco's/Officers would not permit it...
              Eh, Sandbags unit has a PDF CO, he let it happen. On the camp i'm sure there was some sprt of PDF presence, they let it happen???
              Sex - Breakfast of Champions!

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              • #37
                Well its nice to see that at least some of those here now recognise where the problems lie...causes of the rot...and the implications..now any short fix solutions?

                I've tried..many times but in small units..corps etc..you keep running into the same brick wall..and there is only so much punishment one nose can take.
                Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Big Al
                  That there is the root of the problem, far too many little fiefdoms. Politics is the major obstacle to progress in the RDF.

                  Training needs to be standardised through out the RDF, the introduction of BTC's within the brigades should start to bring this about, but a question for our PDF observers, Sgt X is posted to a RDF Bn and draws an FCA allowance, Sgt Y is posted to a PDF Bn and doesnt draw an FCA allowance, will Sgt Y be happy to train RDF troops along side Sgt X?
                  Good point,from the white paper the pdf training staff of the integrated units will perform those duties"in addition" to their normal duties.Funny how it makes no mention of extra pay for extra hours! the cadre staffs have been downgaraded for the last few years and it doesnt take a genius to figure out why.Money! The cadre staffs were allways seen as a cushy number for the pdf and a lucrative one too.those retiring now arent being replaced cos the dept wants to do away with fulltime cadres,and by that same motion do away with the rdf allowance.
                  "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Now there is a point which is not correct in my experience.

                    We have the opposite situation , cadre increasing rapidly up to what it is supposed to be post-reorg, some good lads coming in.
                    "Are they trying to shoot down the other drone? "

                    "No, they're trying to fly the tank"

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      What I would like to know was there a C/S on that camp and if so then he is the one to blame.The C/S is the senior instructor of any unit and it is his responsibility to have the NCO's turned out properly before they even stand in front of troops and secondly he must ensure they are up to the job they have been tasked with.

                      Brigade Trg Centres should run courses to improve the standards of Officers & NCO's.

                      This lot need a good kick in the Arse.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        There's an idea, increase the standard, or create a standard and uniformity at the upper managment level, and let them set the example.

                        Why is it that some cqs can get the haix op boot, wheras some cannot get socks?
                        Why can some units organise transport wheras others cannot?
                        Why do some units get more field days then others?
                        How can some unit's have 4,946 on paper, yet have 4 recruits parading... if the papers are wrong, change the f***ing things.
                        Why do the some senior NCOs let their NCOs wander about looking like they flew out of the washing machine?
                        Why do some officers let this happen?
                        Why, why, why, why, why is there such a difference between units?

                        All the same or none at all
                        Amateurs built the ark. Professionals built the Titanic.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Sandbag
                          Thanks for the the responses lads!

                          But I think a lot of you are missing the most important point that I was trying to make. My main concern is the leadership in the RDF or lack of. The whole food not available thing that keeps getting brought up only happened once, and to be honest didn't bother me that much. What really annoyed me was that the NCO just accepted it, reminded the Q that we can get a take-away ourselves. Again very poor leadership! The CPL should have said, listen Q I am responsible for the lads and they need to be fed and then work with each other and the dining hall to find a solution.

                          A lot of the lads in the Curragh were in a bad way. Uniforms were a disgrace for many, in all ranks, especially among the senior NCOs, some went around with beards, wearing their berets and uniforms arseways etc .... The NCOs are susposed to set the standard that the recruits and PTEs should follow. They can't just give bolloxin after bolloxin to the men over their uniforms as all what's going through the recruits head is ''how come you don't do it then?'' or ''Yeah well I was never shown how to do that?'' but they won't have the balls to say it to the NCO. Eventually when recruits are not recruits anymore they will think that they should behave like their training NCOs. I see lads already acting like their NCOs, eager to prove that they have what it takes to be a CPL and that they should be given a place on the PNCOs. This is why the standard is so low. I know that the NCOs know what the standard is as they spend so much time giving you a bolloxin over it on parade and yet they don't keep to the same standard themselves ( not all but a lot) , and in many cases don't bother their arses to instruct the recruits in this respect. This is why things are not improving and is why most PDF don't consider the RDF to be equal to them. I'll say it again LEAD BY EXAMPLE and you will get results.

                          Fianóglach also said that the lads in the Curragh were in a bad way. I'm not sure what he means by this but I'm sure he based this on their appearance and conduct. If this is addressed first so that the RDF prove that they can be of the same standard in at least this aspect, then maybe the PDF will take it more seriously and therefore better training, co-operation etc may be made available. You have to learn to walk before you can run!
                          I would suggest that anyone who has experienced any of the things mentioned above recently, should print it off and give a copy to your coy cmdr and send a COPY TO YOUR C.O.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by trellheim
                            Now there is a point which is not correct in my experience.

                            We have the opposite situation , cadre increasing rapidly up to what it is supposed to be post-reorg, some good lads coming in.
                            Yes for training NCOs, no for storemen/drivers

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by sparky
                              the worst thing that happened to me on a camp was when they collected 5 quid from each person to get sun cream for us there was eight of us in my section three sections with two platoons i could never get an answer why my section had to share our bottle of suncream with another section but yes i did experience the your not entitled too rations thing they put us in a bus from cavan to wicklow with out even a cup of tea ""nice lads""
                              Is the DF not require to provide sunscreen under OH&S legislation? We went on a lovely trip to wicklow too, twas great when we got to that pub and were told to buy our own dinner.
                              "Attack your attic with a Steyr....as seen on the Late Late Show..."

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                              • #45
                                If the DF can't provide people with proper boots, do you seriously think they would bother to provide sunscreen?


                                Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

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