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or jimy choo didnt make boots (thats at you Goldie)
the National Organisation is a God send-
well done Croke Park and the ard comhairle
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
To the detriment of most other sports in this country (bar perhaps soccer and rugby)
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?
To the detriment of most other sports in this country (bar perhaps soccer and rugby)
why detriment
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Something like the Asgard costs nothing to run in the wider scheme of things, and brings pleasure to lots of people. You could ask the question how many kids after their experience on board turned away from crime for example, something that can't be quantified. As for the GAA . I really enjoyed myself on Saturday in Croke Park, and don't begrudge the money given to the GAA, as they spent it on something the nation can be proud off, its one of the finest stadiums in Europe.
Its also a link with the events surrounding the foundation of the state, were it not for the actions of the original Asgard, then the events of 1916, onwards would not have been possible. Its good to have something that commemorates the people who fought for our independence in a positive way.
I for one would rather something like Asgard was built, which would after all provide employment at home, then a lot of other things the government spends money on.
you mean a few yachty types and a few sailors cheered
give the money to an organisation that is looking after kids in every village in Ireland
keeping them off the street
Did you realise the asgard ran subsidised trips for people too poor to pay for their own trips?
It certainly did keep lots of kids off the street, youth organisations regularly sent people on it for a bit of adventure.
The majority of people that go on the asgard have never set foot on the deck of a boat of any kind before.
As regards yachty types and a few sailors cheering, have you ever been to a tall ships race?
You have crews that range from underprivileged kids from cities in England, American tourists, the mexican/italian/american/german navy, merchant navy types and various other organisations.
Yachties are very much the minority in a tall ships race, it isnt their kind of scene at all. All that hard work, and sailing for days at a time out of sight of dry land? They would never cope!
To be honest I would rather see my taxes used to run a tall ship like the Asgaard, then to be given to a crowd like the gaa who [a] already have sponged enough money on their own and [b] do not represent this country abroad, except in the occasional orgy of voilence that is the mud wrestleing boreing rubbish that passes for a game in Australia.
But thats only my opinion.
It was another ff master stroke to dither on the salvage long enough for the Asgard II to become unecominical to recover.
"We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey"
Radio transmission, siege of Jadotville DR Congo. September 1961.
Illegitimi non carborundum
To be honest, I have no interest in the GAA and can't stand the game.
However, There is no question that they do a lot of goood work for the young kids growing up and without them there may be a lot more kids hanging out on the streets. If their lobbing for funds was successful, well more power to them. Likewise for the STY Asgard, if the lobby for funding works for them, fair enough. I would not deny any legitimate group their entitlements.
But to use the frase 'I'm a tax payer and the money should go to this or that or that ', well, it dosen't hold that much weight, when you consider that if there is say three million people paying tax in the country, well I would only be the voice of 'one three million th.'
Like the guy who came up the gangway in Dun laoghaire some years ago, and demanded to see the state ship as he was a tax payer.
I told him I was a tax payer too and that I was employed by all the rest of the taxpayers to guard this ship on their behalf, and that he would be better off going up to the local Garda station and as a taxpayer, demand that he be shown all around the station.
The result was that he became very agressive and was fu**** off the ship by the duty watch, on to the quay wall, where he continued to shout abuse .
Fu** him and his tax!
Sorry Turkey, no offence to you
Last edited by Test Pilot; 10 February 2009, 17:02.
"We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey"
Radio transmission, siege of Jadotville DR Congo. September 1961.
Illegitimi non carborundum
the state has to spend money on things which have results that can't be quantified in terms of KPT or KPIs. Asgard, as well as providing a link with the foundation of the state and the defence forces is one of them.
Next time somebody looks at their cap badge, the FF is there because of the original Asgard.
According to the Examiner (newspaper) the DoD has been told that building a steel hulled replica would be cheaper than raising and repairing Asgard II.
WoD is in the Dail answering wuestions about it tomorrow(unusually, as he was answering last week also). Hopefully we'll have a clearer idea of the plan(if any) this time tomorrow.
Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.
Minister advised to build 'Asgard' replica and abandon salvage plan
Minister advised to build 'Asgard' replica and abandon salvage plan
LORNA SIGGINS, Marine Correspondent
MINISTER FOR Defence Willie O’Dea has been advised to commission the building of a replica Asgard II for the national sail training programme.
The Minister has been advised to leave the existing wooden-built brigantine on the seabed off northwest France, and to build a steel replacement on safety and cost grounds.
The recommendations have been made by Coiste an Asgard, the committee which manages the sail training programme on behalf of the Department of Defence.
The committee commissioned an initial survey of the vessel last September, several weeks after it sank some 22km (13½ miles) west of Belle-Ile while en route to La Rochelle.
All 25 crew and trainees were evacuated safely to life rafts when the ship began taking in water in the early hours of September 11th. They were picked up by the French rescue services, and the 27-year-old brigantine sank several hours later.
The initial survey showed that the ship was sitting upright and in good condition in some 83m of water. Images showed damage to one of its planks which may have been consistent with a collision.
Mr O’Dea was urged to commission a salvage operation before winter closed in on the Bay of Biscay. The vessel was insured for €3.8 million.
Although tenders were sought from three salvage firms, no decision was taken before Christmas and a second survey was then sought by Coiste an Asgard. In January the ship’s master, Capt Colm Newport, expressed confidence that the vessel was in good enough condition to be raised.
However, bad weather prevented use of the remotely operated vehicle to film the hull during the second survey, although a depth sounder image confirmed the vessel was still on the seabed.
Coiste an Asgard now believes that the insurance money would best be spent on building a steel replacement, given that the cost of salvage could be €2 million and weather dependent. It is understood that the committee also believes that the cost of restoration after salvage could be prohibitive, and prospective trainees might not wish to sail on a ship that had already sunk.
Some sail training organisations prefer to rely on steel vessels for safety reasons, and because of the cost of maintaining wooden ships.
Speaking on the issue in the Dáil last week, Mr O’Dea said that, “we must apply hard logic in making these decisions; one cannot make a decision based on emotion”.
He added that there were “a number of difficulties with the [proposed] salvage operation”.
'However, bad weather prevented use of the remotely operated vehicle to film the hull during the second survey, although a depth sounder image confirmed the vessel was still on the seabed.'
Where else did they expect it to be, Lorna?
Last edited by Test Pilot; 12 February 2009, 09:12.
Maybe we should add a straw poll on to this thread
Have you crewed on the Asgard-
Has a member of your family Crewed on the Asgard
DO you know someone who crewed on it
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
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