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  • This could seriously be of great benefit to the Irish Economy And State. It will give extended Fishing Grounds aswell the possibility of finding lucraitive Natural resoures such as Oil,Gas etc.. Which could have enmourous benefits the Irish Economy And Energy Network. "Sounds Abit Like A Geography Lesson Does'nt It!!)
    British officer: You're seven minutes late, Mr. Collins.
    Michael Collins: You've kept us waiting 700 years. You can have your seven minutes.

    [As the British flag comes down]

    Michael Collins: So that's what all the bother was about.

    Comment


    • I wonder whether the MEKO 200 MRV moves enough of the army's equipment? If the price of the MEKO 200 MRV is near 60 million Euros, two would cost 120 million Euros. Wouldn't Ireland be better off with a New Zealand MRV at 90 million Euros and another Roisin at 30 million Euros, both would cost around 120 million Euros. Having one ship with twice the sealift capacity is in my mind preferrable to two undersized vessels. New Zealand intends to use its MRV for patrols in the Southern Ocean with very heavy seas. Surely its 8000 tons of displacement will be more than enough to patrol Ireland's extended EEZ in the eastern Atlantic.

      From the B&V website the MEKO 200 MRV has 200 lane meters of vehicle space, lift 550 tons of equipment, and supports 150 army personnel. The NZ MRV has 403 lane meters of vehicle space, and supports 250 army personnel. She carries twice as much weight: five 10 ton helicopters, plus 403 Lane Metres which could hold: 16 LAV, 14 LOV, 7 UNIMOGS, 2 Ambulances, 2 Flat bed trucks, 7 LOV Trailers, 2 Rough Terrain Fork Lifts and 4 four wheel vehicles and up to 33 containers.

      If the NZ MRV is much too large, and the MEKO 200 MRV is too small, surely a smaller ferry design similar to NZ's MRV could be designed to fit Ireland's needs better. Keep in mind New Zealand is a small nation and can't afford large expensive ships either. Any blue-green ship should match the army's requirements for a company and the lane meters for its equipment.

      You never know in an emergency of a humanitarian mission whether a proper port will be available. For example, the cruise ship docks at Cozumel, Mexico were wiped out by one of the hurricanes last year. Being able to discharge troops and equipment via landing craft/helicopters are important assets of the NZ MRV.
      Sea Toby
      Private 3*
      Last edited by Sea Toby; 9 January 2007, 21:40.

      Comment


      • I think now that Lebanon is back on the agenda again we may see the government realising the usefulness of having a dedicated vessel capable of carrying a respectable amount of military stores. The P20s used to do it in the old days and usually went to Haifa, but this may not always be available to them.


        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

        Comment


        • The Mexican Sierra class are 74.4m x 10.5m x 3.5m, 1340 tons full load. Range 3800nm/18 knots. Top speed of 18 knots. Crew of 76, have accomodations for 16 more personnel. Armament is the 57mm gun, plus small arms. The Sierras have a helicopter deck and hangar, the Durangos, very similar, have a second gun instead of a helicopter hangar aft. Being built in Mexico for less than $30 million US each.

          To move a battalion of troops, Ireland will have to purchase a Rotterdam type of vessel or an Italian flat top. The price will exceed 150 million Euros.

          Since the minister mentioned a 100 million Euro MRV after a speech to cadets with the media, Ireland would be able to purchase a NZ MRV converted ferry or the smallest Damen Schelde Dutch Enforcer/Rotterdam design, but the sealift would probably be only for a infantry group, not a battalion.

          The stretched OPVs or the Meko 200 MRV should cost even less, from 40-60 million Euros, but the vehicle space and trooplift would be around half of the NZ MRV or the smallest Dutch Enforcer design, around 200 lane meters or less. A destroyer sized MRV similar to the Danish Absalon will also run 100 million Euros, but will have 280 lane meters of vehicle space.

          As I have noted before, I am under the impression that if New Zealand needed 390 lane meters to move its LAV equipped infantry company group, I figure Ireland will need something similar. I agree, a tactical sealift capability with at least two landing craft should be required, very useful for over the beach style landings. I am under the impression that the Irish Naval Service is selling itself short suggesting buying the Meko 200 MRV. The army should state its preferred requirement, whether to move half a company group, a full company group, or a battalion.

          After the army has stated its requirement, then its up to the government to fund it. Frankly, in my opinion, it would be a very large mistake to acquire a ship which don't meet the army's requirement. If Ireland can acquire a ship similar to the NZ MRV which has twice the capacity of the Meko 200 MRV, for less than the 100 million Euros the minister mentioned, Ireland should at least buy a blue green ship which can move at least a company group. At that price I don't see a ship moving a battalion.
          Sea Toby
          Private 3*
          Last edited by Sea Toby; 8 October 2006, 17:38.

          Comment


          • Upgrade of naval fleet to cost €180m

            In todays Irish Times. Plans for 1 Multi role vessel - 120 m long and 2 vessels of 80 m long.

            Please God may the economy keep going!

            Comment


            • http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com...ad.php?t=10184

              Thats smaller than Absalon and Canterbury.


              Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

              Comment


              • So more of the Roisin class then, or possibly the RN River Class PV... or maybe something completely different.

                As regards the 120m, that's the Meko 200MRV from the presentation. Is there anything else in that size class?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Goldie fish View Post
                  http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com...ad.php?t=10184

                  Thats smaller than Absalon and Canterbury.
                  the smallest of the Enforcer class is about 120 meters, although it looks like this requirement was written for the MEKO 200

                  Anyone think it'll come with the landing craft?
                  Dr. Venture: Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, we get waylaid by jackassery?

                  Dr. Venture: Dean, you smell like a whore

                  Comment


                  • *sigh*

                    Naval version of "can we get Air Corp Jets now?"
                    If you have to do it, you always have to do it right. Either it makes a difference, or it’s good practice so that when it does make a difference, it gets done right.

                    -Me.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by DeV View Post
                      Peacock class:
                      Max speed: 25-30 knots
                      Draught: 2.7 metres

                      P50 class:
                      Max speed: 23 knots
                      Draught: 3.8 metres

                      Peacocks are faster and can operate in shallower waters. They are the only real warships in the Naval Service (the rest being designed to civilian standard)
                      Where did you come up with that idea?

                      What does it have to do with the Proposed Blue/Green ship(i.e the title of this thread?)


                      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Slacker View Post
                        *sigh*

                        Naval version of "can we get Air Corp Jets now?"
                        ok, it's going to be a 120 metre 100million euro worth of a row boat...yay for pessimisim
                        Dr. Venture: Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, we get waylaid by jackassery?

                        Dr. Venture: Dean, you smell like a whore

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Slacker View Post
                          *sigh*

                          Naval version of "can we get Air Corp Jets now?"

                          The only people who want Jets in the air corps are people who are not in the Air Corps.

                          However, this project is a reality. So go and take your attitude somewhere else. We are not interested here.


                          Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                          Comment


                          • ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems MRV



                            Unfortunately a bit large and probably out of our price range! Can't find info on their 7500 tonne version.

                            MHD 150: Amphibious and Sealift Capabilities – Challenges for global engaged Navies

                            The December 2004 tsunami disaster and earthquakes on Sumatra shiffted focus to disaster relief and humanitarian assistance. One of the the challenges, which recently became therefore apprent to navies, is the capability to sealift and deploy vehicles, materials and personal in a short time and sizable number. ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems developed the MHD 150 as a versatile and multi-functional systems for such military and civil purposes.
                            The Multi Role Helicopter Dock Ship’s general design is based on a dockship capable of carrying two LCUs or howercraft. Its vehicle deck has about 800 lane meters, an extended helicopter deck with five landing pads, a landing pad on the main deck aft and a hangar for 11 helicopters (NH90-type) with ample space for service and maintenance.
                            The MHD 150 can transport and support over 750 fully equipped troops and their vehicles and armament. The amphibious units are either of LCU type MK10 or a LCAC hovercraft type and two type MK6 landing craft mechanised LCM(T) wich are stowed in a recess, port and starboard, on Deck 01. Further ample space in/for Hospital is availiable.
                            Main Specification:
                            Length over all 182,00 m
                            Length in waterline 174,00 m
                            Beam 26,50 m
                            Depth to main deck 16,85 m
                            Design draught 6,00 m
                            Displacement (full load) 15,000 t
                            Propulsion plant 2 x 11MW
                            Speed max. 22 kts
                            Range 8,000 nm / 16,5 kts
                            Complement 142 Crew / 776 Troops

                            Comment


                            • ThyssenKrupp are what Blohm and Voss used to be.


                              Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                              Comment


                              • Earlier I posted a link to two pictures of HDW's smaller sealift vessels, or MRV, of 8,000 and 10,000 tons offered to Portugal, a link to a May 2005 Armada magazine article. There are many pictures posted of the NZ MRV and the MEKO 200 MRV. Later in this thread there is a picture of a Guardian type vessel. I suspect the MEKO 200 MRV is favored by the navy, I have not heard of what the army favors yet.

                                If the cabinet is going to decide to buy this summer, I suspect the tender process will proceed soon.
                                Sea Toby
                                Private 3*
                                Last edited by Sea Toby; 9 January 2007, 05:21.

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