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OPV's for sale. Mint condition!!!

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  • #16
    from the Trinidad Express

    http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/...103591334.html

    GOVERNMENT has taken a decision to formally terminate the £150 million contract with BAE Systems to build and commission three offshore patrol vessels (OPV) for use by the Coast Guard.

    The deal entered into with VT Shipbuilding was signed by the previous People's National Movement (PNM) administration in April 2007, and was considered critical to the State's war on guns and drug running in our waters.

    News that the State had pulled the plug on the purchases, however, came not from an official Government release, but through a statement BAE Systems issued to the United Kingdom stock exchange on Tuesday.

    Reached in New York yesterday, special adviser to Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar, Gary Griffith, referred queries to Attorney General Anand Ramlogan.

    VT Shipbuilding was acquired by BAE Systems in October 2009. Under the agreement, BAE Systems agreed to training and five years in-service support to the Coast Guard when the vessels were completed.

    Training of some 65 Coast Guard officers on the (OPV) Port of Spain was stopped in mid-July, and sea trials on a second (OPV), the Scarborough, were also halted pending Government's decision. Training was subsequently resumed.

    The Portsmouth, England-based company will now have to find buyers on the world market for the nearly completed custom built vessels.

    Contacted yesterday, Captain Kirton Huggins, the director of the Coast Guard's Strategic Project Management Office at Stauble's Bay, Chaguaramas, told the Express he had "heard about it" (the decision to terminate the contract) but had not yet received any formal instructions on the matter.

    Since coming into office on May 24, the People's Partnership Government signalled that it was considering cancelling the purchase, saying the country was not in a position to finance the acquisition.

    The patrol vessels were a major part of former prime minister Patrick Manning's crime fighting plan to secure this country's borders and put a squeeze on the illegal drug trade.

    Two months ago, Attorney General Ramlogan said the Government was in the process of reviewing the transaction. He said he was informed that the vessels were not delivered on time in breach of the contractual delivery date. Ramlogan said there were also technical problems which needed to be resolved to ensure the vessels were in accordance with the specifications and designs in the contract.

    He said then: "There are legal, financial and security implications to this transaction that require critical and objective review by the Government, bearing in mind our competing expenditure priorities and the alternative use to which this money can be put in the fight against crime."

    National Security Minister Brigadier John Sandy, however, had indicated that he had hoped to convince a steering committee set up to review the deal to purchase the vessels, since he believed they would be needed in the current fight against crime.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by warthog View Post
      so copied from the OPV thread

      5 of our 8 vessels are due for replacement between 2008 and 2015.

      so if we somehow got our grubby little hands on these
      negotiate a phased payment,so we take them but pay for them spread over five years
      take all three deirdre class out of service by the end of 2011
      giving time for shakedown and training to get at least the first two of the three operational

      continue with our plans with Babcock to build OPV's BUT we push back the project delivery until 2015/16 and expand the order from two to three ships (to replace Eithne & the peacocks with a single design) so basically our payments for all 6 vessels would run back to back for 10 yeas

      this is total walter mitty stuff I know but imagine it,we could have 6 modern vessels bought by 2018 if we put our minds to it!
      It is very ambitious, and remember that we are only getting what we are getting by the skin of our teeth. The t&t ships are a fine design, but one we have no experience with, while the Babcock ships will be based on an existing design we have learnt a lot from.
      Babcock are already going out on a limb with our payment plan. I doubt they would be too keen to push it on further, so we can buy someone elses ship in the meantime. What is to stop our government from then deciding "wow these new second hand ships are great, lets not bother with the ones the navy designed for themselves. These 3 ships will be justr as good as 6".
      It happens. It has happened us in the past, too often. The NS fought hard to get where they are with Babcock. If VT were as good as they say, then their dsign would have won the tender, and we would have been waiting for them to finish the T&T before commencing ours.
      But they didnt win the contract. Ask yourself why?


      Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

      Comment


      • #18
        On further inspection this seems to be a lot more sinister. The contract was signed by the old T&T government, but the new one is rumoured to have connections to the drug cartels.
        Their first move? Cancel the new anti drug patrol ships, and then "reorganise" the T&T coastguard.


        Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

        Comment


        • #19
          If this came off to the NS's advantage, it's proof that Charlie's up there, still wheeling and dealing on their behalf

          Comment


          • #20
            well the RN have a lease/buy option with VT on their four river class OPV's
            now that they may well be left with three ships unsold in a climate where not many nations are buying
            would they be willing to enter into a similar agreement here? i.e let us lease them until the Babcock deal is done then when we've paid for those in a few years buy these three or give them back?

            Comment


            • #21
              Let the RN have them! They are used to the design, its a variation of the River class. They have something similar in the pipeline anyway, in danger of being binned to ensure the carriers are built.


              Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

              Comment


              • #22
                It is an option but there are other things to consider:

                I would think that VT are more likely to be looking for an immediate sale rather than lease.

                Would there be legal issues with an contract that has been signed.

                Different equipment and different spares

                Different training

                Would they be suited to ops off the West coast?

                etc etc


                There aren't delivered on time but they were getting 3 vessels (plus 5 years inservice support) for a song!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Specs of these vessels (compared to the tender docs for our OPVs):

                  Length: 90 m (80-90m)
                  Beam: 13.5 m (14-16 m)
                  Max Speed: 25 kts (22-26 kts)
                  Range: 5,500 miles (6,000 miles)
                  Endurance: 35 days (21 days)
                  Crew: min 36, max 70 + 50 pax (crew + 10 trainees)
                  Flight Deck: 20 m medium helicopter (medium sized UAV ops)

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Thats a No then.


                    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      There is obviously a lot going behind the scenes here, BAE Systems won't want to loose face and be left with unwanted ships on their hands, nor will they want to be out of pocket.The Trinidians don't seem to want the ships, but who knows. The ones I feel sorry for are the crews who are standing by in the shipyards. They will have put a lot of hard work and effort in to this project, some will have worked on it for years, I hope they get the ships, I doubt there is much wrong with them.
                      Would they do our navy? of course they would! they may not be ideal but there will be plenty of fault finders with the Babcock ships when they are delivered too. I don't have any technical info on them, it could be that as they are British designed and built there is a lot of commonality with our ships.
                      £150 million seems a lot for ships that don't have much fancy equipment, I wonder how much is for the build and how much for the training and support? usually a Builder will come in with a low price on the build and try to cream off on training and support. The greatest cream off occurs when the owner agrees to a specification, approves the drawings etc and later on wants to make changes. Some Japanese yards refuse to make any changes, they will build the vessel as agreed, hand it over, and then make the changes. Needless to say the Owner pays big money for any changes at that stage.
                      I bet the Trinidadian version of IMO is hopping.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        repos

                        Would not be the first time we got Vosper Thorneycraft ships if it happened as the old minesweepers were built by VT.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          repos

                          On the image of the ship posted on the thread it has pennant number CG 51 must be a mistke as this is already assigned to the USS Thomas S Gates a guided missile cruiser,may be indicative of the chaotic nature of the project.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Pennant numbers count for nothing

                            You'll find another P31 out there also.


                            Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              CG (Coast Guard )
                              Don't spit in my Bouillabaisse .

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Stoker View Post
                                Would they do our navy? of course they would! they may not be ideal but there will be plenty of fault finders with the Babcock ships when they are delivered too. I don't have any technical info on them, it could be that as they are British designed and built there is a lot of commonality with our ships.
                                Depending on their seakeeping qualities, the Caribbean isn't the West coast of Ireland!

                                Originally posted by danno View Post
                                Would not be the first time we got Vosper Thorneycraft ships if it happened as the old minesweepers were built by VT.
                                But there were a proven design and had been in service for up to 20 years before we got them.

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