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  • Originally posted by na grohmití View Post
    Cover the drydock to allow work to take place in all weathers on the exterior. It would need to be as tall as to fit a ship and her mast, with room for a gantry crane inside too.

    I would suggest the wind problem would be unique to the particular circumstances in Haulbowline. The back of the dock looks straight out to the harbour mouth. Most other covered docks would run in line with, and would be sheltered by terrain. No such luxury in Haulbowline.
    The initial requirement and feasibility study should be to achieve an environmentally friendly site for the maintenance and repair of naval vessels. Clearing the dock of obstructions and covering it in with a weatherproof housing which would also contain offices, minor workshops, toilets etc. together with heating and FF systems. The length is around 180 meters. Opening up electronics, radars etc. would require roller doors to the front. Reinstating the drydock itself is a future must have, if we wish to be whole and independent. The working scenario would be DOD do actual docking and positioning and pump out. Drydock work would be carried out by DOD, NS, or contractors as appropriate . The Wind problem should be left to designers of high structures.

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    • Originally posted by na grohmití View Post
      Cover the drydock to allow work to take place in all weathers on the exterior. It would need to be as tall as to fit a ship and her mast, with room for a gantry crane inside too.

      I would suggest the wind problem would be unique to the particular circumstances in Haulbowline. The back of the dock looks straight out to the harbour mouth. Most other covered docks would run in line with, and would be sheltered by terrain. No such luxury in Haulbowline.
      There would be more hassle getting the ex naval service Members to give up their free berths for their boats than to deal with the local wind situation. As far as I can recall from my days there, the reinstatement of the dry dock was part of the naval base master plan.

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      • How many weeks in an average year would be used?

        Surely the money would be better spend on wage increases possibly allowing the NS to fully crew its vessels.

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        • Originally posted by DeV View Post
          How many weeks in an average year would be used?

          Surely the money would be better spend on wage increases possibly allowing the NS to fully crew its vessels.
          You don't need to pump out a drydock for it to be useful, especially when covered. At any time at least one vessel is at berth out of service for some repairs or equipment refit. Covering the drydock, would make it a highly efficient space where all manner of work can be done in all weathers.
          Ever had to change a lightbulb in your car? Isn't it much easier to do wen its dry? Easier still when its indoors, with good light.

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          • To come back from the question of covering it, I'd ask again what's the measurements of the dock, how much of an increase over the Cobh dock does it give the Navy?

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            • Originally posted by Sparky42 View Post
              To come back from the question of covering it, I'd ask again what's the measurements of the dock, how much of an increase over the Cobh dock does it give the Navy?
              further up there is mention of 180m length, so pretty significant. Still not relevant IMO, cos reactivating it would be a huge waste of money. Other navies let commercial yards refurbish their warships. And H&W has a drydock that is bigger than anything the NS will ever need on this very island.

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              • Originally posted by Graylion View Post
                further up there is mention of 180m length, so pretty significant. Still not relevant IMO, cos reactivating it would be a huge waste of money. Other navies let commercial yards refurbish their warships. And H&W has a drydock that is bigger than anything the NS will ever need on this very island.
                There are closer, bigger & better equipped drydocks in France and the UK, if we are going to go to a foreign yard.

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                • Originally posted by na grohmití View Post
                  There are closer, bigger & better equipped drydocks in France and the UK, if we are going to go to a foreign yard.
                  Nationally we are, as we all know, reduced to one Drydock located at Rushbrooke, Cobh. The Navy needs to drydock it's ships on a programmed and ad hoc basis. Sending or Towing ships to out of country drydocks is a looming possibility. Having a drydock under our control would be a gold star asset. We are sitting on an asset 180m x 28m, already constructed. I think we should at least phase in it's use and cost it's full return as a Naval Drydock.

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                  • Only way to ensure VFM and sufficient work for the Haulbowline drydock would probably be a PPP project and allow them to take on commercial work.

                    But what then if:
                    (a) it is successful and puts Cork Dockyard out of business
                    (b) there is another vessel in The Haulbowline drydock

                    I say do a medium term contract (say 5 years for all scheduled (and unscheduled where it can be facilitated) NS drydocking ) with Cork Dockyard. No doubt there is some way of the NS legally (thinking State Aid here) investing in Cork Dockyard to ensure it’s continued economic viability

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                    • How the State ensures priority choice with the Doyle Shipping group. for use of Cork Dockyard , and supporting it's continued viability is a matter for them . They must have been aware that Dublin Port Authority were closing the only Drydock built by the State , so one must assume they will only act post factum if at all.
                      As the naval Drydock would be a strategic asset for Naval Defence purposes I think PPP would shift priorities to our disadvantage and would increase civilian manning , supervision , policing , security.

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                      • DSG have barely spent a cent on the yard since they took it over. They have cut up all the old cranes for scrap. The caisson is hauled into position using a tractor. A crawler construction crane is used to lift anything into place.
                        I fear if the dockyard suffers a major equipment failure requiring investment (such as pump failure), they won't spend it.

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                        • Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post
                          How the State ensures priority choice with the Doyle Shipping group. for use of Cork Dockyard , and supporting it's continued viability is a matter for them .
                          i assume you mean the Government?

                          No EU laws on State Aid have a big say

                          As the naval Drydock would be a strategic asset for Naval Defence purposes
                          definitely

                          I think PPP would shift priorities to our disadvantage and would increase civilian manning , supervision , policing , security.
                          Quite possibly but your either going to have to:
                          (a) increase NS establishment (not much point when the strength is so low)
                          (b) staff it with DoD civvies who you will need to undertake other duties as well (not necessarily a bad idea, they could support other (non-dry dock maintenance) because the drydock is likely to be used maybe 12 weeks a year at an absolute max)
                          (c) just provide the drydock and when drydocking is required get a contractor in

                          Or do PPP and run it commercially

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                          • Where are you getting 12 weeks from? There is a naval vessel out of action at different levels at every stage throughout the year. While not all of these out of service incidents require drydocking, having a berth setaside for repairs and refit, which when filled with water, the drydock can be, would be a well used asset. There is hardly a day in the year when at least one ship does not have its masts surrounded by scaffolding.

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                            • Originally posted by na grohmití View Post
                              Where are you getting 12 weeks from? There is a naval vessel out of action at different levels at every stage throughout the year. While not all of these out of service incidents require drydocking, having a berth setaside for repairs and refit, which when filled with water, the drydock can be, would be a well used asset. There is hardly a day in the year when at least one ship does not have its masts surrounded by scaffolding.

                              Which as you say doesn’t require drydocking.

                              Absolutely max there are 4 (normally 2-3) scheduled dry docks annually for 2-3 weeks each (normally 2).

                              We are discussing drydocking specifically

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                              • I give up. Pointless engaging with you.
                                you
                                just
                                dont
                                get
                                it.

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