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35th Battalion congo battle of jadoville

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  • DeV
    replied
    The lack of the DSM is a justifiable reason for not awarding it (obviously), there was only 1 MMG awarded for service with ONUC which set a very high bar.

    However, the DF had no issues awarding DSMs for service prior to its introduction retrospectively.


    http://source.southdublinlibraries.i..._Citations.pdf

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  • DeV
    replied
    Some were recommended and subsequently awarded medals but had references to Jadotville removed

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  • na grohmiti
    replied
    I have yet to get past the executive summary, but there seems to be a suggestion, or maybe an expression, that nobody was to be awarded medals at all, somewhere along the way a list appeared suggesting names of those who were supposed to get a medal, but did not, however this list was not what it was put out to be.
    People were put forward for a medal which did not at that time exist, and never came to be in the end. It was assumed that those put forward for the first medal were automatically put forward for the DSM instead, even though the DSM is for a very different set of circumstances.
    The problem seems to be the medal board who decided Tpr Browne would only get a 2nd Class MMG, meant they set the bar too high for everyone else put forward for an MMG. Basically you had to die while under hostile fire, protecting others.
    There also seems to be some issue with the fact the Commander of the operation in Congo during Jadotville went on to become the CoS who would have the last word on any medals awarded, and the word Jadotville would not appear on any citations.

    Unpopular opinion: We will not award medals to people who were not put forward for medals, regardless of how poorly they were treated after. To do so would cheapen all medals awarded to date.
    Even more unpopular opinion: Being under fire in itself is not sufficient justification for awarding of a medal, particularly the MMG, which was the only one available to be awarded at the time.

    There's a lot to digest. There seems to be more happening in the background here. The men of A Coy are being used by some outside force to grind an axe against either the Defence Forces, Lt Gen Mc Eoin, or the system itself.
    Even the Cruiser seems to come out of this one with his integrity intact.
    Some criticism of the movie. The suggestion that people are taking a fictionalised account as fact.
    The notion that the scheme of defence used at Jadotville by Comdt Quinlan is being taught in military training facilities worldwide is also a myth.
    The exaggerated casualty figures also being taken as fact, contrary to all reports given by those involved.
    Those who have publicly supported the efforts to award medals are licking their wounds today, issuing short but sniping tweets, that seem to hope the reader has not had eyes on the actual report.
    There is much outrage that the desired result was not delivered, regardless of what that would have meant.

    Even more unpopular opinion: How many of the RM garrison in the Governor's Residence or Moody Brook were decorated for their actions during the Argentinian invasion of the Falklands? Small unit, surrounded by larger enemy force, managed to surrender with no casualties. Naval Party 8901
    Falklands invasion veteran backs medal petition - BBC News

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  • DeV
    replied
    Originally posted by na grohmiti View Post
    There's a bit of reading, but what I am seeing is tokenism. Give Comdt Quinlan his medal and maybe the fuss will die down out of respect for him and his family.
    There is though a begrudging acceptance that the men of A Coy did not get fair treatment on their return.
    And an apology

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  • na grohmiti
    replied
    There's a bit of reading, but what I am seeing is tokenism. Give Comdt Quinlan his medal and maybe the fuss will die down out of respect for him and his family.
    There is though a begrudging acceptance that the men of A Coy did not get fair treatment on their return.

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  • DeV
    replied
    https://forum.irishmilitaryonline.co...oup-jadotville

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  • GoneToTheCanner
    replied
    Irish awards are given on the basis that the State is not embarrassed. If you do a heroic deed and leave a clean sheet, you get a gong. If you highlight failings in the DF or the State, you get a lifetime of vilification and be the last to be promoted and lots of subtle and unsubtle hints to retire. See Comdt Quinlan for details.

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  • na grohmiti
    replied
    So those who did not get medals in the last 60 years will be traumatised by the actual awarding of the medals to the people who survived the battle who have been seeking proper recognition for their actions from the Military authorities for almost 60 years.

    Or did I miss something?
    It looks as if the DF authorities fear every non-award since Jadotville will be open to a similar review. I'm thinking particularly the Crew of L.E. Aisling who were involved in the immediate aftermath and recovery operation of the Air India Crash. 4 medals (DSM)were awarded then, I believe the entire crew was put forward.

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  • DeV
    replied
    https://www.thestory.ie/2021/01/26/r...-of-survivors/

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  • ZULU
    replied
    Irish but English subtitles. Very good production so far.

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  • DeV
    replied
    Is it in Irish or English?

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  • Goldie fish
    replied
    Slightly connectec, very good programme on TG4 last night about the Irish Experience in the Congo. It is the first of a 2 part and last nights episode is being repeated on saturday @ 19.45.

    Congo 1961- Scaradh Katanga (OS & TS)

    21:30


    New Series: First of a two-parter on Ireland’s role in the Congo crisis of 1961. Filmmakers Irina Maldea and Brendan Culleton discovered in the UN archives in New York that Irish Comdt. Pat Quinlan and his men were placed in grave danger on the direct orders of the UN Secretary General when they were sent to garrison Jadotville. Cut off by white mercenary-led militia, all efforts to extract them were vetoed by UN chiefs and Quinlan was left to his own devices. Surviving veterans tell the story of what they endured. The programme also features newly discovered and restored film archives.

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  • madmark
    replied
    thanks lads

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  • danno
    replied
    Also No White Feather by Sean Foley.

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  • hptmurphy
    replied
    'The battle of Jadotville ' by Michael Whelan,very concise easy reading.

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