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  • apod
    replied
    Originally posted by spider pig View Post
    Saw new smock today. I will not be looking for one....looks horrible
    Being worn or in stores? What I am trying ascertain is if anybody is actually being issued the new kit.
    By the way the Recruits at my callsign were issued the new boonie hat. It looks shocking.Even with the nape protector removed.Too deep on the crown of the head and the brim is huge.

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  • Truck Driver
    replied
    Originally posted by Rhodes View Post
    Because one boot will not work in all climates or roles. A single type of boot will not work in temperate, extreme hot, extreme cold and jungle climates.
    The same goes for trousers and socks, the upper body can be layered.
    Extreme cold and jungle climates isn't something we have to worry about currently but hot climates is.
    There will not be a single operational boot on issue, the artillery, ARW, aircrew and naval service will get boots specific to their roles and needs, and rightly so.
    also believe that scraping the barrack boot is a bad idea and will cost more money in the long run, wearing out expensive boots
    Fully agree with this (bold)

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  • Rhodes
    replied
    Originally posted by apod View Post
    As for the Desert boots.Why would they have trialled a Light op Desert boot?The intention always was to to introduce one boot that could used both at home and overseas in all climates as a cost saving measure.Hence the "Single boot concept".No we all know that idea is bananas but that's beside the point.
    Because one boot will not work in all climates or roles. A single type of boot will not work in temperate, extreme hot, extreme cold and jungle climates.
    The same goes for trousers and socks, the upper body can be layered.
    Extreme cold and jungle climates isn't something we have to worry about currently but hot climates is.
    There will not be a single operational boot on issue, the artillery, ARW, aircrew and naval service will get boots specific to their roles and needs, and rightly so.
    I also believe that scraping the barrack boot is a bad idea and will cost more money in the long run, wearing out expensive boots quicker.

    I reckon they had their mind made up what they wanted and the trials were to rubberstamp that.
    That's my thinking too.

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  • DeV
    replied
    Originally posted by apod View Post
    First was a catalog of DoD numbers that listed the numbers for the Scouts but ALSO "Boots, Light OP,Brown" perhaps the DF bought the last batch of Light OP boots under the current contract in Brown instead of black and they are just sitting on the shelves in OCES waiting to be issued alongside the Scouts if the intention was for the Scouts to solely replace the current Operational boots.OF course know once outside of procurement seems to know and no one is telling us what the plan is.And that's despite the fact that no Light OP boot was tendered for under the current tender competition.
    .)
    The tender that was cancelled had “lightweight multi role boot brown”, could they be them?

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  • northie
    replied
    Desert Coloured Scouts were on trial last year with senior officers and ncos.
    Last edited by northie; 31 July 2019, 22:06.

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  • apod
    replied
    Originally posted by Rhodes View Post
    Yes, they were trialled, but how many of them trail boots ended up on the feet of senior NCO's who work in offices and stores and not on those doing 24hr guard duties, driving Mowags, carrying out foot patrols with the LAF? Was a light op desert (non-gore-tex) boot trialled as an alternative? I haven't heard of anyone applying polish or dubbin on them other than the last UNDOF crowed you mentioned. They are a decent boot, but they are not the solution to the overseas hot climate boot problem.
    You are sadly probably right.I also cannot get ANY answer as to what unit outside of the Recuits in the Cead Cath a couple of years back who trialled them at home??Interestingly they are on issue to some UK units and the Germans are introducing them as well. As for the Desert boots.Why would they have trialled a Light op Desert boot?The intention always was to to introduce one boot that could used both at home and overseas in all climates as a cost saving measure.Hence the "Single boot concept".No we all know that idea is bananas but that's beside the point. Funny thing is though recently I saw two things on IKON that caught my eye.

    First was a catalog of DoD numbers that listed the numbers for the Scouts but ALSO "Boots, Light OP,Brown" perhaps the DF bought the last batch of Light OP boots under the current contract in Brown instead of black and they are just sitting on the shelves in OCES waiting to be issued alongside the Scouts if the intention was for the Scouts to solely replace the current Operational boots.OF course know once outside of procurement seems to know and no one is telling us what the plan is.And that's despite the fact that no Light OP boot was tendered for under the current tender competition.

    Second was the recent pictures of the MP's taken at Exercise Guardian Angel in Spain recently.All of them were wearing The Desert Variant of the Scouts.Again despite the fact that NO Desert boot have been tendered for.

    Originally posted by DeV View Post
    Or was the feedback filed under S ?
    Knowing procurement.Probably.I reckon they had their mind made up what they wanted and the trials were to rubberstamp that.

    Originally posted by spider pig View Post
    Saw new smock today. I will not be looking for one....looks horrible
    I don't think it would have been too bad if they hadn't lined the mandarin collar with fleece.At least then you could have folded the collar down when the hood is detached and worn it similar to the French T3/4 Smock or the Danish M/11(Which incidently is the exact same as our new smock only with a few extra pockets and velcro on the sleeve pockets.)
    Attached Files
    Last edited by apod; 31 July 2019, 21:13.

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  • spider pig
    replied
    Saw new smock today. I will not be looking for one....looks horrible

    Leave a comment:


  • DeV
    replied
    Originally posted by Rhodes View Post
    Yes, they were trialled, but how many of them trail boots ended up on the feet of senior NCO's who work in offices and stores and not on those doing 24hr guard duties, driving Mowags, carrying out foot patrols with the LAF? Was a light op desert (non-gore-tex) boot trialled as an alternative? I haven't heard of anyone applying polish or dubbin on them other than the last UNDOF crowed you mentioned. They are a decent boot, but they are not the solution to the overseas hot climate boot problem.
    Or was the feedback filed under S ?

    Leave a comment:


  • Rhodes
    replied
    Originally posted by apod View Post
    I am not calling your integrity into question but I have spoken to lads who have worn them overseas in hot weather and they have reported no issues.Also were they not trialled extensively overseas before they decided to go to tender on them? According to D Ord they were.Were all those test reports BS?? Maybe the fault is the users?? Are those people putting inappropriate products on them like wax or dubbin.I am not saying they are but after hearing what the last gang that went to UNDOF were told to do with their Scouts it's not beyond the realms of possibility.
    Yes, they were trialled, but how many of them trail boots ended up on the feet of senior NCO's who work in offices and stores and not on those doing 24hr guard duties, driving Mowags, carrying out foot patrols with the LAF? Was a light op desert (non-gore-tex) boot trialled as an alternative? I haven't heard of anyone applying polish or dubbin on them other than the last UNDOF crowed you mentioned. They are a decent boot, but they are not the solution to the overseas hot climate boot problem.

    Leave a comment:


  • apod
    replied
    Take a knife and cut them open.
    Will do.Once I have a spare worn out pair.


    No contract has been awarded and none will be awarded for a few months.
    I am fully aware of where we are with the tender and the F**k up surrounding it.I am also fully aware that "Boots, Multi-role" is going to be the Haix Scout.

    You can believe the marketing sales talk all you want or you could maybe listen to the few hundred people who have been wearing them for months on end in the real world in extremely hot climates.
    I am not calling your integrity into question but I have spoken to lads who have worn them overseas in hot weather and they have reported no issues.Also were they not trialled extensively overseas before they decided to go to tender on them? According to D Ord they were.Were all those test reports BS?? Maybe the fault is the users?? Are those people putting inappropriate products on them like wax or dubbin.I am not saying they are but after hearing what the last gang that went to UNDOF were told to do with their Scouts it's not beyond the realms of possibility.

    It was done before, up until 2013. 600-700 pairs of light Op desert boots a year isn't going to break the budget considering how much is being wasted on things like naval DPM and thousands of t-shirts that will never be worn, plus thousands of perfectly serviceable pairs of black Haix's and Magnums that will have to be handed-in in exchange for a brown pair on a given date.
    Yeah.Before the bottom fell out of the clothing Budget.I agree we should have the right kit for the right climate but seeing as cost cutting seems to be current driving force for subhead managers that's where we are and I don't see it getting better anytime soon.I totally agree that Naval DPM is a total vanity project and a waste of money.I also totally agree that there need to be some clarity about boot issues at the moment otherwise we could end up in a situation where someone is issued a pair of Black boots and a week later the Brown comes in and they are forbidden to wear them.Good return on the taxpayers money there.Either that or we are heading to Mixed dress on parade and there is no way the ADJT's and BSM's will wear that.


    D-Ord has an impossible task given the current budget constraints - the Haix Scout is a compromise that is better than what we have to date, but its not the fix required.
    Yet they are fritting money away on stupid shit such as lopsided DPM shirts,Naval DPM to blend in with.....nothing and T-Shirts that are the wrong size.

    Originally posted by koppiteal View Post
    Are there any plans to issue RDF UBACS We wear body armour for nearly everything now. Last week was on an ex with PDF which was complete with gsba and the rdf were in shirts and armour which is very uncomfortable when it gets sweaty.
    For these types of exercises we should have them
    +1 on that. UBACS are considered PPE and while perhaps there is not a requirement for the RDF to be issued the same amount of them per soldier,or as often, as the PDF due to the amount of use they would get they should 100% be on the issue scale.

    Originally posted by Rhodes View Post
    UBACS are only being issued for overseas. Most people in the Army who haven't been overseas in the last few years don't have them, if they request one they get told overseas issue only. So I'd say it's very unlikely the RDF will get them.
    Originally posted by northie View Post
    Training and ops at home are carried out in CBA.

    UBACS only issued for overseas service.
    UBACS are on the general issue scale for all Army Line personnel.Not just for overseas.Must be a 2BDE thing.1 BDE Pers are being issued them as requested.Granted Overseas Pers get priority during the form up period but outside of that they ARE being issued.

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  • northie
    replied
    Originally posted by ropebag View Post
    So is body armour only issued for overseas tasks, or is that just different?
    Training and ops at home are carried out in CBA.

    UBACS only issued for overseas service.

    Leave a comment:


  • ropebag
    replied
    So is body armour only issued for overseas tasks, or is that just different?

    Leave a comment:


  • koppiteal
    replied
    Ah fair enough.
    Looks like itll be a while so

    Leave a comment:


  • Rhodes
    replied
    UBACS are only being issued for overseas. Most people in the Army who haven't been overseas in the last few years don't have them, if they request one they get told overseas issue only. So I'd say it's very unlikely the RDF will get them.

    Leave a comment:


  • koppiteal
    replied
    Are there any plans to issue RDF UBACS We wear body armour for nearly everything now. Last week was on an ex with PDF which was complete with gsba and the rdf were in shirts and armour which is very uncomfortable when it gets sweaty.
    For these types of exercises we should have them

    Leave a comment:

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